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Old
02-23-2014, 10:20 AM
  #151
dulzhok
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Originally Posted by ThirdManIn View Post
Some of you guys do realize that Poile didn't build this roster by himself, right? There was a committee who had incredible input into who was and wasn't on the roster. The Poile bashing isn't anything new, but when the entire blame is being put on his shoulders for a meltdown that no one saw coming it's just a bit silly. How much credit was thrown his way for the Silver medal team in 2010?

Poile has his many flaws for sure, but come on. At least be fair about the criticism.
I don't see anyone saying the entire blame goes to Poile. No one.

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02-23-2014, 11:19 AM
  #152
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We had four lines of "balance, grit and character". And we had 0 goals.

are you sure about that? I only saw one. Do elaborate please

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02-23-2014, 11:44 AM
  #153
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The failure starts at the top and Poile had the final say. So yeah he deserves a share of the blame along with Burke and Shero.

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02-23-2014, 01:59 PM
  #154
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Originally Posted by hockey diva View Post
The failure starts at the top and Poile had the final say. So yeah he deserves a share of the blame along with Burke and Shero.
Im sorry but this is just complete bullcrap from you Poile haters.

The USA won its division, advanced to the semifinals, and lost a one goal game to the best team in the world, and you guys are acting like we had a tournament like 2006 in Torino.

Its the nature of single elimination, seeded draw tournaments that sometimes the two best teams meet before the finals. I believe that happened here. The bronze medal game was an embarrassment, but everything else before that was consistent with the USA being as good as anyone in the tourney.

The only roster change that might have affected the outcome of this tourney would have been to include a sacrificial goon to run Price on the first shift of the game and take him out and force Canada to play Louongo

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02-23-2014, 02:11 PM
  #155
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the roster outside of a player or two is so evident a monkey could pick it. The hemming and hawing came to taking Oshie, Pacioretty, and Wheeler over Bobby Ryan. And on D leaving Yandle off for Faulk, who didn't play until Martin got hurt. None of those guys embarrassed themselves. Maybe we call a spade a spade and say our country's best just couldn't beat Canada's best or Finland's best.

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02-23-2014, 02:12 PM
  #156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PredsV82 View Post
Im sorry but this is just complete bullcrap from you Poile haters.

The USA won its division, advanced to the semifinals, and lost a one goal game to the best team in the world, and you guys are acting like we had a tournament like 2006 in Torino.

Its the nature of single elimination, seeded draw tournaments that sometimes the two best teams meet before the finals. I believe that happened here. The bronze medal game was an embarrassment, but everything else before that was consistent with the USA being as good as anyone in the tourney.

The only roster change that might have affected the outcome of this tourney would have been to include a sacrificial goon to run Price on the first shift of the game and take him out and force Canada to play Louongo
Enh. I wouldn't have minded a few more PMDs to help address transition issues. Like, say, Yandle and JMFJ. (And couldn't Dustin Brown have played the sacrificial goon role? )

But yeah, this whole "SEE? SEE?!?! POILE IS FAIL! POILE MUST GO!!!!!111one" mishegaas is just absurd.

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02-23-2014, 03:21 PM
  #157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by token grinder View Post
the roster outside of a player or two is so evident a monkey could pick it. The hemming and hawing came to taking Oshie, Pacioretty, and Wheeler over Bobby Ryan. And on D leaving Yandle off for Faulk, who didn't play until Martin got hurt. None of those guys embarrassed themselves. Maybe we call a spade a spade and say our country's best just couldn't beat Canada's best or Finland's best.
Uuummm, I thought it had to do with the selections of Brooks Orpik over other dmen & Dustin Brown being more of the same player that Team USA had when in a short tournament you need as much firepower as you can get on the ice.

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02-23-2014, 04:42 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by PredsV82 View Post
The USA won its division, advanced to the semifinals, and lost a one goal game to the best team in the world, and you guys are acting like we had a tournament like 2006 in Torino.
One goal loss to the best team, but what about the other games. A shootout victory over the biggest flop of the tournament.

And that bronze game embarrasment doesn't help the case at all.



But what's with people trying to find the reason from the individuals?

Would Ryan really have made a difference?

You were unable to score a single goal in your last two games. With all that goal scoring talent you had already, do you guys really think that not having one more played a significant role in that?

Take Finland for example. Who there (skaters) has individual talent to match anyone from USA? Maybe it's a stronger teamwork mentality or commitment to the coaching system.
They know it's their only way to succeed with a team like that.

One may argue that everyone in team USA has the necessary commitment, but then again, do they? Talented players have different kind of roles in their clubs and if you're used to be doing what you do, it may be difficult to transit into a new system and to be just another piece of the puzzle.

Lesser talents on the other hand live by being able to defer to the coaching systems, so it doesn't require that much from them.

Pointing the blaming finger at the coaching department right away is not right. You have to take the commitment point of view into account first and THEN point that finger, blaming that the coaches were unable to make the players commit!

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02-23-2014, 05:22 PM
  #159
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gh24 View Post
One goal loss to the best team, but what about the other games. A shootout victory over the biggest flop of the tournament.

And that bronze game embarrasment doesn't help the case at all.



But what's with people trying to find the reason from the individuals?

Would Ryan really have made a difference?

You were unable to score a single goal in your last two games. With all that goal scoring talent you had already, do you guys really think that not having one more played a significant role in that?

Take Finland for example. Who there (skaters) has individual talent to match anyone from USA? Maybe it's a stronger teamwork mentality or commitment to the coaching system.
They know it's their only way to succeed with a team like that.

One may argue that everyone in team USA has the necessary commitment, but then again, do they? Talented players have different kind of roles in their clubs and if you're used to be doing what you do, it may be difficult to transit into a new system and to be just another piece of the puzzle.

Lesser talents on the other hand live by being able to defer to the coaching systems, so it doesn't require that much from them.

Pointing the blaming finger at the coaching department right away is not right. You have to take the commitment point of view into account first and THEN point that finger, blaming that the coaches were unable to make the players commit!
I actually think the problem is that the best americans only play together as a team every 4 years… all the other years the world championship teams are filled with players whose teams miss the playoffs and aren't nursing any injuries, etc. Whereas team Finland and Team Sweden often have a lot of the same players year in and year out and have a jump on gelling as a team.

Lack of team chemistry led to the Americans lack of offense.

Canada was almost as bad on offense, but had the talent to push through one goal when it really mattered.

if the NHL players do not participate in 2008, I would like to see the USA do like they did in the amateur days, get a team together in the summer prior and have them play and practice together for months before the games.

if the NHL does send players in 2018, I think putting as many teammates together as possible might help alleviate this problem a little bit

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02-23-2014, 08:03 PM
  #160
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Sorry to all the disappointed U.S. fans here, I thought you guys were the team to beat all tournament honestly and that semi final game was the toughest team Canada had to face. As probably one of the only Canadian preds fans here, I have to say Weber was really REALLY good. He looked like his old self out there the whole tournament. Hopefully the gold medal high carries over to the regular season and he goes out there to win his first Norris.

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02-23-2014, 08:22 PM
  #161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by token grinder View Post
the roster outside of a player or two is so evident a monkey could pick it. The hemming and hawing came to taking Oshie, Pacioretty, and Wheeler over Bobby Ryan. And on D leaving Yandle off for Faulk, who didn't play until Martin got hurt. None of those guys embarrassed themselves. Maybe we call a spade a spade and say our country's best just couldn't beat Canada's best or Finland's best.
nah, its all on poile.....

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02-24-2014, 12:56 AM
  #162
dulzhok
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Originally Posted by PredsV82 View Post
I actually think the problem is that the best americans only play together as a team every 4 years… all the other years the world championship teams are filled with players whose teams miss the playoffs and aren't nursing any injuries, etc. Whereas team Finland and Team Sweden often have a lot of the same players year in and year out and have a jump on gelling as a team.
Swedes and Fins don't make the playoffs? Huh? Last I checked, guys like Sedins, Zetterberg, Alfredsson, Rask, ETC were pretty good at making the playoffs.

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02-24-2014, 01:10 AM
  #163
dulzhok
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Originally Posted by PredsV82 View Post
Im sorry but this is just complete bullcrap from you Poile haters.

The USA won its division, advanced to the semifinals, and lost a one goal game to the best team in the world, and you guys are acting like we had a tournament like 2006 in Torino.

Its the nature of single elimination, seeded draw tournaments that sometimes the two best teams meet before the finals. I believe that happened here. The bronze medal game was an embarrassment, but everything else before that was consistent with the USA being as good as anyone in the tourney.

The only roster change that might have affected the outcome of this tourney would have been to include a sacrificial goon to run Price on the first shift of the game and take him out and force Canada to play Louongo
Failure to acknowledge that guys Ryan and Yandle might have helped score a goal vs Canada is just that. Poile went safe over skill with those selections. He also went safe and familiar with Bylamsa.

The Martin injury is exactly why you bring a guy like Yandle. Our top 2 d scores (Yandle, Buff) sitting at home meanwhile kids are roaming the US blue line.

It might not have helped, but I can tell you that the "safe" selections certainly did not help and it was one boring game from the US. And all these "character" guys we had vs Finland were an embarrassment.

It's not Poile's fault, but his mark was on the team, no doubt. A mark we are all too familiar with.


Last edited by dulzhok: 02-24-2014 at 09:36 AM.
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02-24-2014, 02:07 AM
  #164
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But lets not forget that there is another game, the games aren't over, the US can still get a medal!!! A lot of people had predictions all over for the US, from Gold to a 5th place finish. And considering their history on international ice, a medal of any kind would be a success. Bring that medal home US and prove a lot of doubters wrong. USA USA USA!!!
wow.





Quote:
Originally Posted by PredsV82 View Post
I actually think the problem is that the best americans only play together as a team every 4 years… all the other years the world championship teams are filled with players whose teams miss the playoffs and aren't nursing any injuries, etc. Whereas team Finland and Team Sweden often have a lot of the same players year in and year out and have a jump on gelling as a team.
I don't really think that should matter. So many players know each other now and have played with each other either in juniors/college or minor leagues. This US team gelled pretty quick. The original roster for Sweden, except for one player, was all NHL players (though I don't know where the injury replacement players came from, but I think they were NHLers, too).

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02-24-2014, 02:53 PM
  #165
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So you're telling me I'll be stick handling the puck like Backstrom if I take this?




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Old
02-24-2014, 03:16 PM
  #166
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Awesome.

BTW, congrats on the gold, Everlong.


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02-24-2014, 03:55 PM
  #167
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Blaming Poile for it is rather stupid, there was more than enough talent on that team to win it. The US and Canada went toe to toe and the US blinked while Canada didn't.

The game against Finland is just one of those things you see all the time in sports. One team is expecting to be playing for the Gold, the championship, or whatever and comes up short. They then proceed to get blown out in the consolation game because they don't give a crap. From High school to college to the Pros you see it all the time, and that pretty much what it was. Finland wanted it, the US didn't care.

Could we play the what if game and say if we would of took this one guy he could of scored one goal? Yeah sure, odds are though it wouldn't have mattered.

Russia had the best players in the Olympics in 1980, and it didn't matter. Sometimes winning hockey game has less to do with stats and skills and more to do with luck and wanting it more.

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