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Old
02-20-2014, 08:38 AM
  #26
PredsV82
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Originally Posted by glenngineer View Post
Hello James Franklin. Volde, you're right, a contract is a contract but in the sports world, it is a different animal. How many college coaches move on while being signed by a school? You don't see it in pro sports except in this one instance with Rads. He's a schmo. He needed to be gone. While it would be nice to have his talents on the ice, everything else outweighs what he can bring to the ice and more importantly, the team concept.
But what you are not acknowledging is that before another school can sign a coach that is under contract they have to obtain permission from his current employer to talk to him, otherwise thats contractual interference which is exactly what the KHL was guilty of. Had the KHL been subject to US law the Preds could have successfully sued them

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02-20-2014, 08:50 AM
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The fact we hit on a middle first round talent and he bolted to Russia sucks. I personally am over it and I never want to see him in a Predators uniform again. While he is very talented he is also trouble and not worth it imo. Let's turn the page and be done with this fool...

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02-20-2014, 09:56 AM
  #28
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Nikolay Zherdev had his share of great games in which he showcased what he can do when he gives a damn too. He still managed to play his way out of the NHL.

Robbie Schremp had those sorts of back-to-back moments where you knew he'd "finally turned it around" and was going to be a star. They never lasted.

Some folks just are this way.

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02-20-2014, 05:03 PM
  #29
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The wife beater was Krivo.

I get the running out on the contract offense. But we took him back in 2012 with open arms so don't go back to that. It was forgiven in 2012.

The Curfew was handled poorly and against the better interests of the team. If they had handled it discreetly, allowed Rads and AK to play Game 3, and not created a side show, we had a better chance of winning that series. Yes we won Game 3 without him, which turned out to be our Alamo. It kicked off the "Trotz Rule" (no changes if you won the last game) and we intentionally played without two of our best offensive players after the one-game suspension was over. We lost Game 4, then we brought them back down 3 games to 1 with the team in disarray, and we lost Game 5.

Lets say he did more stuff behind the scenes (holding up planes and ice girls), then deal with that after the season. If he failed the boy scout test, and we didn't want to invest long term in him, then trade him.

Instead, we broadcast to the world he's damaged goods, decide not to sign him when he wanted to stay and sign with us, then make it clear to the other teams we have no interest in signing him thus losing leverage, then let him leave, getting nothing in return.

Rads was a team asset. We got nothing for that asset. Just like Suter was an asset. Poile's naivety allowed Suter to hold all the cards by keeping him thru 2012 even though he had upcoming UFA status, and relying on Suter's word he would sign. Another Gomer move. Pros do things for their own benefit. They're not going to do a team any favors. Poile should have demanded either Suter re-signs before the trade deadline, or he ships him out to the highest bidder. If he was going to sign, he would have re-signed before he became a UFA, like Pekka.

Poile should have either left Rads in Russia with full rights to the last year of his rookie contract, or bring him back like he did under the condition that he would re-sign. He did neither, instead rolling the dice to do better in the short term of the playoffs, and then losing all leverage and value after the fact.

Oh, by the way, same pattern with Hamhuis. Hammer wanted to re-sign at $4mm per year. Poile declined and let him go UFA to the Nucks and got ........ what? ....... what? ......... Bueller? ........ that's right: nothing! Why? Cuz he was looking ahead saving his dollars for Suter and Weber. Which would have been great had he not botched the Suter thing. Who wouldn't want Hammer for $4mm right now?

Poile was naive in thinking Rads went to Russian Charm School and majored in "Spaling Aw-Shucks-Psych". You think Ovi is a boy scout? You don't think he's got that Russian-rascal-gene in him. You don't think the Caps have a different code-of-conduct for him? They do.

We've turned Rads into a social-deviant when he's more of an immature free-spirit. This isn't military school. It's pro sports, filled with prima donnas who put up numbers and therefore get special treatment behind the scenes. Rads played multi-years with us before he left and we somehow put up with him. The guys on the Russian team praised him because they know he plays his butt off and helps them win.

Tell me you won't be more excited about our team if 47 was in the lineup on the 27th.

I don't love him, and he's not going out with my daughter, but I would have signed him to a 3 year contract, given him rules, disciplined him discreetly when he violated the rules, and worked thru it. If he jumped ship again, the money would stop so i'm no worse off than now. If he flew right, and scored 30 goals, then I'm getting my money's worth. I fail to see the risk.

We act as if this is personal. It's sports. It's winning.

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02-20-2014, 05:22 PM
  #30
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What makes you say he wanted to resign with us and stay here?? I haven't heard that from anyone before.

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02-20-2014, 05:30 PM
  #31
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I'd sell my tickets and forego any home games if Rads was on the roster in a week. Things weren't forgiven when bringing him back in 2012 ... it was a no cost move to try to make a push in the playoffs. Any idea that he was coming back long term was based on wishful thinking, not rational thought. The world knew he was "damaged goods" long before the curfew incident ... from his leaving while under contract to actions while in the KHL.

Multi-years? He was on the Preds roster for less than two seasons, only one full, then bolted and signed in the KHL within the first week the Preds could possibly sign him to an extension ... July following his second season.

What's next, an essay on now the Titans should pursue Ray Rice? The reasons to enshrine McGuire and Bonds? After all, it's about winning ... character be damned ... right?

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02-20-2014, 06:10 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
I'd sell my tickets and forego any home games if Rads was on the roster in a week. Things weren't forgiven when bringing him back in 2012 ... it was a no cost move to try to make a push in the playoffs. Any idea that he was coming back long term was based on wishful thinking, not rational thought. The world knew he was "damaged goods" long before the curfew incident ... from his leaving while under contract to actions while in the KHL.

Multi-years? He was on the Preds roster for less than two seasons, only one full, then bolted and signed in the KHL within the first week the Preds could possibly sign him to an extension ... July following his second season.

What's next, an essay on now the Titans should pursue Ray Rice? The reasons to enshrine McGuire and Bonds? After all, it's about winning ... character be damned ... right?
SEASON TEAM GP G A PTS +/-
'06-'07 NSH 64 18 19 37 19

'07-'08 NSH 81 26 32 58 7

'11-'12 NSH 9 3 4 7 3

Career 154 47 55 102 29

Multi, meaning two.

Then there was the hoopla when he returned. All smiles and optimism:

Predators GM David Poile: Alex Radulov reunion ‘absolutely’ about enticing Suter, Weber to stay in Nashville.
By Greg Wyshynski
March 21, 2012 12:58 PM

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-pu...165819353.html


Alex Radulov officially rejoined the Nashville Predators on Wednesday: Meeting the media, rocking his yellow sweater with a familiar No. 47 and skating with his new teammates.

But his return to Nashville is also very much about his old teammates, too: Defensemen Ryan Suter and Shea Weber, whose impending free agency has this franchise at a crossroads.

According to ESPN, Weber, the team's captain, was polled by Poile three weeks ago to make sure that Radulov's return didn't rock the dressing room's chemistry.

"He didn't want to bring a guy over that we're going to be shunning and not welcoming into our room," Weber told Pierre LeBrun. "He's the kind of player that we know what he's about, we played with him, he's a good kid, we're excited to get it going here."

In bringing back Radulov, the Predators have added a potent offensive player an arsenal that already ranks in the Top 10 for the NHL. Combine that with the moves the team made at the trade deadline — Andrei Kostitsyn, Hal Gill and Paul Gaustad among them — and Poile has aggressively built a contender in the West.

But are these moves also an attempt to convince Suter, an unrestricted free agent this summer, and Weber, a restricted free agent one year away from UFA status, to remain in Nashville?

"Absolutely," Poile said.

He said the Predators have made strides as a franchise, as a gate attraction and as Stanley Cup contender. Nashville brings Radulov back not only as a significant addition for this Cup run, but potentially as a piece of the core going forward.

"We've talked to him about hoping that this lasts longer, and I think he feels the same way," said Poile. "In conversations with Alex and his agent, there's no timetable. No pressure. If this is the right fit, that's great, and we'll live happily ever after."


So, up to "The Curfew", it was all about winning and appeasing Weber and Suter. My point is, missing curfew by 15 minutes, was a controllable circumstance for the organization. Blowing it out of proportion branded Rads a villain, lowered his market value, and probably pissed off Suter as evidence that we were playing by the Marquis of Queensbury Rules while the rest of the league kicks you in the groin to win at all costs. Kings trade for Carter after he party's too much for the BJs. He scores goals and they win the Cup. Why must we stitch the Scarlet "A" on Rads in public when we're trying to win playoff games and get max value for him either by signing him or trading him?

Rads is not Ray Rice or Pacman. No one will ever know what went on behind the scenes of him walking out on his contract. That said, by coming back in 2012, he lived up to his contract. It wasn't like we were paying him while he left. It suspended his contract until he returned.

Suter and Weber both liked playing with Rads the first and second time. It could have worked and it may have caused Suter to stay.

Good thing our Front Office and Coaching Staff wern't running the Yankees of the late 70's. There would have been no pennants. Too much divisiveness. Not enough choir boys.


Last edited by TMI: 02-21-2014 at 05:00 PM. Reason: add link. we have to provide links for these kinds of posts
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Old
02-20-2014, 06:19 PM
  #33
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A repeated offender of multiple rules, but it's all about the "curfew"?

The Wysh story is filled with "if" and "potentially" ... the bedrock of definitive reporting.

That's not including him swinging at his coach in Feb 2012.

It isn't about choir boys. If it were, Legwand wouldn't be here. It's about recognizing when the trouble outweighs the potential benefit.

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02-20-2014, 06:27 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
A repeated offender of multiple rules, but it's all about the "curfew"?

The Wysh story is filled with "if" and "potentially" ... the bedrock of definitive reporting.

That's not including him swinging at his coach in Feb 2012.

It isn't about choir boys. If it were, Legwand wouldn't be here. It's about recognizing when the trouble outweighs the potential benefit.
I guess where we differ is, I think the potential benefit outweighs the trouble. The benefit outweighed the trouble in his first two years here, and it could have again if handled right IMO. Maybe I'm so frustrated with Trotz trotting out a team of Spalings that I'm willing to take a flyer on a bad boy with talent.

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02-20-2014, 08:43 PM
  #35
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I just have to comment on this as it has bugged me since day one. Trotz never was and never will be the type of NHL coach who can handle a talented individual who doesn't fit his mold. If Trotz could put 4 lines of Spalings on the ice he would be happy. For those of you who hate Rads because he left us for the KHL you need to look yourself in the mirror because you are Hypocrites. If you were originally from Florida and after college took a job in Nashville for $40,000 a year, and than someone offered you a chance to move back home to Florida for $400,000 a year don't for a minute try to tell me you wouldn't, and you certainly wouldn't give two weeks notice either.
I don't hate Radulov for skipping town on his contract, but I definitely lost all respect for him at the time. Even if I hated him, how would that make me a hypocrite? I think you're using the wrong word here. See, I've never signed and broken a deal with an NHL team, pretended like it was OK and then turned around and villainized someone else for it. Hell, I've never signed a deal with an NHL team in the first place.

Please don't call people things like "hypocrites" for having opinions different from your own. You know what they actually are? People with opinions different from your own.

On topic: When Trotz told the media before the game that if the team won without Radulov and AK that he would go with the same line up I thought it was a terrible move. I've said it a million times; you don't lock yourself into a roster decision before seeing how the team plays the game.

At any rate, Radulov used up all of his good will when he bolted the first time. It's that simple. AK had no good will. He was a rental, plain and simple. Radulov, though, he could have been brought back had he come back in 2012 and shown signs of having grown up some. I'm guessing he simply didn't show that. There is no doubt in my mind that Poile not bringing him back wasn't just a decision he made because of some curfew violation.

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02-20-2014, 08:48 PM
  #36
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Do you guys lose his rights this offseason or is he already an UFA?

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02-20-2014, 08:50 PM
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Do you guys lose his rights this offseason or is he already an UFA?
We didn't tender him a qualifying offer as far as I know, so he is no longer the property of any NHL club, though I doubt he will ever be the property of any NHL club ever again.

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02-20-2014, 09:01 PM
  #38
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We didn't tender him a qualifying offer as far as I know, so he is no longer the property of any NHL club, though I doubt he will ever be the property of any NHL club ever again.
Agreed. He can't make that kind of money in the NHL so he's probably never coming back. That won't stop us Avs fans from talking about him though. Roy is still a big fan of is and was just talking him up on the radio this morning so we continue to hold out hope.

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02-20-2014, 09:33 PM
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We didn't tender him a qualifying offer as far as I know, so he is no longer the property of any NHL club, though I doubt he will ever be the property of any NHL club ever again.
since the NHL and KHL now respect each others contracts he will have to finish out his KHL deal before he could even consider returning to the NHL that would be the 2016-17 season.

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02-20-2014, 09:38 PM
  #40
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We didn't tender him a qualifying offer as far as I know, so he is no longer the property of any NHL club, though I doubt he will ever be the property of any NHL club ever again.
We did qualify him so technically he's our property until this summer. It's irrelevant though since he's in the middle of his KHL contract. I agree with you, he'll never be back.

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02-20-2014, 09:50 PM
  #41
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since the NHL and KHL now respect each others contracts he will have to finish out his KHL deal before he could even consider returning to the NHL that would be the 2016-17 season.
Exactly. There's no way he is going to bolt back to the NHL since there are actual punishments for that now. Though I guess he could always get an out-clause like he did when he came back in 2012.

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We did qualify him so technically he's our property until this summer. It's irrelevant though since he's in the middle of his KHL contract. I agree with you, he'll never be back.
Oh did we? I thought we didn't even qualify him.

I stand corrected.

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02-20-2014, 11:12 PM
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I guess where we differ is, I think the potential benefit outweighs the trouble. The benefit outweighed the trouble in his first two years here, and it could have again if handled right IMO. Maybe I'm so frustrated with Trotz trotting out a team of Spalings that I'm willing to take a flyer on a bad boy with talent.
A bad boy with talent who has shown his willingness to flaunt team rules, contract law, swing at a coach, and Federov called him out for his lack of discipline at CSKA after stripping him of the captaincy. That's just his recent history. When he returned, HE was the one essentially on probation for numerous rules violations ... not the other way around. HE then put himself above the team within weeks of returning to the US. HE had the opportunity to demonstrate he had grown up but proved he was still an immature, selfish, troublemaker instead.

This isn't Kane and the cab driver. It isn't Carter having the reputation as a party boy but still showing up to play. It isn't Legwand and the DUI. Radulov is a player who has shown he will run away and abandon his team ... will swing at a coach ... will place himself above the team repeatedly. I'm glad he only plays hockey for the entertainment of others and isn't in an important line of work where lives are on the line.

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02-20-2014, 11:13 PM
  #43
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We did qualify him so technically he's our property until this summer. It's irrelevant though since he's in the middle of his KHL contract. I agree with you, he'll never be back.
We qualified him in 2012. That lasted through summer 2013 ... when he was already under contract in the KHL. When that contract expires he is eligible for UFA status in the NHL.

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02-20-2014, 11:46 PM
  #44
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Its all about the master plan that has already started. Allot of you want a new gm and coach.. Well we brig back rads to take the coach out with a stick again.. And well webers already done the work on the gm... Dont be so short side people.

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02-21-2014, 12:46 AM
  #45
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Im a massive Radulov fan - Just so much talent and size in one package is hard to come by, but im just going to throw this out there regardless of what happened with him and Kostisyn when they were suspended for the playoffs that Nashville should have won against Phoenix, its all a moot point because unless Poille was offering 9 million a year tax free he was never going to re-sign.

Maybe try to get Nik Zherdev from the KHL apparently he wants to play NHL.

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02-21-2014, 01:15 AM
  #46
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Im a massive Radulov fan - Just so much talent and size in one package is hard to come by, but im just going to throw this out there regardless of what happened with him and Kostisyn when they were suspended for the playoffs that Nashville should have won against Phoenix, its all a moot point because unless Poille was offering 9 million a year tax free he was never going to re-sign.

Maybe try to get Nik Zherdev from the KHL apparently he wants to play NHL.
No thanks

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02-21-2014, 08:00 AM
  #47
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This isn't Kane and the cab driver. It isn't Carter having the reputation as a party boy but still showing up to play.
In theory, Carter was physically present for 39 Jackets games. In practice, he really only showed up for six of them.

Nowhere near Radulov's pattern of misbehavior, to be sure, but let's not pretend he was Perfectly Fine for the sake of the argument.

* * *
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Maybe try to get Nik Zherdev from the KHL apparently he wants to play NHL.
Words cannot adequately describe just how tremendously bad this idea would be. Radulov is simply immature and entitled, but he at least shows up to play most of the time. Zherdev is too lazy to even do that with regularity unless he's being constantly berated.

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02-21-2014, 10:39 AM
  #48
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We qualified him in 2012. That lasted through summer 2013 ... when he was already under contract in the KHL. When that contract expires he is eligible for UFA status in the NHL.
Qualifying offers expire much sooner than that, like sometime in July of that year I believe.

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02-21-2014, 02:17 PM
  #49
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Qualifying offers expire much sooner than that, like sometime in July of that year I believe.
The monetary value of the offer expires sooner, the team retaining rights to the player continues. Qualifying a player has multiple factors.

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02-21-2014, 04:22 PM
  #50
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The monetary value of the offer expires sooner, the team retaining rights to the player continues. Qualifying a player has multiple factors.
Yes but his RFA rights expire the summer of 2014, not 2013

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