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Subban's next contract

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Old
03-30-2014, 03:42 PM
  #76
Comfortably Numb
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Originally Posted by Brainiac View Post
Maybe not MB, but someone on the team is in charge of maximizing cap use. That's exactly how they got Vanek. They were one of the teams able to take the salary.

If they can sign him, however, no need for deadline deals next year, so it's all good.
If we can sign him, no need for big deadline deal, you can always go for depth on defense for cheap, but I get what you're saying.

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Old
03-30-2014, 05:44 PM
  #77
habfaninvictoria
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Subban will likely break the bank to stay here.
Cap space is only going up. He knows he's one of the most popular and visible players in the league.

8 million / 8 years

I see no reason why he and Vanek can't be both be signed. If Minny is Vaneks preferred destination, they aren't exactly in a cap friendly existence either. They've got 3 longer term contracts of 7 Million (Parise, Koivu, Suter) and I don't think they're closer to winning a cup than we are.

Vanek has great chemistry with Patches and they look like their having fun. Put them together for the next few years and we have one of the best lines in the NHL.

Vanek

8 Years @

10
10
10
10
6.5
5
5
5

=61.5 Million

The cap isn't going down and this still leaves us room to sign Markov short term and replace Gionta. The Gally's will need a raise but their RFA and will be on bridge contracts @ 4 ish ... lots of cap space.

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Old
03-30-2014, 05:53 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Comfortably Numb View Post
If we can sign him, no need for big deadline deal, you can always go for depth on defense for cheap, but I get what you're saying.
Yep, exactly. IF we sign Vanek, I'm not worried about our cap next year. We know it will be well spent. No way we sign a scrub at 4-5M if we have Vanek.

If we don't sign Vanek, then, we HAVE to sign someone useful on D. And it's no easy job. A good looking move there could end up being a mistake down the road.

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Old
03-30-2014, 06:51 PM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brainiac View Post
Cap is going up, Gionta is off the books this year, Briere next year. Eller certainly won't have a big raise. etc. etc.

Lineups were posted with Vanek and Subban at 7-8M and Markov at 5-6M. Plenty of cap space for all of that. The Gallys will be RFA and will probably get bridge deals as well.

Cap space has absolutely no value by itself. It's all about what you can do with it. And it happens that Bergevin can use it to sign good players this year.

Might I add 'hypocapspaceophobia' to the diagnostic?
The cap is not going up as much as people think, because of a significant drop in the value of our dollar.

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Old
03-30-2014, 07:10 PM
  #80
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The cap is not going up as much as people think, because of a significant drop in the value of our dollar.
Yup. That's going to be a factor going forward. Esp if our dollar continues to slide.

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03-30-2014, 07:11 PM
  #81
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The cap is not going up as much as people think, because of a significant drop in the value of our dollar.
How sad... cap will be a whole 1M less than expected...

We won't be able to match Subban's offersheet, won't be able to sign Markov, won't even offer anything to Vanek. And on top of that, I guess we'll have to ship Price and Pacioretty out of town.

Just so that we can raise Eller to 3M and keep a LOT of cap space.

You guys are pathetic.


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Old
04-04-2014, 11:53 AM
  #82
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Apparently no more negociations until the end of the season. They are far from an agreement.


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Old
04-04-2014, 12:01 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Brainiac View Post
Apparently no more negociations until the end of the season. They are far from an agreement.

...probably a problem with the "No Bouillon" clause...

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04-04-2014, 12:03 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Brainiac View Post
Apparently no more negociations until the end of the season. They are far from an agreement.

Odds are it won't get done until September

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04-04-2014, 12:05 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Brainiac View Post
Apparently no more negociations until the end of the season. They are far from an agreement.

Let's see what he does in the POs. His game has fallen off since the Olympic break and he isn't playing the same dominant style that won him the Norris last year.

It'll be interesting to see what he gets but can't imagine it'll be as inflated as the numbers people were using at the beginning of the year of $8.5M+.

If wager to say he'll get between $7-8M on a long term deal. Hope he doesn't get more than that. I still like the symmetry of $7.6M for 7 or 8 years.

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Old
04-04-2014, 12:07 PM
  #86
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I'm not surprised, it's common when playoff time is approaching to stop most of negotiations to be sure it will not become a distraction, it's simpler this way.

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04-04-2014, 12:30 PM
  #87
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I'm not surprised, it's common when playoff time is approaching to stop most of negotiations to be sure it will not become a distraction, it's simpler this way.
Even then, would have been big to announce Subban's new, long-term deal just before the playoffs. I'm sure Subban would have been very happy and focused on the playoffs. Now we (and Subban) have to wonder if this will drag on until September.

Molson is probably not very happy either. Imagine the jersey sales.

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Old
04-04-2014, 02:33 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by 24get View Post
Explain to me how PK is better than Doughty, Weber, Chara.
Then we can talk about 8 years at 8-10M.

Anyway, every month there is a thread about PK's contract and his salary increases by 500K every time.

So let's keep this up and we will be paying him 12M.
Who needs Vanek and Markov when you have PK?
7.6 Years at 7.6 Million! Wonder how Bergevin gets that done?

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Old
04-04-2014, 05:24 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Smoky Thompson View Post
Odds are it won't get done until September
Subban will have to look at offer sheets if it's going to be that way, though.

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Old
04-04-2014, 07:43 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
Subban will have to look at offer sheets if it's going to be that way, though.
i'll be surprised if he doesn't strongly consider any/every offer sheet that comes his way... with the way he's treated by MT, and the complete lack of support/backing from the organization, it shouldn't surprise or anger anyone if/when he does sign elsewhere.

If I'm the Avs, i put a long term 7.5M$ offer on subban's plate as soon as allowed. They have the cap space, the need, and their picks this year (and likely next) will be in the 20-30 range.


This whole Subban issue is shaping up to be another colossal asset management cluster ******* by an organization that can't seem to get out of its own way when it comes to managing their in-house talent.

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04-04-2014, 07:57 PM
  #91
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Wouldn't surprise me if he signs offersheet and is let go. Team doesn't really value him that highly/sees no defensive upside. He's literally regressed to the point he's playing below his rookie year level. Martin was tough on him, but it actually improved him and under him he was an all situation D playing a shutdown role. Now he is being developed into MAB.

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04-04-2014, 08:00 PM
  #92
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Subban should get the Masterton Trophy: snubbed by TeamCanada, benched by his coach, booed at away games, visible minority and the list goes on.

$7.6m max term

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Old
04-04-2014, 08:02 PM
  #93
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I think PK's days in Montreal are numbered. They better get a nice return for him.

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Old
04-04-2014, 08:04 PM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
Wouldn't surprise me if he signs offersheet and is let go. Team doesn't really value him that highly/sees no defensive upside. He's literally regressed to the point he's playing below his rookie year level. Martin was tough on him, but it actually improved him and under him he was an all situation D playing a shutdown role. Now he is being developed into MAB.
I think it's a talent evaluation thing. I don't think Therrien really evaluates talent well for the state of the game in 2014. One need look no further than the whole Bouillion, Murray vs Beaulieu, Tinordi, Diaz thing to see that. I just don't think he gets that Subban's "risk taking" is actually the safer play in the long run because you aren't defending in the first place. I think you're right with the no defensive upside thing, I think they've actually bought the rhetoric that he's a defensive liability.

Martin recognized Subban was a top pairing all situations guy and gave him those minutes as a rookie very quickly. Therrien is screwing around a year removed from a Norris win with Subban at age 25. What's funny is the idea that Subban is better under Therrien/Bergevin when as you mentioned this year is his worst so far. That's the problem, when you take the fire out of his game you're taking away what makes him a Norris candidate. The way he's playing this season he's been an above average D but nowhere near the discussion for best in the league. For a guy of Subban's talent level it's just really disappointing that they don't recognize what they have.


Last edited by Noob616: 04-04-2014 at 08:10 PM.
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Old
04-04-2014, 08:06 PM
  #95
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I was convinced all along that they would run him out of town.

A shame that he wasn't born in Quebec/Franco-Ontario.

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04-04-2014, 08:09 PM
  #96
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Should have just given him the long term big money deal last time around. If we can get him to stay with 8x8 that'd be fine. Would be more than happy to give him an 8 year deal at 24 years old. Less convinced by offering a 30 year old Vanek a similarly long deal, but I guess that's the nature of free agency these days.

Hopefully MT is fired, however unlikely, bringing in someone who actually appreciates his play and uses him properly, would surely be a positive in keeping him here.

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04-04-2014, 08:33 PM
  #97
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wrong thread

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Old
04-04-2014, 08:34 PM
  #98
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ibid

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Old
04-04-2014, 09:01 PM
  #99
Claimed Off Waivers
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Goodbye PK(if by some chance you are reading this). You coulda been a big star here but it looks like fans in another city are gonna get to enjoy your talents starting next season.

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Old
04-04-2014, 09:01 PM
  #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TassieHab View Post
Should have just given him the long term big money deal last time around. If we can get him to stay with 8x8 that'd be fine. Would be more than happy to give him an 8 year deal at 24 years old. Less convinced by offering a 30 year old Vanek a similarly long deal, but I guess that's the nature of free agency these days.

Hopefully MT is fired, however unlikely, bringing in someone who actually appreciates his play and uses him properly, would surely be a positive in keeping him here.
Hate to say it but Subban is not playing like an $8 million per year DMan right now. Not even close.

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