HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Notices

I envy the Flyers

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-31-2007, 08:08 AM
  #76
dave4
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 637
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
It's amazing that that's the case isn't it? If Clarke had bothered to ever truly address the goaltending situation, they would have won at least one Cup over the past 10 years I have to believe.
Forsberg for Montoya. Goaltending issue resolved.

dave4 is offline  
Old
01-31-2007, 08:10 AM
  #77
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 29,800
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by dave4 View Post
Forsberg for Montoya. Goaltending issue resolved.
Sure. Of course I don't make that trade.

__________________
SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline  
Old
01-31-2007, 08:16 AM
  #78
GKJ
Global Moderator
Entertainment
 
GKJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Do not trade plz
Country: United States
Posts: 109,882
vCash: 5792
Quote:
Originally Posted by dave4 View Post
We have a general manager who has the worst won-loss record (196-258) of any Ranger GM in at least the last 40 years, and hasn't even been able to win ONE playoff game! Not one!!!

Sather also wasn't allowed by Dolan to run the team the way he wanted to until Dolan finally realized what he was doing wasn't working. When Sather was afforded that opportunity, it turned the franchise around.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway
They still need a goalie. Nitty is not the answer.
How would you know that? He hasn't even been given a true chance on a team that isn't a steaming pile of crap. He routinely has played games where he has been blitzed, a defense that consistently gave up 35+ shots a night. I've never heard of a goalie who won consistently under these circumstances. Niitty is a guy who has won at everything he's ever done and should and will get that opportunity here. Running around the league trying to find a #1 goalie no one wants to give up apparently was never the answer, except when Clarke passed on Curtis Joseph, so what is? Drafting one? We drafted at least 3 goalies within the first 40 picks in the draft in the last 12 years, who were each deemed the future goalie of the team, and they're all currently AHL goalies (Boucher is actually with the Blackhawks, but let's not sugarcoat here, he sucks)

GKJ is offline  
Old
01-31-2007, 08:28 AM
  #79
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 29,800
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson 514 View Post
Sather also wasn't allowed by Dolan to run the team the way he wanted to until Dolan finally realized what he was doing wasn't working. When Sather was afforded that opportunity, it turned the franchise around.




How would you know that? He hasn't even been given a true chance on a team that isn't a steaming pile of crap. Niitty is a guy who has won at everything he's ever done and should and will get that opportunity here. Running around the league trying to find a #1 goalie no one wants to give up was never the answer, except when Clarke passed on Curtis Joseph.
1) I don't believe that for a second. Sather is one of most proud (arogant) people in the game. He left Edmonton because of meddling ownership. Are we really supposed to believe that the architect of one of the greatest dynasties in hockey history is taking orders from Jim Dolan on how to run a team?

2) I don't know that he's not the answer. It's my opinion. But the fact that he can't steal the starting job from Esche is not a good sign. It just seems that the Flyers are in the same rut of having a guy who is "good enough" in net (although I know this year is different) along the lines of Snow, Beezer, Boucher, Hacket, Cechmanek, Hextall, and Burke.

SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline  
Old
01-31-2007, 08:45 AM
  #80
dave4
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 637
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Sure. Of course I don't make that trade.
Unfortunately you're not the GM. The Edmonton Genius is.

dave4 is offline  
Old
01-31-2007, 08:47 AM
  #81
dave4
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 637
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
1) I don't believe that for a second. Sather is one of most proud (arogant) people in the game. He left Edmonton because of meddling ownership. Are we really supposed to believe that the architect of one of the greatest dynasties in hockey history is taking orders from Jim Dolan on how to run a team?
I don't think Dolan even pays attention to the hockey team. Basketball yes, hockey no.

dave4 is offline  
Old
01-31-2007, 08:52 AM
  #82
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 29,800
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by dave4 View Post
Unfortunately you're not the GM.
I'll take "Things That Have Never Been Said on This Board" for 800, Alex.

SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline  
Old
01-31-2007, 09:19 AM
  #83
dave4
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 637
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
I'll take "Things That Have Never Been Said on This Board" for 800, Alex.

dave4 is offline  
Old
01-31-2007, 10:01 AM
  #84
Ola
Registered User
 
Ola's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Sweden
Country: Sweden
Posts: 17,436
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaktus View Post
Hatcher and Rathje I agree, maybe even Calder (even know he started to play better while Handzus is out this year) but whats wrong with Knuble, Sanderson, Umberger, and picking up Afanasenkov off waivers?
Id like to add Gauthier too.

If you look at what makes teams successful in the NHL today, nobody of thoose guys brings any of it.

Like smarts, high overall skill level, puckmovement, speed and stuff like that.

If it were only Umberger, or only Knuble, or only Afanasenko, or only Hatcher, or only Rathjer or only Gauthier I could live with it. But looking at all their actions as a group, its ugly.

But all their veterans are stiffs, if you want to get a hold of size and attitude, thats really cheap these days, Philly got a helluva lot of money tied up in 7-8 players who are really bad fits in the new game. Like they sign a young prospect in the off season from us, Nasty Nate Guenin... Callahan was a UFA too, though they opted to offer Nate a really good contract.

Who do they pick up on waivers, one of the least talented Russians in the world playing hockey, almost...

Stevie Downie was maybe not a bad pick, but it also illustrates perfectly what they are looking for.

Sure Forsberg are struggling. But they could end up with one of the worst point totals in a long time in the NHL. Not only do they have big flaws, but the system they try to play is beyond horrible. Who on earth brought in that guy behind their bench and who on earth gave him a 3 year contract???

With all the attention NYI management have got, everything they have done since the lockout are on par, if not worse, then what we saw here in NY for a while.

If you look at how that team were constructed gooing into this summer you don't sign Dennis Gauthier and Geoff Sandersson. You go after guys like Pettri Nummelin and Lubos Bartecko.

Ola is offline  
Old
01-31-2007, 10:16 AM
  #85
John Flyers Fan
Registered User
 
John Flyers Fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: United States
Posts: 22,345
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by graveyardshift View Post
Flyers are not in the position to hog wild in the off season on the market

they have a few bad contracts on the d
Depending on who is moved at the deadline, the Flyers will have at least $20 million, and quite possibly as much as $28 million to spend this summer.

Only the Hatcher contract is a poor one, and even that can be easily rectified if need be.

John Flyers Fan is offline  
Old
01-31-2007, 10:28 AM
  #86
chosen
Registered User
 
chosen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,616
vCash: 500
I envy Penguins fans.

chosen is offline  
Old
01-31-2007, 10:34 AM
  #87
chosen
Registered User
 
chosen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,616
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
1) I don't believe that for a second. Sather is one of most proud (arogant) people in the game. He left Edmonton because of meddling ownership. Are we really supposed to believe that the architect of one of the greatest dynasties in hockey history is taking orders from Jim Dolan on how to run a team?.
He wasn't the architect. He drafted some of the players but having kids named Gretzky and Messier dumped in your lap kind of played a role in the dynasty.

chosen is offline  
Old
01-31-2007, 11:05 AM
  #88
Kaktus*
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: PA
Posts: 22,389
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ola View Post
Id like to add Gauthier too.
Rathje will retire.
I am not ready to turn the page on Gauthier. Is he a bust now?
I am sorry.. why is Umberger a bust?
What did the Flyers lose when they picked up Afanasenkov? paying like 300K..
I mean much better move then picking up Orr..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ola View Post
But all their veterans are stiffs, if you want to get a hold of size and attitude, thats really cheap these days, Philly got a helluva lot of money tied up in 7-8 players who are really bad fits in the new game. Like they sign a young prospect in the off season from us, Nasty Nate Guenin... Callahan was a UFA too, though they opted to offer Nate a really good contract.
Hatchers contract is a problem. I do not disagree. Name two more players.
Nasty Nate Guenin is getting ice time in NHL now, it does not mean he is solid NHL player but he is playing.. Flyers have Giroux and Ruzicka on RW. D-man is/was priority.

Lets wait and see what NYR will do, what kind of trades NYR will make, who they will give up and how far NYR will go.


Last edited by Kaktus*: 01-31-2007 at 11:34 AM.
Kaktus* is offline  
Old
01-31-2007, 10:01 PM
  #89
True Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 15,006
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ola View Post
We are talking about Sanderson, we are talking about Knuble ,Kyle Calder, RJ Umberger and Afanasenko. Thoose trades/signings must orign in allot more then just the GM, their entire staff must be completly clueless when it comes to how to play the game with the new rules.
Calder may be having a bad year, but he should not be lumped into that group. And what's wrong with Umberger?
Quote:
How on earth could they trade Hanzus for Kyle Calder?
Ad the time, it seemed like a good trade and it still ultimately may turn out that way.

True Blue is offline  
Old
01-31-2007, 10:12 PM
  #90
GKJ
Global Moderator
Entertainment
 
GKJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Do not trade plz
Country: United States
Posts: 109,882
vCash: 5792
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
1) I don't believe that for a second. Sather is one of most proud (arogant) people in the game. He left Edmonton because of meddling ownership. Are we really supposed to believe that the architect of one of the greatest dynasties in hockey history is taking orders from Jim Dolan on how to run a team?

2) I don't know that he's not the answer. It's my opinion. But the fact that he can't steal the starting job from Esche is not a good sign. It just seems that the Flyers are in the same rut of having a guy who is "good enough" in net (although I know this year is different) along the lines of Snow, Beezer, Boucher, Hacket, Cechmanek, Hextall, and Burke.

1) When Sather finally put away the checkbook and started to actually build a team, he didn't do half bad considering where the Rangers were this time in 2004.

2) There have been plenty of guys who have been "good enough" and have won. In this era of the league, unless you're Martin Brodeur, you've either proved nothing, you're Miikka Kiprusoff or you're over the hill (Belfour and Hasek). Carolina won the Stanley Cup with their backup goaltender.

GKJ is offline  
Old
02-01-2007, 01:13 AM
  #91
Radek27
Registered User
 
Radek27's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 5,145
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Radek27
Gauthier is a flat out scary hitting defender, he would have a spot on my team anyday.

Radek27 is offline  
Old
02-01-2007, 06:08 AM
  #92
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 29,800
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson 514 View Post
1) When Sather finally put away the checkbook and started to actually build a team, he didn't do half bad considering where the Rangers were this time in 2004.

2) There have been plenty of guys who have been "good enough" and have won. In this era of the league, unless you're Martin Brodeur, you've either proved nothing, you're Miikka Kiprusoff or you're over the hill (Belfour and Hasek). Carolina won the Stanley Cup with their backup goaltender.
1) He was forced to put down the checkbook because there was a salary cap.

2) I disagree that plenty of guys have won who are good enough. And regardless over the period of over a decade, Clarke never once made getting a top notch goalie a priority.

SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline  
Old
02-01-2007, 06:11 AM
  #93
RangerBoy
#freejtmiller
 
RangerBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 31,736
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
Gauthier is a flat out scary hitting defender, he would have a spot on my team anyday.
He is a cheap shot thug.Take off the mask if you want to run around cheap shotting other players.Just like Ulf Samuelsson and Claude Lemiuex

RangerBoy is offline  
Old
02-01-2007, 03:54 PM
  #94
Radek27
Registered User
 
Radek27's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 5,145
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Radek27
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
He is a cheap shot thug.Take off the mask if you want to run around cheap shotting other players.Just like Ulf Samuelsson and Claude Lemiuex
What do u mean by take off the mask? I have seen him play more than a few times and I don't remember him taking any cheap shots in the games I seen. I just remember thinking that it looked like it hurt when he hits. He is a player I notice right away in games because of how hard he hits. If he was just a cheap shot thug he wouldn't get the ice time he gets.

Radek27 is offline  
Old
02-01-2007, 11:52 PM
  #95
GKJ
Global Moderator
Entertainment
 
GKJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Do not trade plz
Country: United States
Posts: 109,882
vCash: 5792
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
1) He was forced to put down the checkbook because there was a salary cap.

2) I disagree that plenty of guys have won who are good enough. And regardless over the period of over a decade, Clarke never once made getting a top notch goalie a priority.
1) Sather put away that checkbook when he had the firesale in 2004. The plan was clear at that point was that the Rangers weren't going to throw money around, regardless of the salary cap.

2) I never said Clarke did make a goalie a priority, but looking at some of the #1 goalies in the league, I'm not staying up at night hoping the Flyers are head over heels for any of them. The only things Clarke really did was bring in a 2nd liner for Rod Brind'Amour every year and trade for a 5th defenseman and hope he was better (that only worked in 2004). He never built a team around Lindros, he wanted Lindros and it was obvious after 2001 when we had guys like Daymond Langkow (pre Calgary) on our top line once Keith Primeau got hurt (and came back and played on a partially torn ACL).

GKJ is offline  
Old
02-02-2007, 07:41 AM
  #96
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 29,800
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson 514 View Post
1) Sather put away that checkbook when he had the firesale in 2004. The plan was clear at that point was that the Rangers weren't going to throw money around, regardless of the salary cap.

2) I never said Clarke did make a goalie a priority, but looking at some of the #1 goalies in the league, I'm not staying up at night hoping the Flyers are head over heels for any of them. The only things Clarke really did was bring in a 2nd liner for Rod Brind'Amour every year and trade for a 5th defenseman and hope he was better (that only worked in 2004). He never built a team around Lindros, he wanted Lindros and it was obvious after 2001 when we had guys like Daymond Langkow (pre Calgary) on our top line once Keith Primeau got hurt (and came back and played on a partially torn ACL).
1) I'm not sure that was the idea at all. He had already traded for Jagr. He decided not to buy out Kasparaitis, send Straka, Nylander and Malik.

Sather got lucky. With the lost season coming on the heels of his great purge he was able to have back-to-back drafts which combined with his fire sale give a very distinct impression that he put the checkbook away. But the mindset has not changed all that much.

2) My only point is if Clarke had ever truly addressed the goaltending situation, I believe they would have won at least one Cup in the last decade.

SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline  
Old
02-02-2007, 08:04 AM
  #97
GKJ
Global Moderator
Entertainment
 
GKJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Do not trade plz
Country: United States
Posts: 109,882
vCash: 5792
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
1) I'm not sure that was the idea at all. He had already traded for Jagr. He decided not to buy out Kasparaitis, send Straka, Nylander and Malik.

Sather got lucky. With the lost season coming on the heels of his great purge he was able to have back-to-back drafts which combined with his fire sale give a very distinct impression that he put the checkbook away. But the mindset has not changed all that much.

2) My only point is if Clarke had ever truly addressed the goaltending situation, I believe they would have won at least one Cup in the last decade.
1) He was never going to get rid of Jagr because he still had a huge contract at the time and would have gotten stuck paying a lot for almost nothing.

2) Absolutely.

GKJ is offline  
Old
02-02-2007, 10:01 AM
  #98
Bluenote13
Believe In Henke
 
Bluenote13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: BKLYN, NYC
Posts: 23,636
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
1) I'm not sure that was the idea at all. He had already traded for Jagr. He decided not to buy out Kasparaitis, send Straka, Nylander and Malik.

Sather got lucky. With the lost season coming on the heels of his great purge he was able to have back-to-back drafts which combined with his fire sale give a very distinct impression that he put the checkbook away. But the mindset has not changed all that much.

2) My only point is if Clarke had ever truly addressed the goaltending situation, I believe they would have won at least one Cup in the last decade.
Thats what I never understood about Clarke. He'd go out and get the exact type of forward or D-man his teams were in need of, but played it cheap when it came to goalies!? Awful....

Bluenote13 is offline  
Old
02-02-2007, 10:28 AM
  #99
John Flyers Fan
Registered User
 
John Flyers Fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: United States
Posts: 22,345
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
Thats what I never understood about Clarke. He'd go out and get the exact type of forward or D-man his teams were in need of, but played it cheap when it came to goalies!? Awful....
The only time he had a real choice was his selection of Vanbiesbrouck over CuJo (who has never won anything). His first choice at the time was Richter, who wouldn't leave NY.


None of the elite Cup winning goalies of the time (Roy, Brodeur, Belfour or Hasek) were ever available.

John Flyers Fan is offline  
Old
02-02-2007, 10:46 AM
  #100
Bluenote13
Believe In Henke
 
Bluenote13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: BKLYN, NYC
Posts: 23,636
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan View Post
The only time he had a real choice was his selection of Vanbiesbrouck over CuJo (who has never won anything). His first choice at the time was Richter, who wouldn't leave NY.


None of the elite Cup winning goalies of the time (Roy, Brodeur, Belfour or Hasek) were ever available.
Belfour was available

Bluenote13 is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:12 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.