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Old
02-24-2007, 09:30 PM
  #26
Whitesnake
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LesHabsRock View Post
With all due respect, I still don't understand why you believe Montreal should be sellers unless you don't want them to be in the playoffs. I understand you created this thread for those who buy into your theory, but you can't expect a thread like this to stick without some sort of debate. That's the point of forums is to discuss or debate hockey issues.

Montreal is in 8th spot after the Isles game. They're only a few points out of 5th. Montreal is in the playoffs and, therefore, should be buying a player to move higher in the standings with 18 games remaining. If they trade Souray that means they've given up on the season. Unless you're Washington or Philly in the East you're a buyer.

The Calgary Flames are 8th place in the West. Should they also be sellers?
Well, let's defined sellers. Let's say that nonsense trade that was supposed to happen, Souray for Carle and Pavelski, how can you tell me we're not going to make the playoffs 'cause of that trade. But then Souray for 2 1st round picks won't help right now, on the contrary, it means Niinimaa in the lineup.....But in both cases, you're a seller.

Now as far as the Flames being sellers compared to the Habs. I personnaly believe it has nothing to do with the standings but with the identity of a team going in the playoffs. Calgary may have the same formula than the Oilers had last year. Some grit, some speed, some clutch scoring and, even though he's kinda of struggling, a great great goalie. So Kipper saves their ass, Jerome with couple of clutch scoring, great defense and Calgary could do a lot of damage.

But could you seriously think we have all the elements to do so? We know we should see less penalties. How can we suddenly become a great 5 on 5 team? Does Halak or Aebi compare to Kiprusoff? Where's the grit? Clutch scoring, maybe with Kovy. But I don't see the recipe. So my take would be the sell, to have the vision to build a much better team for next year and years to come. We know it will always be more difficult to attract UFA's out here. We need to build via trades and draft and right now, you have amazing assets to achieve that with our UFA'S and maybe a guy like Kovy especially with the playoffs coming......especially if O'Brien means 1st round pick and/or especially if Zhitnik = Coburn.

Besides, I always thought that good buyers would mean 1 or 2 missing pieces to the puzzle to do relative damage. Are we really 1 or 2 missing pieces from the puzzle away????


Last edited by Whitesnake: 02-24-2007 at 09:40 PM.
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Old
02-24-2007, 09:55 PM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Well, let's defined sellers. Let's say that nonsense trade that was supposed to happen, Souray for Carle and Pavelski, how can you tell me we're not going to make the playoffs 'cause of that trade. But then Souray for 2 1st round picks won't help right now, on the contrary, it means Niinimaa in the lineup.....But in both cases, you're a seller.

Now as far as the Flames being sellers compared to the Habs. I personnaly believe it has nothing to do with the standings but with the identity of a team going in the playoffs. Calgary may have the same formula than the Oilers had last year. Some grit, some speed, some clutch scoring and, even though he's kinda of struggling, a great great goalie. So Kipper saves their ass, Jerome with couple of clutch scoring, great defense and Calgary could do a lot of damage.

But could you seriously think we have all the elements to do so? We know we should see less penalties. How can we suddenly become a great 5 on 5 team? Does Halak or Aebi compare to Kiprusoff? Where's the grit? Clutch scoring, maybe with Kovy. But I don't see the recipe. So my take would be the sell, to have the vision to build a much better team for next year and years to come. We know it will always be more difficult to attract UFA's out here. We need to build via trades and draft and right now, you have amazing assets to achieve that with our UFA'S and maybe a guy like Kovy especially with the playoffs coming......especially if O'Brien means 1st round pick and/or especially if Zhitnik = Coburn.

Besides, I always thought that good buyers would mean 1 or 2 missing pieces to the puzzle to do relative damage. Are we really 1 or 2 missing pieces from the puzzle away????
Agree 100%.

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Old
02-24-2007, 10:14 PM
  #28
ChuckyToGally
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Here is the trade of the year:

To ANA: Sheldon Souray and Michael Ryder

To CHI: Corey Perry and ANA 3rd round pick

To MTL: Brent Seabrook and TB 1st round pick

This trade makes Anaheim stronger and legit Cup contender.

Chicago gets a good young center as they apparently want.

We get a potential franchise d-man and about the 20th pick overall.

Thoughts?

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Old
02-24-2007, 10:47 PM
  #29
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I'm all for selling but I just DON"T see Gainey selling...because the management and the owner are serious and they want to go far in playoffs. Gainey won't be allowed to sell this year because nothing is over till' it's over.

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Old
02-24-2007, 11:02 PM
  #30
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sell!

it's time to blowup the nucleus of this team, just like they did in vancouver.

they can't take us to promise land, sick and tired of seeing habs squeeze into the playoffs only to lose in 1st or 2nd round.

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Old
02-24-2007, 11:07 PM
  #31
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I could see the habs as somewhere in between buyers and sellers. Basically, we'd be looking to get rid of our impending UFAs but for some younger players who are already in the nhl, not picks and prospects...

I don't know why, but i could see us being part of a 3-way deal involving Anaheim and Columbus, as kind of a middle-man.

Anaheim is looking for Defense and want to win now (Souray rumored there)
Columbus is unloading some of their players and are looking for picks
Montreal is unsure what we want to be, but know that losing our UFAs at the end of the year when it doesnt look like we'd win a cup anyways this year is just bad business.

What about a deal revolving around Souray, Zherdev and the Tampa 1st?

not sure what all the parties would have to add, but it seems like all 3 teams could address their needs with the right additions

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Old
02-24-2007, 11:08 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LesHabsRock View Post
Yo're right, inthat, anything can happen come playoff time. Montreal had been the victim of unfortunate circumstances is recent years. Last year, don't you think they had a shot at beating Carolina in the first round until the loss of Koivu? I really think the Habs can and will turn it up in the playoffs.

Your opinion on the Flames/Habs comparison is bias. Of course, you can say that about mine, but the fact is the Flames roster isn't that much better than the Habs and they're 8th.

Like another poster said, the Habs can be semi-sellers, meaning upgrading on guys like Bonk, Niinnima, Aebischer, etc without affecting the core of the team. Trading a guy like Souray will not improve the Habs.
So you are saying that keeping Souray for 20 more games and watching him walk in the summer improves this organization?

I have lived in Calgary for 8 years now, and though I am NOT a flames fan at all (i tend to cheer for Edmonton in the battle of alberta that is so huge over here), I love hockey so I follow their team, by default since I listen to lots of sports radio and read both papers daily... bit of a sports junky really)
If I am biased (which I probably am), it's for the habs... The habs are in my blood, pure and simple, and follow the team religiously (listen to every game I can on the radio, "waste" way too much time following the team on this and other message boars.

Bottom line is that the Flames, though their record is similar, and though I would NEVER EVER concede it to any of the Calgarians I live and work with, have a team much closer to cup contention than ours is... we have much better organizational depth prospect wise, not even close really, but as for NHL ready players, they have more talent currently in their lineup imo...

going by this year's play (not considering potential)
C:
Koivu = Langkow (only cuz Langkow plays with Iggy,otherwise, +16 vs -14 (Saku)
Pleks = Lombardi
Bonk = Conroy (only if we assume Bonk= better defensively, cuz Conroy scores more)
Yelle >> Lapierre/Milroy/Begin
edge- Calgary

RW:
Ryder<<<<<<<< Iginla (Iggy is one of the leagues best)
Kovy >> Amonte
Johson >> Moss
Lats = Ritchie
edge- Calgary (we have better depth, but I doubt you'd hesitate to swap our RW's and then some to have Iginla on our team)

LW:
HIggins <<<<Tanguay (in a few years, different story, right now it's not even close)
Samsonov <<<< Huselius (man do I wish we had picked Huselius off waivers last year, i think i posted about it at the time, I had a feeling he had this kind of play in him... and no, he doesnt play with Iginla usually)
Perez >> Friesen
Streit > Primeau (put streit here instead of on D, cuz we can and he's better than murray/downey)
edge- Calgary

Defense:
Markov = Phaneuf (probably get flamed anywhere outside the habs board for saying this, but Markov is damn good even if phaneuf hits/scores more)
Souray > Hamrlik (Hamrlik is much better Defensively, but Souray is a PP monster)
Komi << Regher (I hope Komi can reach regehr's level in his prime)
Rivet = Warrener (if only rivet could play more like he did last year I wouldnt feel like such a homer for calling this one a draw)
Dandy < Stuart
bouillion < Giordano

edge Calgary

Goalie
Huet < Kipprusoff
abischer > mclennan
edge calgary

I don't really see how anyone could argue that the flames roster isn't clearly better than ours right now... If the flames didn't have this mysterious inability to win on the road, they'd easily be among the top 4-5 teams in the league.

so anyways, you may disagree with my opinion on the two teams, but I have a feeling I am much mrore familiar with Calgary than you are... I guess you could try to argue that I am actually a closet flames fan or something, but I have a feeling if you asked anyone familiar with both teams, who was not a fan of either, there's a good chance they'd say my comparison was a little biased towards montreal.
edge Calgary


Last edited by Miller Time: 02-25-2007 at 12:00 AM. Reason: forgot that this isnt pac man
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Old
02-24-2007, 11:33 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post

Defense:
Markov = Phaneuf (probably get flamed anywhere outside the habs board for saying this, but Markov is damn good even if phaneuf hits/scores more)
Souray < Hamrlik (Hamrlik is much better Defensively, but Souray is a PP monster)
Komi >> Regher (I hope Komi can reach regehr's level in his prime)
Rivet = Warrener (if only rivet could play more like he did last year I wouldnt feel like such a homer for calling this one a draw)
Dandy > Stuart
bouillion > Giordano

edge Calgary

Goalie
Huet > Kipprusoff
abischer < mclennan
edge calgary

I don't really see how anyone could argue that the flames roster isn't clearly better than ours right now... If the flames didn't have this mysterious inability to win on the road, they'd easily be among the top 4-5 teams in the league.
I don't know how long it has been you have done maths but you have your bigger/smaller signs all messed up, a < b --> b is bigger/better than a, just look at the symbol and the side that is open is the bigger side if it can help you remember.

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Old
02-24-2007, 11:38 PM
  #34
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I think you made the wrong <;> sign in some comparisons in you post.

I'm watching Calgary now, and hell are they fast. In no way do we compare to this team. We don't have a Iginla, a Tanguay, a Phaneuf or a Kiprussof. Lombardi is impressive too, really fast.

Imo they're a good example of a team that could add one or two pieces and make a really good run in the playoffs. We're far from that.

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Old
02-24-2007, 11:57 PM
  #35
Miller Time
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Originally Posted by SpreeEndaz View Post
I don't know how long it has been you have done maths but you have your bigger/smaller signs all messed up, a < b --> b is bigger/better than a, just look at the symbol and the side that is open is the bigger side if it can help you remember.
my bad... brain cramp

Quote:
Originally Posted by Burnside_1 View Post
I think you made the wrong <;> sign in some comparisons in you post.

I'm watching Calgary now, and hell are they fast. In no way do we compare to this team. We don't have a Iginla, a Tanguay, a Phaneuf or a Kiprussof. Lombardi is impressive too, really fast.

Imo they're a good example of a team that could add one or two pieces and make a really good run in the playoffs. We're far from that.
yeah, I know... watching the game as i wrote that reply. They're window is now and next year, after that they may be in some trouble cuz they will have several key guys looking to cash in with bigger contracts, and like i mentioned, they don't have a great group of prospects... a few decent ones, but not many.

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Old
02-25-2007, 02:00 AM
  #36
LesHabsRock
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Well, let's defined sellers. Let's say that nonsense trade that was supposed to happen, Souray for Carle and Pavelski, how can you tell me we're not going to make the playoffs 'cause of that trade. But then Souray for 2 1st round picks won't help right now, on the contrary, it means Niinimaa in the lineup.....But in both cases, you're a seller.

Now as far as the Flames being sellers compared to the Habs. I personnaly believe it has nothing to do with the standings but with the identity of a team going in the playoffs. Calgary may have the same formula than the Oilers had last year. Some grit, some speed, some clutch scoring and, even though he's kinda of struggling, a great great goalie. So Kipper saves their ass, Jerome with couple of clutch scoring, great defense and Calgary could do a lot of damage.

But could you seriously think we have all the elements to do so? We know we should see less penalties. How can we suddenly become a great 5 on 5 team? Does Halak or Aebi compare to Kiprusoff? Where's the grit? Clutch scoring, maybe with Kovy. But I don't see the recipe. So my take would be the sell, to have the vision to build a much better team for next year and years to come. We know it will always be more difficult to attract UFA's out here. We need to build via trades and draft and right now, you have amazing assets to achieve that with our UFA'S and maybe a guy like Kovy especially with the playoffs coming......especially if O'Brien means 1st round pick and/or especially if Zhitnik = Coburn.

Besides, I always thought that good buyers would mean 1 or 2 missing pieces to the puzzle to do relative damage. Are we really 1 or 2 missing pieces from the puzzle away????
We did with much less talent and less experienced young players. There's no reason to believe the Canadiens can't get hot and grab 6th or 7th spot. If all my years following the Habs tells me anything it's to expect the unexpected. Just when you think they're down and out they come up with a way to win and even surprise fans in the playoffs. Did you honestly believe they'de beat Nashville and in the fashion they did by coming from behind on their home ice? Is Calgary better than Montreal or more playoff ready? I'm not so sure of that either. It's all a matter of opinion. To say Calgary is definitely better than the Habs is a little absurd.

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Old
02-25-2007, 02:10 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by philosophical___ View Post
for a team that is close to the cap, souray is strictly a rental. there's very little chance the ducks would re-sign sheldon. he's going to get ridiculously overpaid.
One of the CKAC sports hotline hosts, maybe Christian Gauthier, suggested that the Habs keep Souray, re-sign him to a market value contract, and then engage a Defence coach to work with Souray and the REST of the defence corps to improve their play from the red line back to the end boards. He feels that the work will pay off handsomely for the club.

Sounded interesting. As a coach myself, I know that player selection is at best only half the battle. It is SOOO important to obtain IMPROVEMENT through coaching afterwards.

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Old
02-25-2007, 02:11 AM
  #38
LesHabsRock
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So you are saying that keeping Souray for 20 more games and watching him walk in the summer improves this organization?

I have lived in Calgary for 8 years now, and though I am NOT a flames fan at all (i tend to cheer for Edmonton in the battle of alberta that is so huge over here), I love hockey so I follow their team, by default since I listen to lots of sports radio and read both papers daily... bit of a sports junky really)
If I am biased (which I probably am), it's for the habs... The habs are in my blood, pure and simple, and follow the team religiously (listen to every game I can on the radio, "waste" way too much time following the team on this and other message boars.

Bottom line is that the Flames, though their record is similar, and though I would NEVER EVER concede it to any of the Calgarians I live and work with, have a team much closer to cup contention than ours is... we have much better organizational depth prospect wise, not even close really, but as for NHL ready players, they have more talent currently in their lineup imo...

going by this year's play (not considering potential)
C:
Koivu = Langkow (only cuz Langkow plays with Iggy,otherwise, +16 vs -14 (Saku)
Pleks = Lombardi
Bonk = Conroy (only if we assume Bonk= better defensively, cuz Conroy scores more)
Yelle >> Lapierre/Milroy/Begin
edge- Calgary

RW:
Ryder<<<<<<<< Iginla (Iggy is one of the leagues best)
Kovy >> Amonte
Johson >> Moss
Lats = Ritchie
edge- Calgary (we have better depth, but I doubt you'd hesitate to swap our RW's and then some to have Iginla on our team)

LW:
HIggins <<<<Tanguay (in a few years, different story, right now it's not even close)
Samsonov <<<< Huselius (man do I wish we had picked Huselius off waivers last year, i think i posted about it at the time, I had a feeling he had this kind of play in him... and no, he doesnt play with Iginla usually)
Perez >> Friesen
Streit > Primeau (put streit here instead of on D, cuz we can and he's better than murray/downey)
edge- Calgary

Defense:
Markov = Phaneuf (probably get flamed anywhere outside the habs board for saying this, but Markov is damn good even if phaneuf hits/scores more)
Souray > Hamrlik (Hamrlik is much better Defensively, but Souray is a PP monster)
Komi << Regher (I hope Komi can reach regehr's level in his prime)
Rivet = Warrener (if only rivet could play more like he did last year I wouldnt feel like such a homer for calling this one a draw)
Dandy < Stuart
bouillion < Giordano

edge Calgary

Goalie
Huet < Kipprusoff
abischer > mclennan
edge calgary

I don't really see how anyone could argue that the flames roster isn't clearly better than ours right now... If the flames didn't have this mysterious inability to win on the road, they'd easily be among the top 4-5 teams in the league.

so anyways, you may disagree with my opinion on the two teams, but I have a feeling I am much mrore familiar with Calgary than you are... I guess you could try to argue that I am actually a closet flames fan or something, but I have a feeling if you asked anyone familiar with both teams, who was not a fan of either, there's a good chance they'd say my comparison was a little biased towards montreal.
edge Calgary
On paper your point is taken, but that doesn't always amount to being better head to head or more equipped for the playoffs. The playoffs are about players stepping up, not statistics. I'm not convinced the Habs can't turn it up at the right time and surprise a lot of people. Realistically, if you have a chance to make the playoffs then you should go for it and grab a player to fill some holes. If you have no chance of making it you're a seller in my book. The only difference IMO between Calgary and Montreal right now is Calgary has a lot more breathing room in their push for the playoffs.

Montreal won 3 in a row and then lost to a pretty good Isles team. So, if Montreal wins 2 or 3 more games in a row followed by a loss I think they're in great shape. They have been playing better as of late and there's no reaosn to believe they can't do something with the team they have and perhaps filling some holes in the roster. Do I think they'll win the Cup? Probably not, but I think we should give this team a chance to show what they're made of when it counts come playoff time if they get there. Let's give our final evaluation at year's end before we jump to conclusions. Montreal brass will do it and so can we. They'll go from there and work on what needs to be fixed in the offseason whether it means blowing up the core of this team or not.

By the way, I think the Habs will re-sign Souray. He's a big part of any success the Habs have had and said he wants to stay in Montreal. If it comes down to not re-signing him then why not let him walk and clear cap space that can be used to sign someone else, whether it's a current roster player or a free agent? Like I said previously, they have til July to re-sign him.


Last edited by LesHabsRock: 02-25-2007 at 02:22 AM.
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Old
02-25-2007, 02:25 AM
  #39
LesHabsRock
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Hear, hear. I ascribe it to many Habs fans - and especially those who post on these boards - living in the "video game generation". Fortunately, however, I have complete confidence that our management doesn't play video games with the team. The NHL is a multi-billion dollar industry, and the Canadiens would look like morons if they started running their team like it was a keeper FHL for kicks only.

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Old
02-25-2007, 02:32 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by LesHabsRock View Post

Montreal won 3 in a row and then lost to a pretty good Isles team. So, if Montreal wins 2 or 3 more games in a row followed by a loss I think they're in great shape. They have been playing better as of late and there's no reaosn to believe they can't do something with the team they have and perhaps filling some holes in the roster. Do I think they'll win the Cup? Probably not, but I think we should give this team a chance to show what they're made of when it counts come playoff time if they get there. Let's give our final evaluation at year's end before we jump to conclusions. Montreal brass will do it and so can we. They'll go from there and work on what needs to be fixed in the offseason whether it means blowing up the core of this team or not.
.
so you are not a seller... I get it...
how about you humour me though (in honor of what I was hoping to get out of this thread) and IMAGINE that you are a seller. (might be as easy as picturing what you'd be feeling had we not come away with wins over perenial super powers Columbus and Washington last week, leaving us with 1 instead of 3 wins in our last 10 games...

So, as a newly baptised seller, what kind of deal would you like to see from gainey?
Doesn't mean Souray HAS to go... we do have 8 UFA's, as well as a few players under contract that may not be a part of the long-term solution (kovy? Sammy? Ryder?).

P.S I like your optimism... I wish I could look at our team, and the way they have played all year, and believe that we do have the tools needed to make a cup run this year. (as you may have infered, even when we were 4-5th overall in the league, I felt that we would only have playoff success if we added at least 1 or 2 key players)

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Old
02-25-2007, 03:08 AM
  #41
Miller Time
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Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
Hear, hear. I ascribe it to many Habs fans - and especially those who post on these boards - living in the "video game generation". Fortunately, however, I have complete confidence that our management doesn't play video games with the team. The NHL is a multi-billion dollar industry, and the Canadiens would look like morons if they started running their team like it was a keeper FHL for kicks only.
hmmm, so if the feeling that "getting a good return from a UFA instead of watching him walk in the off season" is a symptom of the "video game generation", what then is the "disease" that causes the blissfully content "things are fine the way they are, and everything will work out in the end so why bother trying to get better" feeling???
Is it perhaps a case of "I remember the good ol' days-itis", also known as the "Eight-Track Revolution"...

Seriously though, why is it so hard to imagine that some people simply don't share your opinion?
During the thick of our slump, I said that I'd only consider selling if we continued to play poorly. The wins over columbus/washington/nashville are nice, but not convincing, unless we win the next two, we're still under 500 over the last ten games... that's not exactly the kind of play that inspires playoff aspirations.
Being a seller seems to me like a much better/safer/smarter alternative than sticking with the status quo and not making the playoffs... only marginally better than making the playoffs and losing in the 1st or 2nd round and WAY better than being a buyer at this point.

Standing pat now just ensures that we will lose parts of the current core, getting ZERO in return...

But if the deadline passes with no movement, it's not like I'll be devestated. I like Souray, I like Rivet, and I'm praying Markov is here for a long time. I'll be rooting for the team to make the playoffs as hard as anyone, and when we get in, I'm sure I'll have myself convinced "why not us!"... but for now, till tuesday, I'm sending out the "sell sell sell" vibes, hoping we can fleece a team or two looking to make a splash or keep up with the "arms race"

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Old
02-25-2007, 04:16 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
so you are not a seller... I get it...
how about you humour me though (in honor of what I was hoping to get out of this thread) and IMAGINE that you are a seller.
So, as a newly baptised seller, what kind of deal would you like to see from gainey?
Doesn't mean Souray HAS to go... we do have 8 UFA's, as well as a few players under contract that may not be a part of the long-term solution (kovy? Sammy? Ryder?).
Ok, think seller, think seller, think seller. I believe I can do it!

I think we ought to move Rivet immediately for probably a 2nd round pick, or a decent prospect. That's one.

I think we try to pry Seabrook out of Chicago with an offer of Koivu and Samsonov. That's two and three!

Can't stop now. Gotta keep selling assets......

Next I would sell Higgins, Komisarek and Perezhogin to Florida for two excellent prospects, Jokinen and Horton.

Finally I would sell again, this time Plekanec, Ryder and a 1st round pick to Philadelphia for 26 year old NHL roster player Simon Gagne.


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Old
02-25-2007, 05:05 AM
  #43
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Those would be great moves

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02-25-2007, 07:56 AM
  #44
Blind Gardien
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Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
hmmm, so if the feeling that "getting a good return from a UFA instead of watching him walk in the off season" is a symptom of the "video game generation", what then is the "disease" that causes the blissfully content "things are fine the way they are, and everything will work out in the end so why bother trying to get better" feeling???
Is it perhaps a case of "I remember the good ol' days-itis", also known as the "Eight-Track Revolution"...
Things don't have to be "fine the way they are" in order for selling in the midst of a playoff race to be an imponderable option. I just figure that those who propose such things probably don't have much real-world experience. Maybe they haven't worked in real-world situations with big money on the line, and big expectations from above. I mean, if my company decided in the middle of a contract to suddenly fire all of our top engineers, and tell our customer, hey, we'll hire a new group of kids, train them up, and in the end you'll get a better product because those eager kids - once they get the experience - will put in longer and harder hours than the current more sedate crew... well, except you'll get your equipment 5 years down the road instead of next year... I mean, that would just be unacceptable. I don't think the real-life hockey business is as different from real-life business as some of us tend to think from our thrill-seeking armchairs in front of our plasma TVs.

Gainey has responsibilities and expectations, and I just find it hard to believe that people can realistically embrace this "seller" philosophy. Maybe most of you guys in the "seller" camp realize that it's not practically very likely, but are just giving voice to your fantasies anyway, fully realizing that they aren't very probable in the real world, and I have no problem with that, of course, even if it isn't always clear in every "sellers" post that you have that recognition. Perhaps it's just implied. Anyway, no more or less harm in promoting one's fantasies than in overlooking the unspoken implied understandings and opposing said fantasies.

Of course, it might serve me right if Gainey really did trade Souray or Markov after all this. Somebody who thinks it's a serious option had better make me an avatar bet before it's too late!

Quote:
Seriously though, why is it so hard to imagine that some people simply don't share your opinion?
It's not at all hard to imagine. Obviously they do. I just have a very low opinion about the rationality of such people. But on the other hand, this whole league, the whole game is supposed to be about entertainment, isn't it? So if you seller-shouters want to get your kicks by dreaming of another rebuild, well, who am I to poke holes in your fantasies, right? I dunno. A chacun son gout. Bizarre as such gouts are to me.

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02-25-2007, 08:04 AM
  #45
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The market is so high right now, It will pain me to see us not sign Souray and lose him in the summer.

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02-25-2007, 08:06 AM
  #46
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Imo we are not a cup contender even if we got an established veteran, so we are sellers. It's better to build for future at this point. Somebody said that it's better to start rebuilding when we're out of playoffs... Well, I think if we go on like this we'll be an average team for years.

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02-25-2007, 08:16 AM
  #47
Blind Gardien
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Originally Posted by #eleven View Post
Imo we are not a cup contender even if we got an established veteran, so we are sellers. It's better to build for future at this point. Somebody said that it's better to start rebuilding when we're out of playoffs... Well, I think if we go on like this we'll be an average team for years.
I think such an attitude completely underrates the quality of our current prospects and young players, as well as the demonstrated acumen of our scouting staff. If we retain our key UFAs and keep developing and drafting kids just as we have been these last few years, I think it's awfully pessimistic to think we'll be "an average team for years". It just seems like such a defeatist attitude to me.

And I don't think anybody thought that Edmonton was a Cup contender last year either... that might seem like a broken record by now to the seller camp... but bottom line, it has become a reality in the modern NHL. The right team on the right roll can have great success in the playoffs. Why voluntarily bow out before even taking that chance? None of it adds up to me.

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02-25-2007, 08:26 AM
  #48
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Here's something that can add to the reason we want to be sellers

We are in the midst of a play-off push.

We have the worst last-ten record in the league 3-7-0.

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02-25-2007, 08:31 AM
  #49
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Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
I think such an attitude completely underrates the quality of our current prospects and young players, as well as the demonstrated acumen of our scouting staff. If we retain our key UFAs and keep developing and drafting kids just as we have been these last few years, I think it's awfully pessimistic to think we'll be "an average team for years". It just seems like such a defeatist attitude to me.

And I don't think anybody thought that Edmonton was a Cup contender last year either... that might seem like a broken record by now to the seller camp... but bottom line, it has become a reality in the modern NHL. The right team on the right roll can have great success in the playoffs. Why voluntarily bow out before even taking that chance? None of it adds up to me.
Perhaps it's a defence mechanism. The team we love didn't lose because it is unworthy. It lost because free agents don't want to play here. It's the taxes, it's the language, it's the climate, it's the salary cap. Anything.

Or, look at it this way: if we are rebuilding, then we are exempt from needing to win. We need not be measured up against the other teams in the real NHL races or playoff series.

"Of course we didn't make the playoffs! We don't WANT to just squeak in. We have a higher goal right now."

or

"Yes, we lost in the first round, but we are doing great on our five-year rebuilding plan!"

It's just so much easier not to have to compete the regular, old-fashioned way, which is on the ice.

Unfortunately, our real GM plays for a real owner who has to put out a real team on the real ice for the real fans.


Last edited by BaseballCoach: 02-25-2007 at 09:31 AM.
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02-25-2007, 09:28 AM
  #50
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Look at the standing. The teams the Habs are competing against for a playoff spot Carolina and Atlanta just got Carter and Zhitnik. Looks like it's going to be that much harder for the Habs to make the playoffs.

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