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Hossa (Merged with Poll)

View Poll Results: Are You a Hossa Supporter?
YES -I always Hoped for the best with him 108 55.10%
YES -I was not a supporter of him at the start of this season but i'm liking him now! 63 32.14%
NO - I wasn't a supporter of him and despite him playing better he shouldnt be on the Team 11 5.61%
NO - I wasnt a supporter of him from the start, still not. 14 7.14%
Voters: 196. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
02-11-2007, 02:24 PM
  #101
Rise from the Ashes
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Hossa's problem has always been confidence.

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02-11-2007, 04:28 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by True Blue View Post
How does he deserve it and Prucha does not? Not being given a chance? Have you watched him play on the 2nd line for 3 moths last year?
What does Prucha have to do with this thread which is centered around Hossa? Prucha has been on the top two lines this year and has done nothing. His puck handling skills are terrible and he's a small body. He has had continuous trouble shooting on one timers this season when he was playing with Shanny.

Hossa on the other hand has won battles all season long in the corners, creates great space, cant be knocked off the puck easily, handles the puck well, and he has a great shot that he hasnt missed the net with. He clearly has been the better player when compared to Prucha this season.

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Old
02-11-2007, 04:37 PM
  #103
Larry Melnyk
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Originally Posted by Jagr68NYR94Leetch View Post
What does Prucha have to do with this thread which is centered around Hossa? Prucha has been on the top two lines this year and has done nothing. His puck handling skills are terrible and he's a small body. He has had continuous trouble shooting on one timers this season when he was playing with Shanny.

Hossa on the other hand has won battles all season long in the corners, creates great space, cant be knocked off the puck easily, handles the puck well, and he has a great shot that he hasnt missed the net with. He clearly has been the better player when compared to Prucha this season.
I agree..RIGHT NOW, Hossa is clearly the better player...and clearly the player that has improved more this year....and clearly the player that deserves more ice time..

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02-11-2007, 04:46 PM
  #104
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The funny thing about Hossa..

is that Renney has tried hard to keep him in the lineup. He's given him chances when one could argue that he didn't deserve a chance. Prucha, it seems, didn't really get those chances, starting from last season, when I thought he clearly made the team, but somehow ends up in Hartford, then with 7-8 minutes per night, then 30 goals later, he gets about a 10 game pass, and then it's up and down. Renney has always shown confidence in Hossa, and perhaps now it's paying off; Prucha, and many other youngsters, were never really shown the same confidence. Perhaps Renney is very high on Hossa, and just not high on the other guys.

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02-11-2007, 05:56 PM
  #105
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The one thing both Prucha and Hossa have in common is very nice potential and talent. They just happen to be the Mutt and Jeff of potential and talent. Both are just waiting to be paired with the right combination of players and get good ice time. Once that happens I think we'll really see what both are capable of....or not.

I think we will see good things.

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Old
02-11-2007, 05:59 PM
  #106
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Marion said Marcel used to beat him one on one all the time when they were kids.
that just means that Marion needs to work on his defense!

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02-11-2007, 06:16 PM
  #107
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I've never been a big supporter of marcel, but at the same time I never really had a problem with him either.

I think it would be a terrible idea to trade him right now. He seems to have turned it on and acquired some confidence. Given the quality of his play recently, I think it would be terribly foolish to get rid of him. Plus, there appears to be some chemistry between Hossa and Jagr. If he tapers off again, maybe consider it, but don't go pulling the plug on something that could turn out to be really good for us.

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02-11-2007, 06:37 PM
  #108
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Just a point...

There is always a painful amount of "power forwards take longer to develop" talk when discussing the Jessimen debacle. Hossa is only 25, I beleive. Maybe he is slowly growing into an effective forward with a scoring touch...

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02-11-2007, 07:19 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
is that Renney has tried hard to keep him in the lineup. He's given him chances when one could argue that he didn't deserve a chance. Prucha, it seems, didn't really get those chances, starting from last season, when I thought he clearly made the team, but somehow ends up in Hartford, then with 7-8 minutes per night, then 30 goals later, he gets about a 10 game pass, and then it's up and down. Renney has always shown confidence in Hossa, and perhaps now it's paying off; Prucha, and many other youngsters, were never really shown the same confidence. Perhaps Renney is very high on Hossa, and just not high on the other guys.
No doubt, Hossa has gotten more chances and seen more highly then any single Ranger under Renney....ANd i guess it has indeed finally paid off..

As for Prucha, he was brought along perfectly last year by Renney and, if anything, the stint in Hartford helped him.As for this year, I'll agree that he hasn;t gotten the same amount of chances but on too many nights Prucha's play has been uneven and his mental and defensive game lacking..I just don;t think he's been all that good with the time he has gotten..Yeah, points abnout linemates can be brought up, but individualy he just wasn't doing it..All moot now becasue it fianlly looks like he has a stable spot with CUllen and Orts/Duopuis and on the PP unit...Hopefully he lights it up, because we need it..

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Old
02-11-2007, 08:41 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by Jagr68NYR94Leetch View Post
What does Prucha have to do with this thread which is centered around Hossa?
You said that Hossa is deserving of what he is getting. And I want to know why it is that a player who up until that past week had 2 goals is deserving and the best Rangers rookie forward since Amonte & Weight lace 'em up is not. That is what he has to do with this thread.
Quote:
Prucha has been on the top two lines this year and has done nothing.
Aside from the first few weeks of the season, Prucha has been anywhere but on the top-2 lines. If he had the same lenght of rope that Hossa has recieved, he woudl be there still.
Quote:
His puck handling skills are terrible and he's a small body.
How has Prucha's body made it a detriment for him and Hossa's large body has made it a boon for him? Can you give me any examples, if not soley pointing out the last handfull of game?
Quote:
He has had continuous trouble shooting on one timers this season when he was playing with Shanny.
Is he having trouble with Shanny or are they both having issues with Cullen? Are you going to tell me that Shanny has been lighting the lamp with Cullen as his center?
Quote:
Hossa on the other hand has won battles all season long in the corners, creates great space, cant be knocked off the puck easily, handles the puck well, and he has a great shot that he hasnt missed the net with.
This is exactly what I love. A 5 game hotflash and suddenly Hossa does not miss the net and cannot get knocked off the puck. Let's completely ignore all the other games (and you have to be if you are telling me that he cannot be knocked off the puck and does not miss the net).
Quote:
He clearly has been the better player when compared to Prucha this season.
Obviously one needs to ignore obvious production to be able to make such a statement.

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Old
02-11-2007, 08:44 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by Larry Melnyk View Post
No doubt, Hossa has gotten more chances and seen more highly then any single Ranger under Renney....ANd i guess it has indeed finally paid off..
Come on, Larry. Can we please wait more than 5 games before we can say that something is paying off. Not all that long ago, most of the people that are currently (and I do not mean you) trumpeting how wonderfull Hossa is, were posting things like it is time to cut the cord on the Hossa experiment. He has looked good in week-long stretches before, can we please give it more time than that before we annoit him the better player (right now or any other time) than Prucha?

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Old
02-11-2007, 08:50 PM
  #112
Thirty One
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Originally Posted by True Blue View Post
Is he having trouble with Shanny or are they both having issues with Cullen? Are you going to tell me that Shanny has been lighting the lamp with Cullen as his center?
Prucha is in the same boat as Cullen. they both can produce offense, but they don't make the players around them better by any wild stretch of the imagination.

Quote:
Aside from the first few weeks of the season, Prucha has been anywhere but on the top-2 lines. If he had the same lenght of rope that Hossa has recieved, he woudl be there still.
Petr Prucha's ES TOI: 556:12
Marcel Hossa's ES TOI: 499:49

Petr Prucha's PP TOI: 131:42
Marcel Hossa's PP TOI: 25:08

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Old
02-11-2007, 08:54 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by True Blue View Post
Come on, Larry. Can we please wait more than 5 games before we can say that something is paying off. Not all that long ago, most of the people that are currently (and I do not mean you) trumpeting how wonderfull Hossa is, were posting things like it is time to cut the cord on the Hossa experiment. He has looked good in week-long stretches before, can we please give it more time than that before we annoit him the better player (right now or any other time) than Prucha?
TB, I agree wholeHEARTedly. I've always dogged Hossa. I will not change my opinion about him like MANY people. And to those patting their backs like SOS, well hold that. We all know Hossa has his stretches. I truly can smile though at his production the past few weeks.

And looking at his skillset, it is not hard to imagine him beating his brother. I want to say he has similar stickhandling and skating stride, just does not have the MOJO like Marian. Maybe he's gaining some MOJO? All I know is this Momo is starting to come around and I'm liking what I'm seeing. I just hope he doesn't revert to his old days of being a mutt.

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02-11-2007, 09:19 PM
  #114
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#s

I think the comparisions to Prucha are a little ridiculous. For a multitude of reasons, you can argue that Prucha has had a dissapointing sophmore season thus far, but look at the productivity comparision of between him and Hossa

Petr Prucha: 54 gp, 12-12-24 pts, -9, 24 pim, 12:46 ATOI, 84 sog, 14.3%
Marcel Hossa: 54 gp, 5-5-10 pts, -5, 18 pim, 11:33 ATOI, 56 sog, 8.9%

Thats over twice as many goals, assists, and points with relatively similar ATOIs numbers.

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Old
02-11-2007, 09:24 PM
  #115
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Every time he (Hossa) scores I think its Jagr. He looks just like him. His shot is greta. He just needed some confidence to get out in front and shoot. He battles day in and dayout and maybe he is getting rewarded

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Old
02-11-2007, 09:25 PM
  #116
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Originally Posted by SickNice View Post
I think the comparisions to Prucha are a little ridiculous. For a multitude of reasons, you can argue that Prucha has had a dissapointing sophmore season thus far, but look at the productivity comparision of between him and Hossa

Petr Prucha: 54 gp, 12-12-24 pts, -9, 24 pim, 12:46 ATOI, 84 sog, 14.3%
Marcel Hossa: 54 gp, 5-5-10 pts, -5, 18 pim, 11:33 ATOI, 56 sog, 8.9%

Thats over twice as many goals, assists, and points with relatively similar ATOIs numbers.
That ATOI argument is inaccurate - when was the last time you saw Prucha kill a penalty?

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Old
02-11-2007, 09:34 PM
  #117
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Originally Posted by SickNice View Post
I think the comparisions to Prucha are a little ridiculous. For a multitude of reasons, you can argue that Prucha has had a dissapointing sophmore season thus far, but look at the productivity comparision of between him and Hossa

Petr Prucha: 54 gp, 12-12-24 pts, -9, 24 pim, 12:46 ATOI, 84 sog, 14.3%
Marcel Hossa: 54 gp, 5-5-10 pts, -5, 18 pim, 11:33 ATOI, 56 sog, 8.9%

Thats over twice as many goals, assists, and points with relatively similar ATOIs numbers.
A few things:

- If I'm looking for someone to score goals, I'll take Prucha. They bring very different things though.
- I think Prucha's a better fit for 1st unit PP, but Hossa's a better fit for 2nd line.
- keep in mind that their TOI's include Hossa's PK time, and Prucha's PP time

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Old
02-11-2007, 09:44 PM
  #118
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Originally Posted by Jagr68NYR94Leetch View Post
You say he's nothing more than a 3rd/4th liner? Again is that a joke? Because he sure isnt playing like one and he hasnt all year. It take 2/3 of the season for Renney to finally give him a shot with some real scorers and he is making things happen and appearing on the score sheet. The goals he has been scoring have been good goals that he had to make happen. Dont make it seem like Jagr is going in on 2 on none's faking out the goalie and putting it on Hossa's tape for him to just tap in like Jags did with Hollweg. Last night in Washington, he was screening the goaltender, standing in front of the net something the rangers havent done much of this year, got the rebound and put it away. Friday night he skated into the Tampa zone, using the defensemen as a screen and let that wrist shot go from between the circles and scored.

He's always had a great defensive game and this year he has been great on the PK. He backchecks extremely well and in the offensive zone he is using his size to his advantage winning the puck. Give the guy some credit and stop being ignorant. Yes last year he was not playing well because he wasnt moving his legs, he'd always be so slow and behind the play. But this year he is hustling and skating hard EVERY shift. He has even thrown some big hits and has always made attempts to finish his checks. He earned the spot he has now and is coming alive.


I seriously dont know how you can call him a bust
Yup his whole 4 goals definitly say he is a 2nd liner, is that a joke.

Please he is with Jagr, and you could just about put any one with Jags and they will score.

He is lazy and inconsistant. thats it. If he keeps this up cool if not well then I wont say im shocked.

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02-11-2007, 09:52 PM
  #119
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Originally Posted by Prucha25Graves988 View Post
He is lazy and inconsistant. thats it.
Asinine quote. You clearly don't watch the games.

By the way, why did this suddenly boil down to a Prucha vs. Hossa debate? What does Petr's success or lack thereof have to do with Marcel's? There are any number of other forwards whose TOI are impacting Prucha before Marcel is. There seem to be agendas floating about...

(And by the way, I am a big Petr Prucha fan - not saying anything against him, just wondering why Hossa's recent success is being characterized as a detriment against Prucha. Very confusing.)


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Old
02-11-2007, 10:11 PM
  #120
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Originally Posted by True Blue View Post
You said that Hossa is deserving of what he is getting. And I want to know why it is that a player who up until that past week had 2 goals is deserving and the best Rangers rookie forward since Amonte & Weight lace 'em up is not. That is what he has to do with this thread.
Up until the past 2 weeks!?!? He has been playing great ALL year and not once was there a thought to bump him up onto the top 2 lines until recently. Prucha had a great rookie season but where has he been this year. Put aside who he's played with this season, he has done nothing to show the type of game he possessed last season. He handles the puck like a hot potato. A perfect example would be last night in the third period when he couldnt control the puck but was saved as he was losing the puck because a Capital player hit him to take a penalty. And you dont need certain players around you to shoot the puck when you have the chance and hit the net. Thats all him, he hasnt been shooting the puck well. And anyway you look at it this thread still has nothing to do with him. Why is he being brought up when its Hossa we are talking about because its Hossa who has been playing good? Now it sounds like I hate Prucha when I really dont but when I have to see someone come and post on a thread against Hossa using Prucha as part of his debate I'm take Hossa;s side because he has been the better player.

Quote:
Aside from the first few weeks of the season, Prucha has been anywhere but on the top-2 lines. If he had the same lenght of rope that Hossa has recieved, he woudl be there still.
Are you kidding??? Prucha has had much more opportunities on the top 2 lines as opposed to Hossa. Hossa hasnt been up on the top 2 lines until these past 2 weeks. Prucha while being on them has done absolutely nothing! Hossa gets his shot and immediately produces. I know there is this feeling of defending Prucha because you know its still there that he can score 30 goals, its in him but Hossa has been playing gread lets not take the credit away from him when he has earned the credibility just because you like Prucha better. Again there was no reason to bring him up in this thread.

Quote:
How has Prucha's body made it a detriment for him and Hossa's large body has made it a boon for him? Can you give me any examples, if not soley pointing out the last handfull of game?
Let's see because Prucha has a small body, he has been run at continuously and last year as we all know a Flyer took a run at him, injuring him. Since then he hasnt been the same player, not in the least bit. I give him a lot of credit for getting up every time but he just hasnt been the same player. On top of this like I said before he doesnt have great puck handling skills, his best attribute is his shot but that hasnt been going good for him this year. Hossa on the other hand creates great space with his size and ability to handle the puck. He almost always comes out of the corner with the puck drawing two guys to him because it is hard to get the puck from him. What does this do? It creates space for Jagr to make things happen like he did last year. Hossa also has a great shot. Hossa can do more with Jagr than Prucha can. C'mon just look at the last few games with Hossa on Jagr's line. All year Jagr has had no jump in his game, all the sudden with Hossa on his line he looks faster because he is open more now. He is skating harder because he is getting free more with Hossa on his line. The chemistry is there because Hossa is there.

Quote:
Is he having trouble with Shanny or are they both having issues with Cullen? Are you going to tell me that Shanny has been lighting the lamp with Cullen as his center?
Yeh but Shanny has 25+ goals this season! And most of the season he had been with Cullen. Thats the difference. Prucha needs guys for him to play better. Hossa doesnt. Hossa has been playing great all year, having an all around game making things happen while always being with guys like Betts and Ward who cant/couldnt finish. He finally gets his shot playing the same way he has all year and now its showing because he is appearing on the score sheet finally. Prucha is put on the PP with Jagr and he;s still not doing anything so dont say he;s not being given a shot. The Rangers had 2 PP goals last night from the unit Prucha is on and he had nothing to do with either one. Stop making excuses for a guy who has simply had a bad year. Who knows maybe he;ll have a good playoffs if they make it or a better year next season.

Quote:
This is exactly what I love. A 5 game hotflash and suddenly Hossa does not miss the net and cannot get knocked off the puck. Let's completely ignore all the other games (and you have to be if you are telling me that he cannot be knocked off the puck and does not miss the net).

Obviously one needs to ignore obvious production to be able to make such a statement.
Oh please, sure he's been knocked off the puck before but c'mon man, your the one ignoring how he's truely played this season. He's been winning the puck in the corners all year coming off the boards to the middle and making things happen. Sure he's missed the net. But with every time he might have missed the net it was an opportunity he created for himself on those bottom two lines. This isnt just some 5 game "hotflash" he has played a strong, solid 2 way game all year. He worked hard in the offseason to correct his game and it has been paying off.

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02-11-2007, 10:30 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by Prucha25Graves988 View Post
Yup his whole 4 goals definitly say he is a 2nd liner, is that a joke.

Please he is with Jagr, and you could just about put any one with Jags and they will score.

He is lazy and inconsistant. thats it. If he keeps this up cool if not well then I wont say im shocked.
No sorry its not a joke.

Again I'm tired of the Jagr excuse. And again like I said earlier in this thread its not like jagr has been laying the puck on his tape for Hossa to tap in. Hossa scored good goals. He worked hard for his goals, give credit where credit is do. And please actually watch the games.

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02-11-2007, 10:33 PM
  #122
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Originally Posted by Jagr68NYR94Leetch View Post
Up until the past 2 weeks!?!? He has been playing great ALL year and not once was there a thought to bump him up onto the top 2 lines until recently. Prucha had a great rookie season but where has he been this year. Put aside who he's played with this season, he has done nothing to show the type of game he possessed last season. He handles the puck like a hot potato. A perfect example would be last night in the third period when he couldnt control the puck but was saved as he was losing the puck because a Capital player hit him to take a penalty. And you dont need certain players around you to shoot the puck when you have the chance and hit the net. Thats all him, he hasnt been shooting the puck well. And anyway you look at it this thread still has nothing to do with him. Why is he being brought up when its Hossa we are talking about because its Hossa who has been playing good? Now it sounds like I hate Prucha when I really dont but when I have to see someone come and post on a thread against Hossa using Prucha as part of his debate I'm take Hossa;s side because he has been the better player.


Are you kidding??? Prucha has had much more opportunities on the top 2 lines as opposed to Hossa. Hossa hasnt been up on the top 2 lines until these past 2 weeks. Prucha while being on them has done absolutely nothing! Hossa gets his shot and immediately produces. I know there is this feeling of defending Prucha because you know its still there that he can score 30 goals, its in him but Hossa has been playing gread lets not take the credit away from him when he has earned the credibility just because you like Prucha better. Again there was no reason to bring him up in this thread.


Let's see because Prucha has a small body, he has been run at continuously and last year as we all know a Flyer took a run at him, injuring him. Since then he hasnt been the same player, not in the least bit. I give him a lot of credit for getting up every time but he just hasnt been the same player. On top of this like I said before he doesnt have great puck handling skills, his best attribute is his shot but that hasnt been going good for him this year. Hossa on the other hand creates great space with his size and ability to handle the puck. He almost always comes out of the corner with the puck drawing two guys to him because it is hard to get the puck from him. What does this do? It creates space for Jagr to make things happen like he did last year. Hossa also has a great shot. Hossa can do more with Jagr than Prucha can. C'mon just look at the last few games with Hossa on Jagr's line. All year Jagr has had no jump in his game, all the sudden with Hossa on his line he looks faster because he is open more now. He is skating harder because he is getting free more with Hossa on his line. The chemistry is there because Hossa is there.


Yeh but Shanny has 25+ goals this season! And most of the season he had been with Cullen. Thats the difference. Prucha needs guys for him to play better. Hossa doesnt. Hossa has been playing great all year, having an all around game making things happen while always being with guys like Betts and Ward who cant/couldnt finish. He finally gets his shot playing the same way he has all year and now its showing because he is appearing on the score sheet finally. Prucha is put on the PP with Jagr and he;s still not doing anything so dont say he;s not being given a shot. The Rangers had 2 PP goals last night from the unit Prucha is on and he had nothing to do with either one. Stop making excuses for a guy who has simply had a bad year. Who knows maybe he;ll have a good playoffs if they make it or a better year next season.


Oh please, sure he's been knocked off the puck before but c'mon man, your the one ignoring how he's truely played this season. He's been winning the puck in the corners all year coming off the boards to the middle and making things happen. Sure he's missed the net. But with every time he might have missed the net it was an opportunity he created for himself on those bottom two lines. This isnt just some 5 game "hotflash" he has played a strong, solid 2 way game all year. He worked hard in the offseason to correct his game and it has been paying off.

Couldn't agree more. Well said.

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02-11-2007, 10:59 PM
  #123
Larry Melnyk
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Quote:
Originally Posted by True Blue View Post
Come on, Larry. Can we please wait more than 5 games before we can say that something is paying off. Not all that long ago, most of the people that are currently (and I do not mean you) trumpeting how wonderfull Hossa is, were posting things like it is time to cut the cord on the Hossa experiment. He has looked good in week-long stretches before, can we please give it more time than that before we annoit him the better player (right now or any other time) than Prucha?
Easy, my friend...I've mentioned in quite a few places that its still too early to tell if this move up to the next level of play is the real thing for Hossa..But, you know what, I take what I can get from this team, and right now Hossa is playing damn well..,,And much better then I ever, ever expected (I couldn't stand the guy).....ANd, without a doubt, playing much better then Prucha RIGHT NOW..Don't see how anybody can say otherwise...Doesn;t mean it will be like this next week or the week after but, for the Rangers sake, I hope he keeps it up...

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02-11-2007, 11:12 PM
  #124
NYRMatt
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Hossa has always been one of my favorites.

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Old
02-12-2007, 02:05 AM
  #125
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I just watched that goal Hossa scored against the caps.

That was a first class bit o Hockey there. The way he controlled the puck after Cullen's shot, beat the two opposing players, skated out and makes the nice feed back to Cullen, crosses back in front of the net so Shanny has the screen to shoot into, collects and then wrists a nice a rebound past Kolzig. Verrrry Nice. Great execution of some simple, but skillful hockey.

I don't want to make too big a deal out of it. History tells us he's still got a bit to prove, but if this guy can continue playing THAT kind of game.......

....I mean go back and watch it. It's pretty sweet.

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