HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Trade Thread XVIII: Brace Yourselves. Friday Is Coming.

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-06-2014, 09:33 AM
  #76
NYR Viper
Moderator
 
NYR Viper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: PA
Country: United States
Posts: 28,368
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYGBleedBlueNYR View Post
Cally/Bartlett/Sather

Are also holding up the rest of the team's decisions.

This needs to end.
This is the other reason I want this to end before the Olympic break. They need to figure out what they are doing with the rest of their free agents. If Callahan won't lower his demands move him. Work on Girardi over the break. Show him you mean business and point towards Callahan. They can't let them walk for nothing.

Stralman. Moore. Boyle. Pouliot. What's the plan?

NYR Viper is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 09:35 AM
  #77
NYR Viper
Moderator
 
NYR Viper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: PA
Country: United States
Posts: 28,368
vCash: 500
Quote:
Bruce Garrioch ‏@SunGarrioch 2m
Teams are trying to deal. The fact players are paid for 17 days during the Olympics may stand in the way. #NHL
Makes sense

NYR Viper is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 09:39 AM
  #78
Vitto79
Registered User
 
Vitto79's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Sarnia
Country: Canada
Posts: 16,455
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR Viper View Post
Makes sense
Yea only deals are likely clise to equal salary ones no cap dumps

Vitto79 is online now  
Old
02-06-2014, 09:40 AM
  #79
JPP4121
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 398
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alien Valuating View Post
RB, you don't think the NHL places hedges to protect themselves from these currency swings? For such a large business that deals in multiple currencies I would be absolutely shocked if they didn't have a system in place to manage that risk.

For those who don't understand how this would work, the NHL would sell Canadian currency forward and buy USD on the date that they are set to receive the Canadian dollars. That way they lock themselves in at the current rate (minus forward points), and are completely protected from movement in currency. Pretty much all large businesses that deal in foreign currency operate this way, and I doubt that the NHL would expose themselves to this potential 500m loss (from 5.2B to 4.7B).
Thank you for taking the time to post the mechanicals of this to us. I certainly didn't know or understand it

JPP4121 is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 09:41 AM
  #80
NYR Viper
Moderator
 
NYR Viper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: PA
Country: United States
Posts: 28,368
vCash: 500
Quote:
Andrew Gross ‏@AGrossRecord 1m
All Rangers including Callahan on ice for morning skate. They host Oilers tonight.
Nothing must be imminent

NYR Viper is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 09:47 AM
  #81
Wamsutta
I'm Glen Sather IRL
 
Wamsutta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Connecticut
Country: United States
Posts: 328
vCash: 500
This is just going to drag on, isn't it.

Wamsutta is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 09:50 AM
  #82
RangerBoy
#freejtmiller
 
RangerBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 31,851
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alien Valuating View Post
RB, you don't think the NHL places hedges to protect themselves from these currency swings? For such a large business that deals in multiple currencies I would be absolutely shocked if they didn't have a system in place to manage that risk.

For those who don't understand how this would work, the NHL would sell Canadian currency forward and buy USD on the date that they are set to receive the Canadian dollars. That way they lock themselves in at the current rate (minus forward points), and are completely protected from movement in currency. Pretty much all large businesses that deal in foreign currency operate this way, and I doubt that the NHL would expose themselves to this potential 500m loss (from 5.2B to 4.7B).
Then someone should inform the Canadian media which has been reporting 2 NHL cap guys believe the currency drop will result in the upper limit dropping $1M-$1.5M and it will result in a $50M-$60M exchange loss.

RangerBoy is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 09:53 AM
  #83
AHB
Registered User
 
AHB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 3,682
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by slipknottin View Post
Cally is second on the team in ES minutes among forwards. He's 6th in Pk minutes. He's 7th in PP minutes...
True, but he never sees the ice on the PP anymore. Being 6th in PK Minutes.....is pretty telling, considering there are usually 8 guys on the PK that are heavily relied on.

And with all those minutes, this is arguably his most ineffective season since he began his career here.

Regardless, I don't care if he was playing top minutes in every category, he is not worth near 7 million. I'm not happy with us even offering him 6. I'd be OK with 25 over 5 and that's my max.

AHB is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 09:53 AM
  #84
Mikos87
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 1,772
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alien Valuating View Post
RB, you don't think the NHL places hedges to protect themselves from these currency swings? For such a large business that deals in multiple currencies I would be absolutely shocked if they didn't have a system in place to manage that risk.

For those who don't understand how this would work, the NHL would sell Canadian currency forward and buy USD on the date that they are set to receive the Canadian dollars. That way they lock themselves in at the current rate (minus forward points), and are completely protected from movement in currency. Pretty much all large businesses that deal in foreign currency operate this way, and I doubt that the NHL would expose themselves to this potential 500m loss (from 5.2B to 4.7B).
Yes. Any time there is international business, any competent organization will account for the currency exchange.

Mikos87 is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 09:54 AM
  #85
Punxrocknyc19*
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 10,233
vCash: 500
if the Rangers cant get a deal for Jamie McGinn from the Avs, how about Matt Beleksey from the Ducks???

Punxrocknyc19* is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 09:57 AM
  #86
BrooklynRangersFan
Change is good.
 
BrooklynRangersFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Brooklyn of course
Country: United States
Posts: 10,221
vCash: 500
Here's what I think Cally is worth, given his style of play, his age, his role, his level of scoring and, yes, his intangibles:

5 yrs x $5.0MM
4 yrs x $5.5MM
3 yrs x $6.0MM

(To me, anything longer doesn't make sense - and I'm sure no player hitting UFA, outside of the very fringe players or the very old ones, would consider anything shorter.)

But you know what? He's worth more dollars and more term to some teams. For example, if I'm the Oilers, I'd overpay to get his leadership there - and know he's locked in and not going to flee somewhere warmer in a year or two. Probably the same for Buffalo, especially given the hometown boy angle.

Furthermore - and this has been my stance since before we knew what his ridiculous contract demands were going to be - even if you were able to get him to sign one of the deals above, he'd still be worth more to the Rangers as a trade chip.

I won't make the mistake of calling him a 3rd line RW, because people get hung up on that. But it's clear that he's the 3rd most important RW on the team behind Nash and MZA. It's also clear that we have more options to replace a RW (some of whom may prove to be very good players in their own right) than nearly any other position on the roster.

Not only is it terrible asset management to let an asset walk for free, it is terrible asset management to have a glut of both talent and cap allocation in one position, especially one of the least important and easiest to fill positions on the roster. Cally needs to be moved both to bring back assets that hopefully can help address other needs and/or backfill the pipeline AND he needs to be moved to help rationalize the cap allocation on this roster. IMO there is almost no scenario where it does not make sense to move him.



(I think there is also incentive to move Girardi for similar reasons - plus the added fact that he seems less suited for AV's style of play than most on the roster. However, I'm less adamant about that one because 1) his demands seem more reasonable, 2) he's a legit first pair RD, even if his skills aren't a perfect for AV and 3) first pair RD is a lot harder position to fill than middle six RW.)

BrooklynRangersFan is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 09:58 AM
  #87
boyle2boyle
HFBoards Sponsor
 
boyle2boyle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Queens via London
Posts: 758
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikos87 View Post
Yes. Any time there is international business, any competent organization will account for the currency exchange.
That might be the key word here

But I just seriously doubt the NHL would be dumb enough to drop the ball on this one. Maybe the media guys don't have all the inside financial information?

boyle2boyle is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 10:00 AM
  #88
RGY
(Jagr68NYR94Leetch)
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Long Island, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 8,134
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Punxrocknyc19 View Post
if the Rangers cant get a deal for Jamie McGinn from the Avs, how about Matt Beleksey from the Ducks???
Callahan for Beleksey would be a terrible trade off

RGY is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 10:02 AM
  #89
Mikos87
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 1,772
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alien Valuating View Post
That might be the key word here

But I just seriously doubt the NHL would be dumb enough to drop the ball on this one. Maybe the media guys don't have all the inside financial information?
Bingo. I'm not an accountant but have to use it to run my business. Anytime I've done business internationally, it has always been in $USD, with the currency rate decided on the day and date of the agreement. Some agree on the delivery date. All different modes of operation.

The CDN going down hurts Rogers more than anyone else. I guess a 4c difference in inflation creates for some gaudy headlines when the its extrapolated over a $5.2B CDN deal.

Mikos87 is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 10:10 AM
  #90
NYR Viper
Moderator
 
NYR Viper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: PA
Country: United States
Posts: 28,368
vCash: 500
The other reason the Rangers are most likely looking at Stewart is because he is a very good net front presence on the PP. That is Callahan's bread and butter.

Stewart is good for 25 goals and 50-55 points. RW. 26 years old. Great net front presence

Callahan is good for 25 goals and 50-55 points. RW. 29 years old. Above average net front presence. Great PKer. Great 2-way forward.

The rest of the Stewart package would need to make up for the added abilities for Callahan.

NYR Viper is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 10:22 AM
  #91
GAGLine
Registered User
 
GAGLine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 9,176
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alien Valuating View Post
RB, you don't think the NHL places hedges to protect themselves from these currency swings? For such a large business that deals in multiple currencies I would be absolutely shocked if they didn't have a system in place to manage that risk.

For those who don't understand how this would work, the NHL would sell Canadian currency forward and buy USD on the date that they are set to receive the Canadian dollars. That way they lock themselves in at the current rate (minus forward points), and are completely protected from movement in currency. Pretty much all large businesses that deal in foreign currency operate this way, and I doubt that the NHL would expose themselves to this potential 500m loss (from 5.2B to 4.7B).
The problem is that the NHL doesn't get that money all up front. It's a 12 year deal. The money will be paid out over that term. They can't exchange money that RBC hasn't given them yet.

GAGLine is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 10:23 AM
  #92
GAGLine
Registered User
 
GAGLine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 9,176
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR Viper View Post
Makes sense
We can easily offset that 17 days by way of retaining salary.

GAGLine is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 10:30 AM
  #93
Punxrocknyc19*
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 10,233
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RGY View Post
Callahan for Beleksey would be a terrible trade off
Umm did I ever say Callahan for Berkeley? No I didn't. I just thought Beleksey as another option if they can't get McGinn. Same type of player

Punxrocknyc19* is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 10:37 AM
  #94
RangerBoy
#freejtmiller
 
RangerBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 31,851
vCash: 500
The players are putting 14% of their salaries in escrow. They are guaranteed 50%. Not a penny more. They get paid in US funds. The NHL takes in less revenue because of the exchange rate. Who is giving back $? The players. Why aren't they protected against a falling dollar? Glenn Healy was talking about this topic on the Hotstove last Saturday. A penny drop is worth a lot of money.

RangerBoy is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 10:38 AM
  #95
RangerBoy
#freejtmiller
 
RangerBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 31,851
vCash: 500
From: @JSportsnet
Sent: Feb 6, 2014 11:37a

Quick conversation with Callahan's agent. Say he plans on talking to Sather today, with the hopes of finding some "common ground".

sent via web
On Twitter: http://twitter.com/JSportsnet/status/431466801927438336

RangerBoy is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 10:41 AM
  #96
SouthJerseyRanger
Registered User
 
SouthJerseyRanger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Country: United States
Posts: 1,065
vCash: 500
I think with the way the Rangers are playing, there is a compromise to be made and a desire to keep important parts of the team intact. Therefore, a 6yr/$36million deal seems like the logical outcome. Callahan will be 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, and 34 years of age at the start of the seasons covered by that contract. If the Rangers are willing to go 5 yrs, which its seems like there are, then I don't think there is anyway they let such a drastic thing happen to this year's squad over a single year, especially when they are looking like serious contenders.

SouthJerseyRanger is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 10:41 AM
  #97
RangerBoy
#freejtmiller
 
RangerBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 31,851
vCash: 500
Common ground. 7 years. $47M-$48M. Where is the common ground there? The Rangers are willing to give Callahan 5 years and $30M which is already too rich for him.

RangerBoy is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 10:43 AM
  #98
RangerBoy
#freejtmiller
 
RangerBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 31,851
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthJerseyRanger View Post
I think with the way the Rangers are playing, there is a compromise to be made and a desire to keep important parts of the team intact. Therefore, a 6yr/$36million deal seems like the logical outcome. Callahan will be 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, and 34 years of age at the start of the seasons covered by that contract. If the Rangers are willing to go 5 yrs, which its seems like there are, then I don't think there is anyway they let such a drastic thing happen to this year's squad over a single year, especially when they are looking like serious contenders.
Serious contenders?

RangerBoy is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 10:45 AM
  #99
boyle2boyle
HFBoards Sponsor
 
boyle2boyle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Queens via London
Posts: 758
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GAGLine View Post
The problem is that the NHL doesn't get that money all up front. It's a 12 year deal. The money will be paid out over that term. They can't exchange money that RBC hasn't given them yet.
This is just even more reason to hedge. You can hedge forward to any date, you just buy or sell the currency now so that you get the opposite currency impact later.

For example, if the NHL sold an equivalent amount of Canadian dollars and bought USD forward at the time of the deal, to settle at different times over the next 12 years, on each of the settlement dates they would receive an equal amount of money to the loss that they're incurring. If the amount of Canadian dollars they're receiving next year has devalued by $5m for example, they made the opposite transaction (buying US dollars for an equivalent amount) at the time of the deal, so they would lose $5m on the deal and gain $5m on the trade they placed. No currency impact.

Source: I work for a company that deals in many currencies, and placing trades like this to minimize currency impact is part of my job.

boyle2boyle is offline  
Old
02-06-2014, 10:46 AM
  #100
Trxjw
Retired.
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Land of no calls..
Country: United States
Posts: 16,484
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR Viper View Post
The other reason the Rangers are most likely looking at Stewart is because he is a very good net front presence on the PP. That is Callahan's bread and butter.

Stewart is good for 25 goals and 50-55 points. RW. 26 years old. Great net front presence

Callahan is good for 25 goals and 50-55 points. RW. 29 years old. Above average net front presence. Great PKer. Great 2-way forward.

The rest of the Stewart package would need to make up for the added abilities for Callahan.
Not necessarily. When you look at what Callahan brings outside of scoring, some of those things are covered already. We have several PKing forwards already. The "glue" that Callahan brings is what is really hard to replace. You're not going to get a born leader in the deal for him. That will be tough to replace, and you just can't predict how the team will react to it.

When TSN first broke the news about Callahan, McKenzie said the Rangers don't fancy themselves real contenders this year. Has that changed? Was it just a smoke screen to justify leaking the possibility of trading Callahan and/or Girardi? While it's possible that removing Callahan right now could torpedo the season, there's also a chance that Stewart could replace a lot of what Callahan brings on the ice in terms of scoring and physicality. If the team can ride the high of winning games, it might allow them to replace one with the other and keep moving forward towards the playoffs.

Everytime we hear Stewart brought up, it's made clear that he would be part of a package for Callahan. I'm very curious to know just how significant that package could be. It's entirely possible that the Blues view Stewart as more of a salary dump than a key part of the deal.

Trxjw is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:27 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.