HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > The Rink
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
The Rink For the not so ready for prime-time players, coaches, referees, and the people that have to live with them. Discuss experiences in local leagues, coaching tips, equipment, and training.

New skates, edge problem

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
03-04-2014, 11:54 PM
  #1
damack
Registered User
 
damack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Country: Canada
Posts: 174
vCash: 490
New skates, edge problem

I'm a fairly new skater, I started on Bauer Vapor X3.0 and developed fairly good technique but they hurt my feet. After a couple of months of pain I picked up some Bauer Supreme One.6's. The pain is completely gone but it almost feels like I have to learn my edges again. It feels like when gliding my foot wants to sit towards the outside edge. When I pushing into my stroke, I'm getting some slippage unless I really concentrate on finding that inside edge. I've slid out a few times doing crossovers by losing the inside edge on my outside foot.

Is this normal when changing skates? I was kind of shocked at the difference, I previously had pretty good edge control and now it's significantly different. Both skates are sharpened with the same cut (5/8) by the same guy who is a sharpening guru.

damack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-05-2014, 02:23 AM
  #2
AntsSheffield
Registered User
 
AntsSheffield's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 178
vCash: 500
You just gotta just get used to those edges again in the new skates

AntsSheffield is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
03-05-2014, 02:53 AM
  #3
Lonny Bohonos
Kassian = P.A.G.A.N
 
Lonny Bohonos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Country: United Nations
Posts: 7,945
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by damack View Post
I'm a fairly new skater, I started on Bauer Vapor X3.0 and developed fairly good technique but they hurt my feet. After a couple of months of pain I picked up some Bauer Supreme One.6's. The pain is completely gone but it almost feels like I have to learn my edges again. It feels like when gliding my foot wants to sit towards the outside edge. When I pushing into my stroke, I'm getting some slippage unless I really concentrate on finding that inside edge. I've slid out a few times doing crossovers by losing the inside edge on my outside foot.

Is this normal when changing skates? I was kind of shocked at the difference, I previously had pretty good edge control and now it's significantly different. Both skates are sharpened with the same cut (5/8) by the same guy who is a sharpening guru.
Is the new skate boot stiffer than the old one?

The Supremes and Vapors may be different in shape and fit the foot differently. Not sure exactly with those two models but I do know Bauer lines are different fits from each other just as different skate brands fit differently from each other.

Lonny Bohonos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-05-2014, 08:15 AM
  #4
AIREAYE
Moderator
 
AIREAYE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Country: China
Posts: 3,372
vCash: 500
Alrite, here's something you can do right now: Check the holder alignment and how it sits. Make sure that it's centered by looking at it from the back. If the centre line of the holder/steel is close to the apparent centre line of the boot, then you should be fine, but if it's off like this
(_)
//

Then you know that it's the problem and would be a warranty issue.

AIREAYE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-05-2014, 09:53 AM
  #5
Coachtdoig
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: London, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 49
vCash: 500
Its not crazy to feel a little weird from moving from old skates to new skates especially if they are different models.

It could be several things that are throwing you off in my opinion:

1) The actual blade size on your new skates will be higher as the blade on your old skates will be worn down from numerous sharpens, that will make it feel slightly different.

2) The stiffness of the boot, a brand new skate is going to be significantly stiffer then your old boot and you might feel a little more restricted in your range of motion for the first while. That can be a factor when trying to use both sides of your edges.

3) Something rare but not crazy is the blade could be slightly bent on your new skates. So, turning one way you might feel like you are slipping or not able to get a good full push when taking strides.

Ciao,
TD

Coachtdoig is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-05-2014, 10:13 AM
  #6
matix218
Registered User
 
matix218's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 44
vCash: 500
What is the size difference between your old and new skates, specifically did you move up or down in holder/blade size?

I know for a fact that it can be very awkward at first when adjusting to a shorter or longer blade. (generally when going from a longer blade to shorter blade you will feel like you are toe-diving too much and going from shorter to longer you will feel much more on your heels generally speaking from what i have personally experienced)

Also if your old skates had the steel sharpened down really low the shape and height of the steel is much different than on a brand new set of steel, even if the holders are the same size.

One of these are most likely the cause of your problems.

Personally i have gotten to the point that whatever skate boot i use i just get my holder/steel of choice put on them (which for me personally is the CCM E-Pro size 271, simply because over the years i have become very used to it). So even on my current easton S17 skates which come stock with a size 263 Easton Razorblades holder/steel, i have had them mounted up with my 271 Epro, making the transition to those skates much less awkward. That is just my personal preference though, every one is different.

matix218 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-05-2014, 10:30 AM
  #7
damack
Registered User
 
damack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Country: Canada
Posts: 174
vCash: 490
Quote:
Originally Posted by matix218 View Post
What is the size difference between your old and new skates, specifically did you move up or down in holder/blade size?

I know for a fact that it can be very awkward at first when adjusting to a shorter or longer blade. (generally when going from a longer blade to shorter blade you will feel like you are toe-diving too much and going from shorter to longer you will feel much more on your heels generally speaking from what i have personally experienced)

Also if your old skates had the steel sharpened down really low the shape and height of the steel is much different than on a brand new set of steel, even if the holders are the same size.

One of these are most likely the cause of your problems.

Personally i have gotten to the point that whatever skate boot i use i just get my holder/steel of choice put on them (which for me personally is the CCM E-Pro size 271, simply because over the years i have become very used to it). So even on my current easton S17 skates which come stock with a size 263 Easton Razorblades holder/steel, i have had them mounted up with my 271 Epro, making the transition to those skates much less awkward. That is just my personal preference though, every one is different.
Same size skate (8.5d), not sure if the holder/blade size differs between model lines. The old skates were only 2 months old, been sharpened 3 times, I'm not sure that would be noticeable.

I had a look at the boot/holder alignment, it looks straight. I'm fully willing to accept that there is an adjustment period and it's just me. This is only the second pair of skates I've owned and I re-learned to skate (after 35 years off the ice) on the first pair. So I've never experienced the change between models before.

damack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
03-05-2014, 10:55 AM
  #8
matix218
Registered User
 
matix218's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 44
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by damack View Post
Same size skate (8.5d), not sure if the holder/blade size differs between model lines. The old skates were only 2 months old, been sharpened 3 times, I'm not sure that would be noticeable.

I had a look at the boot/holder alignment, it looks straight. I'm fully willing to accept that there is an adjustment period and it's just me. This is only the second pair of skates I've owned and I re-learned to skate (after 35 years off the ice) on the first pair. So I've never experienced the change between models before.
It is not un heard of for 2 skates (even same manufacturer like yours) in the same size from 2 different lines to have different holder sizes, although i would say it is quite unlikely that would be the case.

Maybe it is just the way the boot itself pitches you? I know supremes have more of a neutral-to-heel biased stance and vapors have a more aggressive forward lean so it is possible that it is just getting used to the stance of a supreme vs a vapor.

Given that your old skates were only cut 3 times i would say that assuming they are the same size blade (which i am sure they probably are) that the difference in the blade shape/height would be almost nothing.

It must just be the difference in the way the boot is cut.

matix218 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-02-2014, 08:38 AM
  #9
cmjohnson77
Rookie User
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Holly, MI
Posts: 3
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by damack View Post
I'm fully willing to accept that there is an adjustment period and it's just me. This is only the second pair of skates I've owned and I re-learned to skate (after 35 years off the ice) on the first pair. So I've never experienced the change between models before.
I had the same experience. I recently switched from Supremes to Vapors and found that I basically had to learn to skate again.
I first learned to skate and played a few pick up games in Supremes. They never felt right; too wide and too long. So I gave Vapors a try and found them to be a much better fit. After a heat molding and a punch out of a few spots, they're glorious.
However, there was a learning curve for me. I had to learn how to do most of the basics over again. It took a about 3 open skate sessions to get back to where I was. However now becoming an even better skater because of having a proper fitting skate.

cmjohnson77 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-02-2014, 09:32 AM
  #10
hyster110
Registered User
 
hyster110's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 871
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coachtdoig View Post
Its not crazy to feel a little weird from moving from old skates to new skates especially if they are different models.

It could be several things that are throwing you off in my opinion:

1) The actual blade size on your new skates will be higher as the blade on your old skates will be worn down from numerous sharpens, that will make it feel slightly different.

2) The stiffness of the boot, a brand new skate is going to be significantly stiffer then your old boot and you might feel a little more restricted in your range of motion for the first while. That can be a factor when trying to use both sides of your edges.

3) Something rare but not crazy is the blade could be slightly bent on your new skates. So, turning one way you might feel like you are slipping or not able to get a good full push when taking strides.

Ciao,
TD
the blade alignment could be slightly off. did they check that when you bought theM

hyster110 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-04-2014, 11:48 AM
  #11
goonx
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 770
vCash: 500
did you get them profiled?

if not, that's the first thing you should always do when you get new steels. It costs $30 but your skates come off massive assembly lines with variation.

that way, everytime you get new skates, you know you are skating on "your" profile.

Supremes have power blades which are longer.

goonx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-04-2014, 01:55 PM
  #12
AIREAYE
Moderator
 
AIREAYE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Country: China
Posts: 3,372
vCash: 500
Not necessarily, profiling is a process involving the exchange of feedback from sharpener and skater. It's not a necessary procedure for most people as most skaters are not able to identify what they want specifically enough anyways.

Only the One. 8 and One. 9 have the 2.1 Power steel, which is the same 9ft radius. His One.6 had stock stainless steel at 9ft.

AIREAYE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2014, 10:02 AM
  #13
goonx
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 770
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by AIREAYE View Post
Not necessarily, profiling is a process involving the exchange of feedback from sharpener and skater. It's not a necessary procedure for most people as most skaters are not able to identify what they want specifically enough anyways.

Only the One. 8 and One. 9 have the 2.1 Power steel, which is the same 9ft radius. His One.6 had stock stainless steel at 9ft.
There is enough variation though between the factory blades that the reason why someone would feel "different" on their skate is because of the factory profile. (the difference is only a few degrees)

That's why it's a good ideal to profile the skates knowing that your old vs new steel is the same. Whether everyone appreciates or utilize the profile as you said is a different story.

People might not know what they want, but they can tell when the profile is different when they feel their skates are "weird"

goonx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2014, 11:08 AM
  #14
AussieFlyersFan
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Vancouver
Country: Australia
Posts: 13
vCash: 500
You said you are a fairly new skater, perhaps try going to a deeper cut like a 1/2 or 3/8 to build up that confidence in your edges.

AussieFlyersFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2014, 12:17 PM
  #15
damack
Registered User
 
damack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Country: Canada
Posts: 174
vCash: 490
Thanks for the advice everyone

All is well after 6 or so skates, it was just a bit of a different feel and took a bit to adjust to. It's likely something that an experienced skater would just shrug off, but as a new skater it made a few things more difficult for a bit.

damack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-05-2014, 04:00 PM
  #16
mikitas donut
The Hammer!
 
mikitas donut's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Northern Illinois
Country: United States
Posts: 1,812
vCash: 500
I learned to skate in the Bauer Vapor X:30s from 2010. I got Vapor X:5.0s last year and they took some getting used to. Same size and width, but the 5.0 boot felt a little a little longer. The runners and holders were longer as well so I had to relearn a few things.

mikitas donut is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-07-2014, 05:56 PM
  #17
HiEverybody
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 39
vCash: 500
I started skating a year ago, and have been playing some type of hockey (inline, ice, ball, public) on average 4-5 times a week since then. I'm one of the faster skaters in the league, but I'm probably one of the weaker skaters overall if that makes any sense. I can get up and go straight as well as most, but when it comes to stopping, cutting, transitioning or turning there's a significant drop off. One of the things I've noticed at public skating sessions is that when I try to use my edges, it sounds like a dying whale. I don't really know how to describe it, but instead of that nice, crisp, crunchy, ripping noise most skaters get, I get a prolonged, wailing type sound. Anyone have a similar experience?

As to the OP, I've had a similar experience, but I was going from the Nexus 400s to the Vapor x7.0s. Not only is the skate super stiff, but I feel as though I'm on the outside edge of my skates in the Vapors, where as the Nexus feel fine. I'm not going to pretend that I know the answer, but at least you aren't alone! I think as most people suggested, it's just something you'll need to get used too.

HiEverybody is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-15-2014, 03:28 PM
  #18
damack
Registered User
 
damack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Country: Canada
Posts: 174
vCash: 490
Quote:
Originally Posted by damack View Post
Thanks for the advice everyone

All is well after 6 or so skates, it was just a bit of a different feel and took a bit to adjust to. It's likely something that an experienced skater would just shrug off, but as a new skater it made a few things more difficult for a bit.
so while it has been getting better, I thought I would ask my sharpener to check the alignment today when I took them in. He had me stand with my skates on, knees bent and took a few pictures of how my skates were. He started to smirk when he showed me. Both skates are out of alignment, not just vertically but along the length of the skate. He described what should happen with them the way they are and it's pretty much what I'm experiencing. So he's going to fix them. I asked if this was common, he laughed and said he does 6-8 pairs of Bauer skates a week.

We will see if things improve for me.

damack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
04-18-2014, 01:58 AM
  #19
g04tm4n
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Country: South Africa
Posts: 64
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by HiEverybody View Post
I started skating a year ago, and have been playing some type of hockey (inline, ice, ball, public) on average 4-5 times a week since then. I'm one of the faster skaters in the league, but I'm probably one of the weaker skaters overall if that makes any sense. I can get up and go straight as well as most, but when it comes to stopping, cutting, transitioning or turning there's a significant drop off. One of the things I've noticed at public skating sessions is that when I try to use my edges, it sounds like a dying whale. I don't really know how to describe it, but instead of that nice, crisp, crunchy, ripping noise most skaters get, I get a prolonged, wailing type sound. Anyone have a similar experience?

As to the OP, I've had a similar experience, but I was going from the Nexus 400s to the Vapor x7.0s. Not only is the skate super stiff, but I feel as though I'm on the outside edge of my skates in the Vapors, where as the Nexus feel fine. I'm not going to pretend that I know the answer, but at least you aren't alone! I think as most people suggested, it's just something you'll need to get used too.
I get a similar experience when my blades become dull, and the ripping noise you are referring to is replaced by a longer, sliding noise. If that is the case however, you will feel like you are losing your edges on crossovers.

g04tm4n is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:17 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.