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Official GDT February 6: NY Rangers at New Jersey Devils, 7:30p MSG

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Old
02-06-2007, 10:52 PM
  #701
DontStaal
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inferno272 View Post
btw, you guys want something to be ticked about?

how about the non call on the flying elbow into Pruchas face?

That was awful.
I agree, but it looked like the ref had a bad angle of it

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02-06-2007, 10:53 PM
  #702
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Listen, I almost went over my neighbors house and killed his loud pets in anger after this loss but we played a real good game. I know the extra point at this time of the season and in our position is huge but I was impressed. Dominated for most of the game. Brodeur was awesome. Avery was impressive even though it's his first game. i hope this keeps up with him.

I would've went with Cullen over Prucha who was still probably seeing birdies.

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02-06-2007, 10:53 PM
  #703
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Don't care how well we played.

We NEEDED two points. 4 on 3 in overtime against a team that you're not going to beat in the standings means you can take all the risks you want to score.

We blew it.

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02-06-2007, 10:53 PM
  #704
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dedalus View Post
He faced 21 shots to Brodeur's 30.

Lundqvist at his best from last year would have taken this game from Brodeur.
Perhaps but Jagr would have had 3 pts instead on 1...thats a big part of that equation

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02-06-2007, 10:54 PM
  #705
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We shouldn't lose when we only give up 21 shots, to what, 30?

jeez. Bad luck?

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02-06-2007, 10:54 PM
  #706
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
A phenominal mix? They have two guys who can score consistently. One's injured and one is old. They have two guys who are elite passers who too often pass when they should shoot. They have a young sniper who has struggled this year and is an injury ready to happen (think Tony Granato).

The coach an only work with what he has. I guess he gets no credit for last season. Because he's by far the biggest problem this season.
Yes a phenomenal mix. i said this to you yesterday right here:
http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=340721&page=8

Quote:
Going into this season we had:

a goalie coming off of one of the best rookie seasons in Rangers History.

a guy who broke the Rangers goal scoring record, and points record.

a rookie who broke the rangers rookie record for pp goals, and who had 30 goals in less than a full seasons worth of games.

a guy coming off of a 40 goal season

2 guys coming fresh off of stanley cup wins.

And you DONT blame the coach? Renneys been given a HECK of a lot more than 90% of the coaches in the NHL, and is making just about the least you can make of it.

Sorry, Renney is probably the biggest reason weve missed the playoffs this year.
you have to look at what he was given to start with, and how it ended up, not just look at what happened and then blame all the players.

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02-06-2007, 10:55 PM
  #707
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Originally Posted by MisterUnspoken View Post
inferno here's a stat for you: Marcel Hossa 1/1 vs Brodeur in the shootout. That's 100%. Why wasn't he in there?

Stats are bull. Face it Cullen hasn't hit the broad side of a barn in a amonth. We are better off letting Rachunek take penalty shots then Cullen. With that said that wasn't the main problem this game. Scoring remains a concern. Where is the top line?
ill say it again.

looking at the raw data, i cant fault renney for putting cullen in there.

if you want to, thats your business, but to me, theres nothing wrong with putting your best shooter statistically into the game.

Cullens problem isnt finishing at all, when he gets decent chances, he tends to hit the net, and the back of the net, the problem is hes been so weak on his skates, hes almost always on his back before the puck even gets there.

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02-06-2007, 10:56 PM
  #708
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
OK. What system would you play? And if the team is full of retards who can't make plays (your words, not mine) how is that the coach's fault?

Using Cullen is an isolated incident. If Shanny or Nylander scores you have found something else to blame him for. Too easy to kill the coach. Look at the larger picture.

To date under this GM, we have called for Low, Trottier and Sather to be fired. At what point is the problem larger than the coach? At least Renney has had a team go to the playoffs.

I already said I'm not the one qualified to make the decisions. I just expect someone who is to make the right ones.


My argument was to point out that it isnt all his fault which is why I pointed out his flaws and the individual ones.


This is the first time I've opened my mouth about Renneyb/c i really didnt like that decision


If you're saying Sather should be fired and is most at fault, I could agree

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02-06-2007, 10:56 PM
  #709
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Originally Posted by artoor13 View Post
You know whats pisses me off the most about it is that its ON Prucha. I mean I know its hockey and its part of the game. But you don't see those kind of hits on any of our other guys. It's a little gutless to go after the smallest guy on the team like that.
Not like Brylin isn't one of the smallest guys on the Devils though. He got nailed pretty well a bit earlier.

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02-06-2007, 10:57 PM
  #710
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inferno272 View Post
ill say it again.

looking at the raw data, i cant fault renney for putting cullen in there.

if you want to, thats your business, but to me, theres nothing wrong with putting your best shooter statistically into the game.

Cullens problem isnt finishing at all, when he gets decent chances, he tends to hit the net, and the back of the net, the problem is hes been so weak on his skates, hes almost always on his back before the puck even gets there.
But when has he done that recently?

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02-06-2007, 10:57 PM
  #711
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inferno272 View Post
Yes a phenomenal mix. i said this to you yesterday right here:
http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=340721&page=8



you have to look at what he was given to start with, and how it ended up, not just look at what happened and then blame all the players.
And the guys you mentioned who were so good last year have this year:

- Has been inconsistent like 85% of the goalies in the league.

- Has not been healthy this season.

- Has struggled to find his game.

- Is a year older and at 38 could possibly start to run out of gas.

- The two guys who won the Cup were not the reason that team won the Cup.

But to continue your thought process: we have a coach that was an Adams Trophey finalist last season. Doesn't that count for something?

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02-06-2007, 10:57 PM
  #712
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Originally Posted by artoor13 View Post
I just expect someone who is to make the right ones.
If you still expect that after the last 8 seasons, I don't know what to tell you.

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02-06-2007, 10:58 PM
  #713
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Originally Posted by artoor13 View Post
You know whats pisses me off the most about it is that its ON Prucha. I mean I know its hockey and its part of the game. But you don't see those kind of hits on any of our other guys. It's a little gutless to go after the smallest guy on the team like that.

I mean i wouldn't feel that proud if he was half my size.

I really want someone to pummel Gionta next game. Just bend down and give him a nice shoulder to the nose at 20 mph.

I guess you missed the hit by Ward on Brylin. Take the shades off dude.

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02-06-2007, 11:01 PM
  #714
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
If you still expect that after the last 8 seasons, I don't know what to tell you.
I expect it after last season.

I know you're argument could be that Jagr was Godly and Lundqvist was Amazing.

But..

Just like its not all Renneys fault for us sucking, its not all 2 or three players who got us into the playoffs last year.

We played well as a team and defensively. Thats coaching no?

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02-06-2007, 11:01 PM
  #715
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
And the guys you mentioned who were so good last year have this year:

- Has been inconsistent like 85% of the goalies in the league.

- Has not been healthy this season.

- Has struggled to find his game.

- Is a year older and at 38 could possibly start to run out of gas.


But to continue your thought process: we have a coach that was an Adams Trophey finalist last season. Doesn't that count for something?
Thats the question, do you really think he should have been an Adams finalist?

The team, after the Olympics was just awful. They completely fell apart, and Renney did NOTHING to help the team out. He even admitted to coaching poorly in the playoffs and called it a learning experience or something.

I think Renney actually coached pretty well last year in that he got the guys to buy into the system of coming back as 5 man units on every single shift. after the olympics, for whatever reason, that simply stopped. it has continued all throughout this year, to me, that says the team has tuned the coach out.

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02-06-2007, 11:03 PM
  #716
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Originally Posted by MisterUnspoken View Post
But when has he done that recently?
I still dont get what that has to do with the argument here? The shootout is an ENTIRELY different entity from the game. I will 110% agree with you his in game performance has been a great disappointment, but my question to you is, what the heck does that have to do with his shootout prowess?

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02-06-2007, 11:04 PM
  #717
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klingsor View Post
Don't care how well we played.

We NEEDED two points. 4 on 3 in overtime against a team that you're not going to beat in the standings means you can take all the risks you want to score.

We blew it.
At this point that's how I feel. Just win. I don't really care how. The wins are all that matters because that's what the team needs to make the playoffs. The Rangers have outplayed the Devils at least twice this season, and both times, the Devils ended up winning. That's what the good teams do--they find ways to win even on nights where they don't play their best.

Playing "well" is nice and all, but the league only awards wins according to the scoreboard.

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02-06-2007, 11:05 PM
  #718
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Originally Posted by inferno272 View Post
Thats the question, do you really think he should have been an Adams finalist?

The team, after the Olympics was just awful. They completely fell apart, and Renney did NOTHING to help the team out. He even admitted to coaching poorly in the playoffs and called it a learning experience or something.

I think Renney actually coached pretty well last year in that he got the guys to buy into the system of coming back as 5 man units on every single shift. after the olympics, for whatever reason, that simply stopped. it has continued all throughout this year, to me, that says the team has tuned the coach out.
I don't put a lot of stock in awards. I believe that Jagr was the best player in the league last season, not Thornton.

Renney did take a team that was predicted to challeng for the first pick overall to the playoffs.

Maybe, just maybe, last year was a fluke.

My point is this: right now its too easy to say fire the coach. There are larger problems here.

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02-06-2007, 11:07 PM
  #719
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Originally Posted by artoor13 View Post
I expect it after last season.

I know you're argument could be that Jagr was Godly and Lundqvist was Amazing.

But..

Just like its not all Renneys fault for us sucking, its not all 2 or three players who got us into the playoffs last year.

We played well as a team and defensively. Thats coaching no?
Sather is still Sather.

He made a concious decision not to upgrade the top pairing of the defense. He decided that Cullen could be a 2nd line center. He was the one who did not address the lack of scoring on the bottom two lines.

And it really was two player that got the Rangers in the playoffs last season. You change the way Lundqvist and Jagr played and the team doesn't sniff the playoffs.

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02-06-2007, 11:07 PM
  #720
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
I don't put a lot of stock in awards. I believe that Jagr was the best player in the league last season, not Thornton.

Renney did take a team that was predicted to challeng for the first pick overall to the playoffs.

Maybe, just maybe, last year was a fluke.

My point is this: right now its too easy to say fire the coach. There are larger problems here.
And again, i will disagree with you. Im actually not unhappy with the roster. I think the team as constructed should be a playoff team, and should be battling for first in the division. You, and im sure many others, dont agree, which is totally fine. But i think Tom has simply done a PUTRID job in putting players in a position to be succesful, a PUTRID job in setting up accountability, and a PUTRID job in managing the roster.

I think the players we have are fine, could have used a bit of tweaking, but i think they are a good team. Just underachieving massively.

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02-06-2007, 11:08 PM
  #721
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Sather is still Sather.

He made a concious decision not to upgrade the top pairing of the defense. He decided that Cullen could be a 2nd line center. He was the one who did not address the lack of scoring on the bottom two lines.

And it really was two player that got the Rangers in the playoffs last season. You change the way Lundqvist and Jagr played and the team doesn't sniff the playoffs.
and again, he offered Elias a monster contract, offered Chara a monster contract. They didnt sign. While overestimating Cullens value might be a bad thing, I similarly cant fault Glen much this year as well, he tried to get the guys we needed, they just didnt want to come here for whatever reason.

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02-06-2007, 11:14 PM
  #722
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After cooling off a little bit, I realized something...

We played really hard tonight.

If we play this hard the rest of the way, I have no objections.

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02-06-2007, 11:15 PM
  #723
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Sather is still Sather.

He made a concious decision not to upgrade the top pairing of the defense. He decided that Cullen could be a 2nd line center. He was the one who did not address the lack of scoring on the bottom two lines.

And it really was two player that got the Rangers in the playoffs last season. You change the way Lundqvist and Jagr played and the team doesn't sniff the playoffs.
I think we are on the same page with Sather. I agreed with you in one of my last posts.

But as much as Lundqvist and Jagr contributed to the cause, can you honestly tell me that with Jagrs same performance and Lundvist facing as much pressure as this season (b/c of the D and more shots) and a sub par 2nd 3rd, and 4th line effort and piss poor D and horrible PP we make the playoffs? It works both ways.

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02-06-2007, 11:16 PM
  #724
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Originally Posted by ZYanksRule View Post
After cooling off a little bit, I realized something...

We played really hard tonight.

If we play this hard the rest of the way, I have no objections.

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02-06-2007, 11:21 PM
  #725
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZYanksRule View Post
After cooling off a little bit, I realized something...

We played really hard tonight.

If we play this hard the rest of the way, I have no objections.
I agree. If we lost this game in regulation tonight in the way we did last night, this probably would have been the season. But we didn't play a terrible game.

The Devils are simply a much better team than us at the moment and the fact that we managed to get a point out of it with Brodeur playing another out-of-his-mind game, I'll take it. Of course I wanted the win and we missed the net too much on the final power play, but if we play with this effort and turn it into wins and if Avery doesn't become a one-game wonder, we could be on the right track.

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