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Akeson and Heeter recalled from Phantoms

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04-14-2014, 01:04 PM
  #101
DrinkFightFlyers
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Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
Thats fine. I am on my iphone now so its hard looking and behind the net and such when comparing and then writing. I will do it when I get back. I will also search for the BSH article I found showing how Downie has done.
I don't need stats (advanced or otherwise) to tell me whether or not Downie has played well this season. I'm acknowledging that he has not been good for a large part of the season, including recently. All I'm saying is that to me, it seems more likely that he'll turn it around than Akeson will continue his play. If you have a stat that shows which is more likely to occur, great. But if you are just going to throw out some stats that show me Downie hasn't played well, I don't need them. I know he hasn't played well. Again I'm just saying I'd bet on him to turn it around than Akeson to keep it up. If Downie plays like **** in game one, bench away. Be my guest. I've got no problem with that.

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If I forget will will agree to disagree. If you think he will change his play after his 2nd long benching thats fine. I dont think that it will happen so I would go with Akeson. Luckily I do think Berube has Downie on an extremely short leash so while he may get a shot if he does below average (which probability is extremely high) he is out. Berube seems pissed at Downie so maybe we (well i guess i and some others) will get lucky and wont have to watch him play lazy hockey.
And that's fine, absent some sort of stat that shows which is more likely (which I wager doesn't exist), it really is just an opinion question. Some people would say play the young guy or play the hot hand or whatever. And they might wind up right. I say play the veteran and I might wind up right. I'm not championing Downie and saying he's key to this team's success. I'm just saying that it seems like a risky move to put Akeson out there because he had a good AHL season.

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Old
04-14-2014, 01:26 PM
  #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
I don't need stats (advanced or otherwise) to tell me whether or not Downie has played well this season. I'm acknowledging that he has not been good for a large part of the season, including recently. All I'm saying is that to me, it seems more likely that he'll turn it around than Akeson will continue his play. If you have a stat that shows which is more likely to occur, great. But if you are just going to throw out some stats that show me Downie hasn't played well, I don't need them. I know he hasn't played well. Again I'm just saying I'd bet on him to turn it around than Akeson to keep it up. If Downie plays like **** in game one, bench away. Be my guest. I've got no problem with that.



And that's fine, absent some sort of stat that shows which is more likely (which I wager doesn't exist), it really is just an opinion question. Some people would say play the young guy or play the hot hand or whatever. And they might wind up right. I say play the veteran and I might wind up right. I'm not championing Downie and saying he's key to this team's success. I'm just saying that it seems like a risky move to put Akeson out there because he had a good AHL season.
I am not sure if it is quite what you are looking for but Akeson has outplayed Downie offensively at every other level the two have played at. It wouldn't be surprising to see that trend continue into the NHL level as well. It is just a guess by everyone at this point on who would play better than who though. The decrease in penalties taken by playing Akeson over Downie would be a benefit going into playoffs however. Even if Akeson's average penalty minutes were doubled they wouldn't be close to Downie's average penalty minutes. When you combine that factor along with Downie's play this season and the compared history of the two plays at comparable levels along with the small sample size of Akeson's play at the NHL level then the edge likely goes to Akeson.

It is all just us guessing though and we really don't know what Berube will do. It wouldn't be surprising either way.

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04-14-2014, 01:39 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by bauerhockey02 View Post
I am not sure if it is quite what you are looking for but Akeson has outplayed Downie offensively at every other level the two have played at. It wouldn't be surprising to see that trend continue into the NHL level as well. It is just a guess by everyone at this point on who would play better than who though. The decrease in penalties taken by playing Akeson over Downie would be a benefit going into playoffs however. Even if Akeson's average penalty minutes were doubled they wouldn't be close to Downie's average penalty minutes. When you combine that factor along with Downie's play this season and the compared history of the two plays at comparable levels along with the small sample size of Akeson's play at the NHL level then the edge likely goes to Akeson.

It is all just us guessing though and we really don't know what Berube will do. It wouldn't be surprising either way.
By outplayed you really mean outproduced & as well all know there's more to playing the game than just putting up stats especially in the NHL. Plus if we're going to use past pedigree here as indicator one was a former first rounder while the other was a signed overager out of the OHL.

I'm not denying Downie has had a bad year nor am I against sitting him out of Game 1 but your reasoning behind it is just wrong & Akeson would be lucky to have the career Downie has had up to this point in his career even including this bad year he's currently going through.

I'm aware that people really soured on him since we reacquired him but overall the guy has had close to 350 games in the NHL while being a decent 2nd/3rd line tweener option. It's nothing against Akeson because a lot of guys would be lucky to have that type of career because it's really tough to do so in a league like the NHL.


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04-14-2014, 01:40 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by bauerhockey02 View Post
I am not sure if it is quite what you are looking for but Akeson has outplayed Downie offensively at every other level the two have played at. It wouldn't be surprising to see that trend continue into the NHL level as well. It is just a guess by everyone at this point on who would play better than who though. The decrease in penalties taken by playing Akeson over Downie would be a benefit going into playoffs however. Even if Akeson's average penalty minutes were doubled they wouldn't be close to Downie's average penalty minutes. When you combine that factor along with Downie's play this season and the compared history of the two plays at comparable levels along with the small sample size of Akeson's play at the NHL level then the edge likely goes to Akeson.
The penalty minutes is not really a good argument if you ask me. PIMS in the AHL vs PIMS in the NHL are not a stat that I'd base playing a guy or not playing guy at this point.

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It is all just us guessing though and we really don't know what Berube will do. It wouldn't be surprising either way.
Oh absolutely. I've got no beef if he starts Akeson. I get the argument. I just wouldn't go down that route.

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04-14-2014, 02:02 PM
  #105
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Akeson looked like he could play G s role on 2nd PP unit, plus he was out on the PK, showed nice skill on that pass to Read, I have already seen enough of him to say he should replace Downie on the 3rd line. Akeson even looked to have decent speed on the forecheck, which is Downies only redeeming quality.

No brainer if the only choices are Akeson or DOwnie.

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04-14-2014, 02:06 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
The penalty minutes is not really a good argument if you ask me. PIMS in the AHL vs PIMS in the NHL are not a stat that I'd base playing a guy or not playing guy at this point.



Oh absolutely. I've got no beef if he starts Akeson. I get the argument. I just wouldn't go down that route.
I normally wouldn't go the PIM route but it seemed to be rather consistent from Juniors up to the NHL so it looked to be something to consider. Downie takes a lot of penalties so it is just something to consider in a series against the Rags. Against the Pens I would more than likely be on the Downie side as he could get under their skins better and probably draw a penalty at the same time.

As far as Legion's post. Downie probably wouldn't be a first rounder if the draft happened over again with what everyone knows now, still drafted though obviously, but at the same time I don't remember who else was in that draft. And yes I mean outproduced, I said outplayed offensively which is very similar. I suffer from 4.5 year long post concussion syndrome and sometimes can't think of the exact word that I want so I have to try to say something similar instead. I also said that I wouldn't be surprised to see the trend continue for Akeson, and by that I mean his production in comparison to Downie. I didn't say that was definite however, just something to consider. Matt Read was also an undrafted FA.

Upon a closer look however Downie's junior and AHL production is actually a bit better. It makes me a bit more split on who I would want but Downie would need to limit his penalties and not play defense in the way that makes Timonen stare him down after a goal against. Akeson deserves a look at this point but who knows what will happen aside from Berube. It will be a tough series no matter what.


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Old
04-14-2014, 02:21 PM
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bennysflyers16 View Post
Akeson looked like he could play G s role on 2nd PP unit, plus he was out on the PK, showed nice skill on that pass to Read, I have already seen enough of him to say he should replace Downie on the 3rd line. Akeson even looked to have decent speed on the forecheck, which is Downies only redeeming quality.

No brainer if the only choices are Akeson or DOwnie.
For a whole 32 seconds, Brayden Schenn for example had 2 minutes & 11 seconds of PK time yesterday. I doubt anyone on here would consider Schenn a PK contributor.

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04-14-2014, 02:43 PM
  #108
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Downie needs four months off to get his head straight.

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04-14-2014, 02:57 PM
  #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bennysflyers16 View Post
Akeson looked like he could play G s role on 2nd PP unit, plus he was out on the PK, showed nice skill on that pass to Read, I have already seen enough of him to say he should replace Downie on the 3rd line. Akeson even looked to have decent speed on the forecheck, which is Downies only redeeming quality.

No brainer if the only choices are Akeson or DOwnie.
Akeson being able to take Giroux's spot with the 2nd PP unit is a huge reason why I've wanted him to be called up for a while now. I only caught the 3rd period or so, but I'm glad he even seemed to get time on the PK.

For the Playoffs I'd love to see

Hartnell-Giroux-Voracek
Schenn-Raffl-Simmonds
Read-Couturier-Akeson
McGinn/Downie-Lecavalier-Hall
Rinaldo

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