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NO Comrie, no playoffs!!!

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Old
02-01-2004, 07:19 PM
  #26
deathbear
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as a non-oiler fan, please dont take offence to this but...

youre team is lost. completely. starting from the top, right down to the basement. lowe and mac are BRUTAL at what they do. i think you have a few good forwards, but your defence and goalie situations are brutal. and horcoff? that guy is horrible.

you give comrie a good raise and he wont have a bad attitude. thats my thinking anyway. but i guess he was already all of what, 23? may as well ship him for "the future." arent you sick of hearing that from your team already?!

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02-01-2004, 07:23 PM
  #27
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Where's the love for Todd Marchant? He's the guy that brought the leadership and team defense to the Oilers. If losing any one player is responsible for the Oiler's woes, it's Marchant more than anyone. Considering what the Oilers were willing to pay Comrie, and what they ended up paying Oates to replace him, they would have been better off biting the bullet this once and resigning Marchant.

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Old
02-01-2004, 07:35 PM
  #28
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very good point buffalo. hindsight is 20\20 of course however lowe looks like a goat right now.

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02-01-2004, 07:52 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deathbear
as a non-oiler fan, please dont take offence to this but...

youre team is lost. completely. starting from the top, right down to the basement. lowe and mac are BRUTAL at what they do. i think you have a few good forwards, but your defence and goalie situations are brutal. and horcoff? that guy is horrible.

you give comrie a good raise and he wont have a bad attitude. thats my thinking anyway. but i guess he was already all of what, 23? may as well ship him for "the future." arent you sick of hearing that from your team already?!
Its easy to say all of this after we've been slumping and are going through bad times, but its even harder to say that you're wrong....

Comrie got traded for the future...and as an Oiler fan I am absolutely sick of hearing about our 'future'....and our 'future' prospects don't look too outstanding anyways...Rita was once considered the best prospect not playing in the NHL, and how's he doing?? We might have some good prospects coming up, but we did have a 23 year old guy who scored 30+ goals for us....

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Old
02-01-2004, 08:15 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Buffaloed
Where's the love for Todd Marchant? He's the guy that brought the leadership and team defense to the Oilers. If losing any one player is responsible for the Oiler's woes, it's Marchant more than anyone. Considering what the Oilers were willing to pay Comrie, and what they ended up paying Oates to replace him, they would have been better off biting the bullet this once and resigning Marchant.
Brian Burke (Vancouver GM) said it best when he said $3M for a 3rd line checking centre? no way.

I claimed at the season start that the Oilers would not score 200 goals without those 2. If I'm wrong it's not going to be by much.

We don't know what the Oilers were willing to pay for Comrie. We know there was a qualifying offer at $1.13M and that Lowe and Comrie did not discuss money. Any after the fact claims by Lowe or Comrie regarding what they were willing to do are irrelvant since neither party communicated with the other.

 
Old
02-01-2004, 08:26 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buffaloed
Where's the love for Todd Marchant? He's the guy that brought the leadership and team defense to the Oilers. If losing any one player is responsible for the Oiler's woes, it's Marchant more than anyone. Considering what the Oilers were willing to pay Comrie, and what they ended up paying Oates to replace him, they would have been better off biting the bullet this once and resigning Marchant.
I don't think so. Marchant at 3 mil for 5 years or whatever is way too much. We need him now, but at the time he was surplus to requirements.

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Old
02-01-2004, 08:28 PM
  #32
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true and i lost sight of that when i posted. lest i forget this is the same guy who said the current cba is fine.

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02-02-2004, 04:54 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deathbear
as a non-oiler fan, please dont take offence to this but...

youre team is lost. completely. starting from the top, right down to the basement. lowe and mac are BRUTAL at what they do. i think you have a few good forwards, but your defence and goalie situations are brutal. and horcoff? that guy is horrible.

you give comrie a good raise and he wont have a bad attitude. thats my thinking anyway. but i guess he was already all of what, 23? may as well ship him for "the future." arent you sick of hearing that from your team already?!
Giving Comrie a good raise would have resulted in him making $4mil... And that's at 23... what is he going to want at 27?

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Old
02-02-2004, 04:56 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by dawgbone
Giving Comrie a good raise would have resulted in him making $4mil... And that's at 23... what is he going to want at 27?
A castle, because he always wanted to be a princess.

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Old
02-02-2004, 05:03 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dawgbone
Giving Comrie a good raise would have resulted in him making $4mil... And that's at 23... what is he going to want at 27?
The problem is Comrie DID NOT WANT TO PLAY FOR THE OILERS. It wouldn't have mattered how much Lowe would have offered, Comrie will have rejected. Rumours have it that Comrie wanted to be a big fish in a big pond.

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Old
02-02-2004, 05:21 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by ZIM
Lowe could have talked money with Comrie, he has admitted that they never discussed money, and, who knows, Comrie's hurt feelings might have then been set aside.
Comrie didn't want to play here - money or not. I'm sure they talked all the time. Lowe said he wanted him back.

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Originally Posted by ZIM
Lowe could have admitted that he had overeacted in criticizing Comrie after the playoff loss. Takes a big man to do that but for the sake of the team he could have done it. But he didn't do that either.
He criticized everyone. It's his right. His team was awful. He didn't overreact. The overreaction was on Comrie's part. He couldn't take it.

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Originally Posted by ZIM
Lowe could have stuck to his guns and kept him till he was 31. Or he could have kept him until the trade deadline.
Keeping him until he's 31 wouldn't have gotten a better player in return. And keeping him till the deadline wouldn't have guaranteed a better return. I'm sure it would have been worse.

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Originally Posted by ZIM
He could have allowed Comrie to go to training camp, similar to the Smyth situation.
Didn't Smyth have a contract when he came to camp?

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Originally Posted by ZIM
He played a brinkmanship game with Comrie/Winter by signing Oates and asking for $2.5M from Comrie.
Okay...

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Publically, Lowe let this situation get personal. What did he do in private, who knows because no one is talking.
Lowe didn't take anything public. It all came out on the other side. It was obviously personal before any of it came out anyway.

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Originally Posted by ZIM
Bottom line, a player said I want to leave and Lowe let him. Wonder what Hemsky's thinking? Probably this is going to be easy.

That's my short list on what a different GM could have done differently.
I don't see how any of that would have gotten a better return for Comrie. No one was going to pony up anything good for him. And, considering that, I think the Oilers got a pretty good deal. I don't see any way they were going to get a top player for Comrie. It was never going to happen, regardless of the GM.

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Old
02-02-2004, 06:32 AM
  #37
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What I'm saying is that with different actions by Lowe, like talking about money (you assume they talked all the time but Lowe stated he never talked to Comrie about money) or with a different GM Comrie wasn't going to leave. Comrie didn't just wake up one morning and decide to leave, he had issues, they talked, Lowe thought he was making progress, Comrie said I still want to leave and Lowe locked him out. Each escalation by Lowe (minimum offer, training camp, Oates, $2.5M) was designed to put pressure on Comrie but all it did was back Comrie further into a corner while at the same time lessening Lowe's bargaining position with the rest of the league.Both of them refused to back down, I don't know maybe it's a face saving thing. Ottawa and Minnesota faced similar situations this year and both managed to sign their RFAs. Could Lowe have acted diferently - no doubt.

Lowe may or may not have gotten the best deal for Comrie that he could have - I could care less - his correctable mistake was losing him in the first place.

 
Old
02-02-2004, 06:35 AM
  #38
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SeachD, I have never seen so many assumptions and blind faith in someone who is in a business that exudes spin as much as there was in that post. Kevin Lowe is not an innocent bystander who watched as a young player decided he'd leave just for kicks.

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02-02-2004, 06:58 AM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZIM
What I'm saying is that with different actions by Lowe, like talking about money (you assume they talked all the time but Lowe stated he never talked to Comrie about money) or with a different GM Comrie wasn't going to leave. Comrie didn't just wake up one morning and decide to leave, he had issues, they talked, Lowe thought he was making progress, Comrie said I still want to leave and Lowe locked him out. Each escalation by Lowe (minimum offer, training camp, Oates, $2.5M) was designed to put pressure on Comrie but all it did was back Comrie further into a corner while at the same time lessening Lowe's bargaining position with the rest of the league.Both of them refused to back down, I don't know maybe it's a face saving thing. Ottawa and Minnesota faced similar situations this year and both managed to sign their RFAs. Could Lowe have acted diferently - no doubt.

Lowe may or may not have gotten the best deal for Comrie that he could have - I could care less - his correctable mistake was losing him in the first place.
It never got to money because Comrie never had intentions of signing with Edmonton. He wanted out and no matter how much Lowe offered. Comrie wanted out. From reports I heard, Comrie wanted to be traded by the deadline. He asked again to be traded in the summer. He asked numerous times to be traded.

Here's a link of KL interview on a local radio station that was posted on Oilfans that brewerfan posted.

http://oilfans.com/forum/index.php?t...7378d4307400a1

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Old
02-02-2004, 07:04 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZIM
What I'm saying is that with different actions by Lowe, like talking about money (you assume they talked all the time but Lowe stated he never talked to Comrie about money) or with a different GM Comrie wasn't going to leave. Comrie didn't just wake up one morning and decide to leave, he had issues, they talked, Lowe thought he was making progress, Comrie said I still want to leave and Lowe locked him out. Each escalation by Lowe (minimum offer, training camp, Oates, $2.5M) was designed to put pressure on Comrie but all it did was back Comrie further into a corner while at the same time lessening Lowe's bargaining position with the rest of the league.Both of them refused to back down, I don't know maybe it's a face saving thing. Ottawa and Minnesota faced similar situations this year and both managed to sign their RFAs. Could Lowe have acted diferently - no doubt.

Lowe may or may not have gotten the best deal for Comrie that he could have - I could care less - his correctable mistake was losing him in the first place.
Similar? not a chance! Not by a long shot. Both of those players wanted to return to the city and the only thing they couldn't come to agree on was money. Money was the problem with Comrie - but I'm rather peeved this has come up AGAIN. Like some people can't let this thing die.

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Old
02-02-2004, 12:53 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by LoudmouthHemskyfan#1
SeachD, I have never seen so many assumptions and blind faith in someone who is in a business that exudes spin as much as there was in that post. Kevin Lowe is not an innocent bystander who watched as a young player decided he'd leave just for kicks.
1) Where did I say Lowe was an innocent bystander? The one thing he did do wrong was wait too long before he realized he'd never get Comrie signed.

2) Prove me wrong. Where are my assumptions? Did Comrie really want to play here? Is that your assumption? Did Comrie not demand a trade - multiple times - long before we started to realize he wouldn't be signed? And you think Lowe lowered Comrie's trade value? Right.

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Old
02-02-2004, 04:23 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by ZIM
Brian Burke (Vancouver GM) said it best when he said $3M for a 3rd line checking centre? no way.
The same was said about Mike Peca and the Sabres are looking at their 3rd straight non-playoff year. I think it just sucks the heart out of small market teams when they start to build something and the money's not there to finish the job. The players see that and know they're never going to win a cup and they show it with their lack of effort on the ice. A new CBA can't come soon enough.

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02-02-2004, 04:32 PM
  #43
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The same was said about Mike Peca and the Sabres are looking at their 3rd straight non-playoff year. I think it just sucks the heart out of small market teams when they start to build something and the money's not there to finish the job. The players see that and know they're never going to win a cup and they show it with their lack of effort on the ice. A new CBA can't come soon enough.
I am a Yankee fan so don't see money as an impediment to success. Unfortunately being in a small market NHL city shows me the opposite side and all I can say is it sucks. You develop the talent and it leaves. I am pessimistic about a new CBA because I cannot see the players giving up what they already have, I see the owners caving and the situation getting worse, probably in a contracted NHL.

 
Old
02-02-2004, 11:33 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seachd
1) Where did I say Lowe was an innocent bystander? The one thing he did do wrong was wait too long before he realized he'd never get Comrie signed.

2) Prove me wrong. Where are my assumptions? Did Comrie really want to play here? Is that your assumption? Did Comrie not demand a trade - multiple times - long before we started to realize he wouldn't be signed? And you think Lowe lowered Comrie's trade value? Right.
1) In your first two statements, and one near the end, you essentially claimed as much.

2) MY WHOLE POINT IS you can't prove ANYTHING about the situation. I'd really think people would get this by now. You and I both have no clue whether Comrie demanded a trade or not, and what his reasons would be for it if he did. Lowe did not capitalize IF (and that's a massive if) he did demand a trade (Comrie demanding a trade defies rationality unless something justifiable happened, and from all accounts, Mike Comrie isn't stupid or hate-filled). The smart GM trades him last year, or in the off-season before the storm hits, if it was truly the case that he wanted out. And if Lowe didn't know he wanted to leave, it's even more his fault as it's his job to have a handle on his players.

There are things that should've been done to keep him happy and keep him here, it's really that simple. This organization will suffer for years to come because of what happened this year.

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