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Roman Turek

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Old
02-03-2004, 02:23 PM
  #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Bull
Yes McLennan lets in softies too only he lets in one softy every couple games, Turek lets in 2-3 a game
Believe what you will. Obviously some fans have decided just to hate the guy and don't actually want to ever give him a chance.

Saying he let's in 2-3 soft goals per game seems more than a little ridiculous. Hmmm so he was a star in San Jose according to several reports, shuts out Nashville and he still averages 2-3 soft goals per game?

Sorry but I call BS. Hyperbole doesn't help your argument it just makes you look like an irrational Turek hater.

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02-04-2004, 11:21 AM
  #27
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Maybe some of the fault for the bad goaltending of late is the Flames goalie coach David Marcoux?

First of all Turek shouldn't handle the puck.

Goal he gave up against Chicago is proof. If the winger will beat the Flames defender to the puck how the hell can a slow skating goalie beat him and then make a clean play with bulky equipment on while being pressured? Most times he can't.

If Turek stays in his net defenceman takes Hawks winger and Turek can then defend Ruutu as he takes pass from end boards if pass gets there. At least if Turek is in net Ruutu doesn't have empty net to shoot at.

Turek should only handle puck when puck is dumped down the ice while Flames are on power play.

Secondly, has anyone on the Flames given Turek a vision test? At times he plays like he is Mr. Magoo. At times he looks like he is moving to where he thinks the puck is or will be not where it actually is.

And don't tell me the team defence isn't bad. They are bad in front of Turek and also bad in front of McLennan. Especially against the Kings.

On Pirnes goal the defencemen were in front of Gelinas when he gave it away at the blueline. Obviously the Flames forwards gave Marty no option to pass to that he felt he had to make the move, but what were the defencemen thinking?

On Frolov's goal why was he behind or even with both defencemen in the neutral zone to begin with. At worst it should have been a one on one once Stumpel made the pass. It was a two on two that turned into a one on two and then a partial breakaway.

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02-04-2004, 03:20 PM
  #28
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I hear from the radio that McLennan is really beat up and injured. I have no idea what the injury is, and they said that the Flames aren't disclosing what is wrong with him. We all know he's been injured for a while, so maybe it's something serious. I dread Turek getting the start tomorrow in such an important game.

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02-04-2004, 04:06 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cactus Jack
I hear from the radio that McLennan is really beat up and injured. I have no idea what the injury is, and they said that the Flames aren't disclosing what is wrong with him. We all know he's been injured for a while, so maybe it's something serious. I dread Turek getting the start tomorrow in such an important game.
McLennan has a broken sternum, clavicle or collarbone. Something along those lines. He's hopped up on painkillers.

Not sure why you'd dread Turek starting when McLennan has been just as bad lately.

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02-04-2004, 07:25 PM
  #30
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There's one reason i know why i dread Fat Turek getting the start...it means our probability of:
1. Letting in the first shot of the game
2. Losing a decent lead in the 3rd period
3. Losing in general
has just gone up at least 20% than if McLemon was playing.

To me a certain stat doesn't lie
Fat Turek in net 3-7 (30% win)
McLemon in net 12-9-3 (50% win)

Whether they both be playing bad or Turek has is inconsistent good game (as mentioned against San Jose and Nashville) it seems that the Flames play better in front of McLemon, most importantly the Offence seems to play better in front of McLemon. If we're gonna give up 4 goals a game, i would like to see us score at least 4 and get the tie, and not score 1-2 as we often do in front of Fat Turek (not that Fat Turek is particular to blame for our offence).

End of the day Fat Turek is starting tomorrow...I just hope he was that inconsistent good game, it has been a while Roman.

Best solution: Bring Krahn up from Las Vegas, and Bring Medvedev in from Russia 'til Kippers is back!

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02-05-2004, 09:53 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Dallas Flames Fan
I mainly have issues with Button's mistakes.
We never would have guessed.

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Old
02-05-2004, 10:53 AM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by calgarylen13
Whether they both be playing bad or Turek has is inconsistent good game (as mentioned against San Jose and Nashville) it seems that the Flames play better in front of McLemon, most importantly the Offence seems to play better in front of McLemon. If we're gonna give up 4 goals a game, i would like to see us score at least 4 and get the tie, and not score 1-2 as we often do in front of Fat Turek (not that Fat Turek is particular to blame for our offence).
January has been BY FAR our worst defensive month for team defense (forwards and defensemen.) Had he been in net for only November, December when we were playing almost flawlessly defensively he'd probably have an amazing record.

The biggest problem on our team right now is team defense. The goaltenders sure aren't helping because neither Jamie or Turek is stealing games but the blame should be first and foremost placed on the team defense. Those who think Turek is solely to blame just aren't watching the games.

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02-05-2004, 11:38 AM
  #33
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Bobby Orr , Larry Robinson , Doug harvey , Denis Potvin ,Brad Park and Denis Gauthier WONT help Turoks GAME!!!!!!!! the only think that will help Turok is a 4x6 sheet of plywood!!!!!

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02-05-2004, 11:49 AM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hydroponic Harold
Bobby Orr , Larry Robinson , Doug harvey , Denis Potvin ,Brad Park and Denis Gauthier WONT help Turoks GAME!!!!!!!! the only think that will help Turok is a 4x6 sheet of plywood!!!!!
History tends to indicate otherwise. Behind a solid defense he's posted amazing numbers (in St. Louis.)

I can't really understand your point of view Harold. The team has been playing terrible in front of him. On a good team where he usually only has to worry about the first shot he'd be fine.

Blaming him is the simplistic answer. You are copping out by not acknowledging what is the biggest problem. Obviously you feel the need to make him a scapegoat.

Would I prefer Kiprusoff? Sure. Do I think Kiprusoff will probably start more games the rest of the year? Yep.

Does that mean Turek wouldn't stop a beachball behind an all star defense? You've got to be kidding me.

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02-05-2004, 12:30 PM
  #35
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FDW - You misunderstand something
Many of us realize that the team's D has sucked for awhile now - I sure am not going to blame Turek for everything. But, many of us have the opinion that the team's D sucks because of knowing who's in net. Now, you can talk all you want about how that's unprofessional and should have no effect - but it definitly does. What did our past winning streaks have in common? Confidence.
What did our past losing streaks have in common? Lack of confidence.
Where can a quick confidence boost come from? A big save by the goalie.
Kipper supplied this, and the team fed off of it and played better.
Turek has not been able to supply it, and the team may be losing faith in him.
Now, goalies depend on confidence more than anyone, and I hope to hell Turek can get his back, but he is running out of time. He needs to play a great game - starting tonight.

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02-05-2004, 12:45 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by FLAMESFAN
But, many of us have the opinion that the team's D sucks because of knowing who's in net. Now, you can talk all you want about how that's unprofessional and should have no effect - but it definitly does.
I've certainly heard that argument many a time but I don't really put much stock into it.

So Turek just being in the net causes the D to give up 2 on 1's and the forwards to stop backchecking? I can't buy it and I'm surprised so many people do. That's absolving the rest of the team for any fault and putting it on the goaltending. I think that's bogus. If Gauthier makes a poor decision and causes a 2 on 1 then it's Gauthier's fault, not the goalie. If Reinprecht fails to pick up his man in the zone and there's a guy wide open at the side of the net it's Reinprecht's fault, not the goaltending.

Blaming the goaltender is the easier way to go. It would be nice if Turek was magically the cause of all of our problems. But that's such a simplistic and foolish way to look at it IMO. If he causes a goal then blame away. But blaming him for the mistakes of the other players on the ice is ridiculous.

I agree with some of your points about confidence but neither goaltender is providing that. The major problem I have is people who seem to blame Turek and yet think McLennan is doing just a dandy job. BS.


Last edited by Flames Draft Watcher: 02-05-2004 at 12:52 PM.
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02-05-2004, 12:58 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher
I've certainly heard that argument many a time but I don't really put much stock into it.

So Turek just being in the net causes the D to give up 2 on 1's and the forwards to stop backchecking? I can't buy it and I'm surprised so many people do. That's absolving the rest of the team for any fault and putting it on the goaltending. I think that's bogus. If Gauthier makes a poor decision and causes a 2 on 1 then it's Gauthier's fault, not the goalie. If Reinprecht fails to pick up his man in the zone and there's a guy wide open at the side of the net it's Reinprecht's fault, not the goaltending.

Blaming the goaltender is the easier way to go. It would be nice if Turek was magically the cause of all of our problems. But that's such a simplistic and foolish way to look at it IMO. If he causes a goal then blame away. But blaming him for the mistakes of the other players on the ice is ridiculous.

I'm willing to bet that the majority of those odd man rushes came with the team trailing (obviously they have to pinch, and sometimes get caught.). Now, why was the team trailing? because of a soft goal! Do you have any idea what a soft goal does to the confidence of a team? In order for these players to play the system they have to have faith in the system. They know they are offensively challenged (even though they've been scoring alot lately), and they also know they can't afford weak goals. Once down they tend to give up. I don't like that either, and that's what Warriner is talking about. I don't see how you don't agree that the starting goalie affects the psyche of this team.

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02-05-2004, 01:17 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLAMESFAN
I'm willing to bet that the majority of those odd man rushes came with the team trailing (obviously they have to pinch, and sometimes get caught.)
And poof, there goes your argument. If you can prove that conjecture then go ahead and try it.

Some of the worst goals I can think of lately by both Turek and McLennan were when we were leading. We've been blowing leads left, right and centre. See the Chicago game. See the Anaheim game (we didn't blow the game but we certainly let them back in it.) See the LA game. Turek was named a star in the San Jose game and shutout the Preds. So where's this majority that you speak of? The TB game may fit your criteria but I don't see many others games that do. Seems like far from a majority of to me.

I dunno, arguments based on conjecture aren't really all the solid. You're going to have to PROVE your point to win me over.

DISCLAIMER: I'm not trying to say Turek is great. I'm not really defending his poor play. I'm saying that he is not the cause of our team defense going down the tubes and I'm saying that McLennan has been just as bad lately.

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02-05-2004, 01:25 PM
  #39
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Obviously that is not something I can prove,(and blowing a lead does not neccesarily mean an odd man rush) and I am not trying to win you over! Come to the dark side FDW..................
We agree that Turek has not been good.
We agree that McLennan has also been known to let in weak ones
If you agree that the psyche of the team is affected by who is in net - then what do we disagree on? (besides being able to speak our minds )


Last edited by FLAMESFAN: 02-05-2004 at 01:29 PM.
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02-05-2004, 05:42 PM
  #40
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If you have ever played the game you would know that nothing deflates a team ..especially a young team like Flames ie fragile ..like a BAD goal .Say what you want he lets in a BAD goal ..a HORRIBLE goal at least once a game ..hes done it since he became a Flame .Why do you think the Blues and Stars have passed him on ..remember the Blues and Sharks playoff series a few years ago when Owen Nolan scored from CENTRE ICE ...the Sharks were dead and buried in that series ..it was over ..the fat lady was singing ..till TUROK let them back in .I can honestly say i dont blame any Flames fan who boos him ..if you love your team as much as i know most fans do ...and a big $$$$$$ player isnt pulling his weight ..hey welcome to Canada , let the BOOS begin .How many games did Kiprusoff win for the Flame sthis year ..how many has Turek won ?????I can honestly say i dont remeber him stealing a game since hes been a Flame .I can think of one game where i or my buddies were talking about how Roman was awesome , stole a game , incedible saves .Now ime not saying a goalie has to steal a game every game ..but he HAS to stop the pucks that have to be stopped .How many bad goals have Brodeur , theodore ,Belfour given up at the "bad" times ..early in a game , when its tied ,or end or starts of periods ..very very seldom .I hope he comes out and plays kitty bar the door , i really do .

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02-06-2004, 08:52 AM
  #41
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Can't complain about him tonight. All I ever ask from a goalie is to give me (at the minimum) 9 saves per 10 shots. I don't care if they are 2 on 1's or easy point shots, in the end a goalie should be able to give your team that. Anything less is crappy, anything more is extra. At the NHL level your goalie HAS to have a .900 S%

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02-06-2004, 10:25 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher
January has been BY FAR our worst defensive month for team defense (forwards and defensemen.) Had he been in net for only November, December when we were playing almost flawlessly defensively he'd probably have an amazing record.

The biggest problem on our team right now is team defense. The goaltenders sure aren't helping because neither Jamie or Turek is stealing games but the blame should be first and foremost placed on the team defense. Those who think Turek is solely to blame just aren't watching the games.
Took the words right out of my mouth. I use those arguments debating with other, yet constantly get shut down. I hope Kiprusoff is for real, but until he can steal games when were playing as bad as we have been defensively, he's just another goalie.

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