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The Flyers blew it by not selecting Maatta

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Old
02-15-2014, 02:30 PM
  #51
flyershockey
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Wait, the Flyers are a bad drafting team now?

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02-15-2014, 02:34 PM
  #52
tymed
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Its Olli a Maatta of time until Laughtons up here contributing nicely for the Flyers.

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02-15-2014, 03:20 PM
  #53
Norm MacDonald
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Originally Posted by flyershockey View Post
Decently enough? He's putting up huge numbers.
He's on track to be a solid NHL player, but I wouldn't say he's drastically raised his draft stock. IMO the only players selected ahead of him that he's outperforming are Faksa and arguably Reinhart, Koekkoek and Grigorenko (it's tough to gauge his progress at the moment). He'd probably be taken around the same place if then draft were redone today.


Last edited by Norm MacDonald: 02-15-2014 at 03:28 PM.
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02-15-2014, 03:26 PM
  #54
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And it's a different climate with the cap. They couldn't just waive as many guys as they needed to, and it rightfully still was not worth it to trade draft picks just to get rid of people. Was still the right call.

I'm not terribly concerned with what the scouts had to say, we all know Holmgren & Co. all get giant woodies when they see these guys in camp and impress with comments like "they don't look out of place." And I don't trust them either. They haven't earned difference to the opinions of people on internet message boards when their record in the draft is about what you'd expect from people who post on internet message boards.
Hal Gill wasn't under contract at that point. He signed his deal on the 1st of October so there was only 8 defensemen on contract including Morin. Without Gill that gives you $700K more of cap space to play with (Morin's hit would have been $925K). With the retention of salary cap now allowed they could have have ate a mil or two of Mez's caphit (opposed to just waiving him & barely getting any relief) along with a 2nd rounder to someone. That would leave you with just Morin & Gus in the 6th/7th spots & if this year is any indication Gus wouldn't have been a major stumbling block if they wanted Morin in the lineup that badly.

Yeah the scout that alluded to Morin basically not being ready wasn't just some JO in the corner it was Denis Patterson who's our top scout & guy who Homer relies on heavy seeing as his territory is the OHL.

Morin would have sticked around a little longer than a day after he signed the contract if they truly believed he was part of their plans for this season. I mean there was still some preseason games left at that point.

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Old
02-15-2014, 03:33 PM
  #55
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I'm not as high on Laughton as many, but let's at least see what he does in the NHL before declaring his pick a mistake.

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Old
02-15-2014, 03:43 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
Hal Gill wasn't under contract at that point. He signed his deal on the 1st of October so there was only 8 defensemen on contract including Morin. Without Gill that gives you $700K more of cap space to play with (Morin's hit would have been $925K). With the retention of salary cap now allowed they could have have ate a mil or two of Mez's caphit (opposed to just waiving him & barely getting any relief) along with a 2nd rounder to someone. That would leave you with just Morin & Gus in the 6th/7th spots & if this year is any indication Gus wouldn't have been a major stumbling block if they wanted Morin in the lineup that badly.

Yeah the scout that alluded to Morin basically not being ready wasn't just some JO in the corner it was Denis Patterson who's our top scout & guy who Homer relies on heavy seeing as his territory is the OHL.

Morin would have sticked around a little longer than a day after he signed the contract if they truly believed he was part of their plans for this season. I mean there was still some preseason games left at that point.
Yeah, but they weren't going to keep Morin in place of Gill since Gill is the 8th defenseman. Who do you scratch other than one of Meszaros/Gustafsson?

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02-15-2014, 03:55 PM
  #57
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Yeah, but they weren't going to keep Morin in place of Gill since Gill is the 8th defenseman. Who do you scratch other than one of Meszaros/Gustafsson?
They could have traded one of the two along with a sweetener to fit Morin in. Homer's done it in the past a few times I don't see why he wouldn't have done it then if he wanted Morin in that badly as you claim.

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02-15-2014, 04:14 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
They could have traded one of the two along with a sweetener to fit Morin in. Homer's done it in the past a few times I don't see why he wouldn't have done it then if he wanted Morin in that badly as you claim.
No, I think they wanted to, but decided against it afterward. There's other obscure cap considerations too with the contract, but I doubt they think about those things.

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02-15-2014, 04:57 PM
  #59
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He's on track to be a solid NHL player, but I wouldn't say he's drastically raised his draft stock. IMO the only players selected ahead of him that he's outperforming are Faksa and arguably Reinhart, Koekkoek and Grigorenko (it's tough to gauge his progress at the moment). He'd probably be taken around the same place if then draft were redone today.
It's not exactly a let down that he's only outperforming a handful of guys picked ahead of him. Not every first rounder has to turn into an all star for the pick to be successful. People have gotten carried away with their expectations of first founders after the success of guys like Giroux, Richards, and Carter.

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02-15-2014, 05:18 PM
  #60
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No, I think they wanted to, but decided against it afterward. There's other obscure cap considerations too with the contract, but I doubt they think about those things.
Here's the timeline of events:
-September 17th: Morin signs
-September 18th: Morin demoted
-October 1st: Gill signs
-October 2nd: Season Opener

Don't you think they would have kept Morin on the roster up until the last possible minute if they truly wanted him here?

They had preseason games on the 17th (which he didn't play in), 24th, 26th, 27th of September still left.

IIRC he only played in one game this preseason against Washington on the 16th of September which was a split squad game.


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Old
02-15-2014, 06:18 PM
  #61
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Morin was always going back to Junior.

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02-15-2014, 06:23 PM
  #62
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Morin was always going back to Junior.
Correct.

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Old
02-15-2014, 07:20 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
Here's the timeline of events:
-September 17th: Morin signs
-September 18th: Morin demoted
-October 1st: Gill signs
-October 2nd: Season Opener

Don't you think they would have kept Morin on the roster up until the last possible minute if they truly wanted him here?

They had preseason games on the 17th (which he didn't play in), 24th, 26th, 27th of September still left.

IIRC he only played in one game this preseason against Washington on the 16th of September which was a split squad game.
They also once kept a draft-eligible player in camp and tried to sign him. And then didn't draft him. I think the goalposts are moved in terms of what is strange and outrageous.

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02-15-2014, 08:11 PM
  #64
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I wanted Matta on draft day and was screaming at the tv to draft him when he slid to us. I was pissed they didn't take him due to need and where he was supposed to be drafted. Much like Hagg this past year. But in saying that, Laughton has proved so far to exceed what I expected. Time will tell if they made the right choice.

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02-15-2014, 09:00 PM
  #65
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They also once kept a draft-eligible player in camp and tried to sign him. And then didn't draft him. I think the goalposts are moved in terms of what is strange and outrageous.
Our favorite guy.

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Old
02-16-2014, 12:22 AM
  #66
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Originally Posted by Curufinwe View Post
Morin was always going back to Junior.
which was the correct decision

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02-16-2014, 01:20 AM
  #67
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As long as Laughton turns out to be a solid NHL player, then it doesn't really Matta what Olli does . And who knows if he would even succeed here? It's way too early to tell. I like Robert Hagg in the 2nd round of this year's draft, a lot of "experts" had him going in the first round, so he has talent. Now I'm certainly no expert on players at the junior level though and have never seen the guy play in my life, but I have a good feeling about Hagg and Morin.

Maata will go through periods of struggle, and periods of very solid hockey. A lot of young D men look realy good at first and then fade, while some struggle at first but get better as they go on. Only time will tel with Maata

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02-16-2014, 08:55 AM
  #68
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well, he should be. It's his fourth year in the league
There's a grand total of three fourth year players in the entire OHL with more points than Laughton. ALL of them have played at least ten more games than him. Only one player not named McDavid in the entire league has a better ppg than he has, and he's McDavids teammate. Considering his work ethic without the puck, that's nothing to sneeze at.

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02-16-2014, 09:47 AM
  #69
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I wanted Matta on draft day and was screaming at the tv to draft him when he slid to us. I was pissed they didn't take him due to need and where he was supposed to be drafted. Much like Hagg this past year. But in saying that, Laughton has proved so far to exceed what I expected. Time will tell if they made the right choice.
This is generally my feeling as well. Wanted Maatta and said as much in the draft day thread. Made a lot more sense from an organizational need perspective. Laughton has been better than I expected, although it seems like multiple coaches have attempted to push him into a strictly defensive role, which often begs the question "Is he that good defensively that they're willing to forgo his ability to score or is his ability to score just not what it appears to be."

At the end of the day, player performance in the NHL is all that matters when it comes to evaluating prospects. Maatta is ahead of Laughton right now because he's succeeding at the NHL level already, but we'll see where he ends up in a few more years.

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02-16-2014, 11:28 AM
  #70
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Its Olli a Maatta of time until Laughtons up here contributing nicely for the Flyers.
Holy **** dude

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Old
02-16-2014, 11:38 AM
  #71
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If the Flyers blew it, it was trading a first for Steve Eminger, who was coming off a bad season and had at that point, disappointed in his career

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02-16-2014, 11:54 AM
  #72
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If the Flyers blew it, it was trading a first for Steve Eminger, who was coming off a bad season and had at that point, disappointed in his career
We all know that. That isn't the debate here.

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02-16-2014, 12:00 PM
  #73
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We should have picked maatta and we should have picked dougie Hamilton over cout's . They were both pretty easy picks for the flyers to make but they are afraid to pick defense because they have failed too often.

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02-16-2014, 12:12 PM
  #74
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We should have picked maatta and we should have picked dougie Hamilton over cout's . They were both pretty easy picks for the flyers to make but they are afraid to pick defense because they have failed too often.
Couturier was really not. He had been ranked #1 at the start of the year and was still a consensus top 5 pick at the draft.

When he fell they kind of had to pick him.

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Old
02-16-2014, 12:33 PM
  #75
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Maatta's foot speed has been getting exposed in this game. Carter blew by him. Perry put him in spin cycle.

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