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Old
02-01-2004, 06:49 PM
  #1
coyote
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The Blame

Sure that icing by Ryan was'nt the smartest play but mistakes are made and he wasn't on for the 2 goals that followed. Many mistakes were made after that to lose the game so the blame should not only rest on Ryan's shoulders. Where was Oates to take the face off in your own zone when you needed it. Where was the stop when you needed it. Where were your defensive specialist's when you needed them. Ryan should not be taking the full share of the blame for this lose. Sitting Oates and putting Ryan at center would probably have given us more offense as well. Oates is finished in this league and the only people who haven't realized this is the Oilers management. They are side stepping the issue by blaming other players. So let's stop the bleeding .

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02-01-2004, 11:55 PM
  #2
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Wrong. Ryan as a leader should take the blame for this one, as he had a simple smart play to make that would've resulted in a 4-2 Oilers W, and did not make it, instead selfishly shooting for a goal. Not the only mistake, but the defining one.

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Old
02-02-2004, 01:22 AM
  #3
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Smyth was on the ice - he iced it and I guarantee that is why Moreau came out for Smyth for the faceoff late in the game. Ryan Smyth forced MacT to take him out of the game because he was making ridiculously dumb plays not unlike the majority of his season. He sent Moreau. If Smyth was still on the ice (which he would have been if he hadn't screwed up) he would have been out their for that draw - he wasn't. He let the team down, he has let the team down all year. 3.4 million for underperformance is not value IMO. He needs to be moved. His play hasn't improved and the plays he makes are becoming more and more frustrating. DID you see another icing he made when he got the puck in his own zone - no one around him and another forward right in front of him streaking for an odd man rush. A 10 foot pass that went 15 feet away from the target down for an icing. He is making simple plays look painfully difficult.

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02-02-2004, 01:25 AM
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walsher
Smyth was on the ice - he iced it and I guarantee that is why Moreau came out for Smyth for the faceoff late in the game. Ryan Smyth forced MacT to take him out of the game because he was making ridiculously dumb plays not unlike the majority of his season. He sent Moreau. If Smyth was still on the ice (which he would have been if he hadn't screwed up) he would have been out their for that draw - he wasn't. He let the team down, he has let the team down all year. 3.4 million for underperformance is not value IMO. He needs to be moved. His play hasn't improved and the plays he makes are becoming more and more frustrating. DID you see another icing he made when he got the puck in his own zone - no one around him and another forward right in front of him streaking for an odd man rush. A 10 foot pass that went 15 feet away from the target down for an icing. He is making simple plays look painfully difficult.
hey walsher just a question.
which oilers do you like on the team??

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Old
02-02-2004, 01:27 AM
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrush
hey walsher just a question.
which oilers do you like on the team??
The players that show up on a majority of the nights. York, Dvorak, Torres, Moreau, Ulanov, Smith, Stoll, Brewer, Staios, Isbister. I have a serious issue with "star" players cashing their pay checks and dissapearing for games on end. Which Oilers do you like?

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02-02-2004, 01:38 AM
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walsher
The players that show up on a majority of the nights. York, Dvorak, Torres, Moreau, Ulanov, Smith, Stoll, Brewer, Staios, Isbister. I have a serious issue with "star" players cashing their pay checks and dissapearing for games on end. Which Oilers do you like?
york, dvorak, torres, moreau, ulanov, brewer, smith, hemsky, brewer, semenov, stoll, luoma and lynch when they played, even though lynch played one game i believe and luoma got a couple.

players who are on/off for me

isbister, sometimes shows up and doesn't, i believe he's a puck hog as well, he carries the puck way too much trying to use his size but doesn't know how to use it fully imo.
(hemsky may not show up every night but he is the only reason i watch the oilers, and brewer).

smyth is usually off for me now, he has no heart to play no more, maybe he can't take the beating no more in the front like simpson had to retire early maybe smyth is in the same boat.

another quesiton, why do you like mact so much? he's been a coach for almost 4 years for the oilers, twice in the playoffs, never won a series, and probably twice not going to make the playoffs.

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Old
02-02-2004, 02:04 AM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrush
york, dvorak, torres, moreau, ulanov, brewer, smith, hemsky, brewer, semenov, stoll, luoma and lynch when they played, even though lynch played one game i believe and luoma got a couple.

players who are on/off for me

isbister, sometimes shows up and doesn't, i believe he's a puck hog as well, he carries the puck way too much trying to use his size but doesn't know how to use it fully imo.
(hemsky may not show up every night but he is the only reason i watch the oilers, and brewer).

smyth is usually off for me now, he has no heart to play no more, maybe he can't take the beating no more in the front like simpson had to retire early maybe smyth is in the same boat.

another quesiton, why do you like mact so much? he's been a coach for almost 4 years for the oilers, twice in the playoffs, never won a series, and probably twice not going to make the playoffs.
I think you can read any number of my posts to see why I like him as a coach. IMO people ripping him is not the problem. This team has a shortage of good players who are NHL ready. The personnell is the problem. This teams problems are not as simple as the coach. MacT was courted by many teams in the offseason. He is seen as a very good coach by "hockey" people. I have serious doubts about the quality of the players on the team especially with Reasoner, York injured - my doubts are not so much about the coaches. Why hasn't this team made it past the 1st round? Maybe it is because they play the best or second best teams in the conference in that first round. WHy don't they finish higher in the Conference in the regular season? Maybe it is because their total pay roll equals the top lines payroll of teams like Detroit, St. Louis, Vancouver, Colorado. I love the Oilers but I realize that they are fighting an uphill battle. MacT has provided a team that up until know has been competitive and successfull even though they haven't brought home the cup.

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02-02-2004, 02:12 AM
  #8
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Smyth clearly made a rookie play, but he's certainly not the only one to make bone head plays in this stretch. Horcoff did the same damn thing the other night, it just didn't come back to bite them.

And if we're going to lay blame for last night's game, let's save a little slice for the goalie.

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Old
02-02-2004, 02:40 AM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lowetide
Smyth clearly made a rookie play, but he's certainly not the only one to make bone head plays in this stretch. Horcoff did the same damn thing the other night, it just didn't come back to bite them.

And if we're going to lay blame for last night's game, let's save a little slice for the goalie.
How about the defensman for missing the net on the slapshot with 15 seconds to go that ended up ringing around the boards and leading to the 3 on 2. Those are the plays that have killed this team. Missed nets of the PP, missed nets 5 on 5, missed opportunities all year and it has finally caught up with everyone.

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Old
02-02-2004, 02:55 AM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lowetide
Smyth clearly made a rookie play, but he's certainly not the only one to make bone head plays in this stretch. Horcoff did the same damn thing the other night, it just didn't come back to bite them.

And if we're going to lay blame for last night's game, let's save a little slice for the goalie.
I would concur that there's plenty of blame to go around on this franchise, to scapegoat one or two guys is like killing a couple of wasps while leaving the nest undisturbed.

There has been a clear erosion of talent the last few years. Three years ago, we had a 90 point player and two dmen that could adequately quarterback a PP (Niinimaa and Poti).

Mike Grier had 20 goals, and Smyth was a 30 goal man. Even BG looked like he had promise with 29 points as a 'goon'.

Three years ago, our center depth:

Weight
Comrie
Marchant
Murray/Horcoff

Last night, as a result of injury and player departures, Horcoff was our #1 center. Igor Ulanov was our PP point man. That says it all right there.

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Old
02-02-2004, 04:11 AM
  #11
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The no.1 benefit of trading Smyth: he's not going to get any better as a player. He won't come back and burn us. Smyth for Gagne would be a dream deal.

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Old
02-02-2004, 06:40 AM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walsher
I think you can read any number of my posts to see why I like him as a coach. IMO people ripping him is not the problem. This team has a shortage of good players who are NHL ready. The personnell is the problem. This teams problems are not as simple as the coach. MacT was courted by many teams in the offseason. He is seen as a very good coach by "hockey" people. I have serious doubts about the quality of the players on the team especially with Reasoner, York injured - my doubts are not so much about the coaches. Why hasn't this team made it past the 1st round? Maybe it is because they play the best or second best teams in the conference in that first round. WHy don't they finish higher in the Conference in the regular season? Maybe it is because their total pay roll equals the top lines payroll of teams like Detroit, St. Louis, Vancouver, Colorado. I love the Oilers but I realize that they are fighting an uphill battle. MacT has provided a team that up until know has been competitive and successfull even though they haven't brought home the cup.
look at minnesota they made it to the conference finals, and look at there team compared to ours. two different coaches two different styles but at least he gets it done. anaheim did good as well. so its not about the payroll its up to the coach to do what he has with his cards. if mact says the talent is not good to make it to the playoffs he or maybe he has told kevin lowe they need trades and maybe not. but its the coaches job to tell the gm what he needs to make this team a contender and a winner and maybe mact is telling lowe and its lowe who should be blamed and i blame him too for getting rid of comrie which is a whole different story.

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Old
02-02-2004, 06:46 AM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrush
look at minnesota they made it to the conference finals, and look at there team compared to ours. two different coaches two different styles but at least he gets it done. anaheim did good as well. so its not about the payroll its up to the coach to do what he has with his cards. if mact says the talent is not good to make it to the playoffs he or maybe he has told kevin lowe they need trades and maybe not. but its the coaches job to tell the gm what he needs to make this team a contender and a winner and maybe mact is telling lowe and its lowe who should be blamed and i blame him too for getting rid of comrie which is a whole different story.
How many times do we have to go through this. Comrie wanted out of Edmonton and it wouldn't have matter how much Lowe had offered Comrie. Someone once mentioned that Comrie would have rejected a $10M offer from Lowe. Comrie was a big fish fish in a little pond and he wanted to be a big fish in a big pond.

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Old
02-02-2004, 07:01 AM
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So many people are such hypocrits. "Oh, you can win if you have a good coach and play there cards right" PFFT. Yes, you can win with a bad team if you play the trap to the "t". But, how many of you would then say, oh, I'm glad the Oilers trap because we are winning now. I brought up how the Oilers should conform and start trapping and in turn winning games and the response on here from the majority was how they would stop supporting the Oilers if the started to trap. So in a way it's us who has tied the coaches/Oilers hands in this situation.

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Old
02-02-2004, 07:40 AM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemsky83
How many times do we have to go through this. Comrie wanted out of Edmonton and it wouldn't have matter how much Lowe had offered Comrie. Someone once mentioned that Comrie would have rejected a $10M offer from Lowe. Comrie was a big fish fish in a little pond and he wanted to be a big fish in a big pond.
And how many times do I have to say this:

YOU HAVE NO CLUE WHAT ACTUALLY WENT ON!

Media reports, GM statements, statements from Comrie's end, how do you decide what is real? Easy, likely none of it. Stop trying to shove YOUR OPINION down people's throats, because it is not proven fact, as you are presenting it.

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Old
02-02-2004, 08:01 AM
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both sides have said it wasn't about money. Both sides said that Comrie decided he wanted out - nobody is shoving speculation on anybody LMHF#1

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Old
02-02-2004, 01:33 PM
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thome_26
both sides have said it wasn't about money. Both sides said that Comrie decided he wanted out - nobody is shoving speculation on anybody LMHF#1
I'm surprised at your comment given that in post #40 of this thread you said this
Quote:
Similar? not a chance! Not by a long shot. Both of those players wanted to return to the city and the only thing they couldn't come to agree on was money. Money was the problem with Comrie - but I'm rather peeved this has come up AGAIN. Like some people can't let this thing die.
Must be a typo somewhere?

 
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