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Old
03-02-2007, 07:02 AM
  #26
handtrick
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Didn't want to start a new thread....but the "Emperor Has No Clothes"

Trotz's man-crush on Fiddler in print for the whole world to see:

Difference of opinion: When the Predators chose to give Sports Illustrated writer Michael Farber behind-the-scenes access to coaches and players during his recent visit to Nashville, they may not have expected to see him make public a disagreement between Trotz and assistant general manager Paul Fenton.

But it found its way into this week's article regarding the Predators.

Trotz and Fenton are described as differing over the role of Vern Fiddler and Radulov in the hours leading up to last Saturday's showdown against Detroit.

Fenton is pushing for the more offensive-minded Radulov to be placed on a higher line, while Trotz favors using the more-experienced and well-rounded Fiddler in that spot.

"We're trying to win the damn Stanley Cup, and we need to know (about Radulov)," Farber quotes Fenton saying to Trotz.

Responds Trotz: "There's an accountability factor. From the players' standpoint, this is maybe our biggest game of the year. They'd want to know why the coaches are putting (Radulov) in that situation."

Asked about the exchange this week, Trotz said it's the kind of thing that happens from time to time.

"You've got the scouting part of the organization wanting their guys to get an opportunity or to be given a bigger opportunity, and the coaching staff feeling like they have to earn it," Trotz said. "So it's a healthy discussion.

"You have to do what you have to do and be strong in your convictions. I was strong in my convictions, and Paul was strong in his convictions. There's nothing wrong with that."


http://www.tennessean.com/apps/pbcs....703020420/1028

Just admit it Barry.....come out of the closet.....it will do your soul good.....

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03-02-2007, 10:23 AM
  #27
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I saw this before bed last night, and I knew it would make for some good conversation. We joke about it, but there it is, in print. Mancrush.

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Old
03-02-2007, 12:13 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nomorekids View Post


I saw this before bed last night, and I knew it would make for some good conversation. We joke about it, but there it is, in print. Mancrush.
It just goes to show that some of our speculation here IS truth!!!!

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Old
03-02-2007, 01:01 PM
  #29
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I think it's just as fair to believe that some around here have mancrushes on Radulov.

So our assistant GM's perspective is "the guy hasn't done anything for a month, so please promote him." The Ass. GM reminds me of poker players who figure the cure to not being able to beat lower stakes is to move up.

I think Trotz' view makes a little more sense. But Radu is showing signs of life and Trotz is showing signs of using him more, and with better players. So maybe they compromised. Trotz has always said that a young player like Radulov would hit a bit of a wall, and when he thought he'd learned about defense at this level and just how hard it is to be consistent, he'd get more ice time.

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Old
03-02-2007, 01:16 PM
  #30
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Yea, it definitely goes both ways. But like you said, since Radu's production (he's benefited from injuries and playing PP) he has seen more ice time, and subsequently, his stats have improved. Or its the other way around. Either way, I think if it continues, we'll see more Radu and less Fiddler. But when it comes to crunch time, I have faith Barry will stick to his "gun" in Fids, be it right or be it wrong.

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Old
03-02-2007, 01:56 PM
  #31
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The thing is though, what the Sports Illustrated article was trying to point out was the idea of whether or not we needed to get someone else. What Fenton was trying to do is see whether or not Radulov can handle a playoff like pressure game. If he can't now, perhaps they should grab someone else before the deadline to help out on the third line. Better to find out early on rather than throw him to the wolves come playoff time and see if it works.

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Old
03-02-2007, 09:51 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OpenWheel View Post
I think it's just as fair to believe that some around here have mancrushes on Radulov.

So our assistant GM's perspective is "the guy hasn't done anything for a month, so please promote him." The Ass. GM reminds me of poker players who figure the cure to not being able to beat lower stakes is to move up.

I think Trotz' view makes a little more sense. But Radu is showing signs of life and Trotz is showing signs of using him more, and with better players. So maybe they compromised. Trotz has always said that a young player like Radulov would hit a bit of a wall, and when he thought he'd learned about defense at this level and just how hard it is to be consistent, he'd get more ice time.
Fiddler hasn't done anything to deserve top six ice time in 3 years, yet he's getting it

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Old
03-02-2007, 11:35 PM
  #33
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Report of a thread I made on this exact same subject awhile back on a Wings board:

Wings looks to be in decent shape, even with the injuries, to overcome the Preds for the division and conference titles. I'd even say the Wings are favorites to win the Central division and Western Conference. Why you ask?

Wings Remaining Opponents
Anaheim (home)
Boston (home)
Calgary (away)
Chicago (1 home, 1 away)
Colorado (home)
Columbus (2 home, 1 away)
Dallas (home)
Los Angeles (home)
Nashville (2 home, 2 away)
St. Louis (home)
Vancouver (away)

Home Games: 11
Road Games: 6
Games vs Playoff Teams: 8 - 4 home (ANH, DAL, NSH twice) and 4 away (CAL, VAN, NSH twice)

The Wings are almost entirely playing at home and only have one real road trip (2 game swing to VAN and CAL) left. They play the Ducks at the end of March when Z, Sammy, and even Bert might all be back. Add in the fact they still have 6 games against CLB, CHI, and STL (4 of them at home) and we should be able to rake in the points. Our final 4 games are home-and-home series with Columbus and Chicago.

By contrast, look at Nashville's schedule:

Preds Remaining Opponents
Anaheim (away)
Calgary (1 home, 1 away)
Chicago (home)
Colorado (away)
Columbus (home)
Dallas (2 home)
Detroit (2 home, 2 away)
Edmonton (1 home, 1 away)
Los Angeles (away)
St. Louis (home)
Vancouver (away)

Home Games: 9
Road Games: 8
Games vs Playoff Teams: 10 - 5 home (CAL, DET twice, DAL twice) and 5 away (ANH, CAL, VAN, DET twice)

The Preds are on the road more against tougher teams. Not only that, they still have to make two West coast road trips (SJ, LA, ANH, DET - currently on this one and VAN, CAL, EDM). They finish the schedule with 5 of 6 at home, which might be a final push for them.

With all the injuries, the Central and Western conference are probably going to be decided by the 4 head-to-head games.....

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Old
03-03-2007, 06:54 AM
  #34
OpenWheel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nomorekids View Post
Fiddler hasn't done anything to deserve top six ice time in 3 years, yet he's getting it
I guess you and Coach have differing viewpoints about 'deserve' then.

I'm not trying to pretend I'm a Fiddler fan. Yet Fiddler seemed to at least contribute defensively when buried on some obscure line, whereas Radulov hadn't done much for awhile except wave at opposing players when they went past him to score.

Obviously it would really suck if Radulov isn't soon better all-around then Fiddler. And maybe his offense is worth any defensive liabilitites. Trotz has made noise about his defense improving so hopefully that means real ice time.

I'm more concerned about Legwand playing with scrubs then some rookie's linemates.

I like when Radulov is on the ice. But the ass. gm makes me laugh with his "we need to know" comment. Is he going to be making out the lineups in the playoffs? Is he going to be coaching the team and figuring out the strategies? I thought that was Coach Trotz' job? Seems to me that coach Trotz is the one who needs to know and should go about learning in whatever way he feels like. He'll be the one on the hot seat, not some assistant gm.


Last edited by OpenWheel: 03-03-2007 at 07:00 AM.
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Old
03-03-2007, 07:20 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FissionFire View Post
Report of a thread I made on this exact same subject awhile back on a Wings board:

Wings looks to be in decent shape, even with the injuries, to overcome the Preds for the division and conference titles. I'd even say the Wings are favorites to win the Central division and Western Conference. Why you ask?

Wings Remaining Opponents
Anaheim (home)
Boston (home)
Calgary (away)
Chicago (1 home, 1 away)
Colorado (home)
Columbus (2 home, 1 away)
Dallas (home)
Los Angeles (home)
Nashville (2 home, 2 away)
St. Louis (home)
Vancouver (away)

Home Games: 11
Road Games: 6
Games vs Playoff Teams: 8 - 4 home (ANH, DAL, NSH twice) and 4 away (CAL, VAN, NSH twice)

The Wings are almost entirely playing at home and only have one real road trip (2 game swing to VAN and CAL) left. They play the Ducks at the end of March when Z, Sammy, and even Bert might all be back. Add in the fact they still have 6 games against CLB, CHI, and STL (4 of them at home) and we should be able to rake in the points. Our final 4 games are home-and-home series with Columbus and Chicago.

By contrast, look at Nashville's schedule:

Preds Remaining Opponents
Anaheim (away)
Calgary (1 home, 1 away)
Chicago (home)
Colorado (away)
Columbus (home)
Dallas (2 home)
Detroit (2 home, 2 away)
Edmonton (1 home, 1 away)
Los Angeles (away)
St. Louis (home)
Vancouver (away)

Home Games: 9
Road Games: 8
Games vs Playoff Teams: 10 - 5 home (CAL, DET twice, DAL twice) and 5 away (ANH, CAL, VAN, DET twice)

The Preds are on the road more against tougher teams. Not only that, they still have to make two West coast road trips (SJ, LA, ANH, DET - currently on this one and VAN, CAL, EDM). They finish the schedule with 5 of 6 at home, which might be a final push for them.

With all the injuries, the Central and Western conference are probably going to be decided by the 4 head-to-head games.....
This is something that we have been following and tracking for a long time now.
And I agree, based on current points and upcoming schedule, the Wings SHOULD win the Central.
IF they don't.....it will the mean the Preds have caught fire, and the Wings have tanked for the playoffs.
The Preds have to realistically win 3 out of 4 of head to head meetings to have any chance at all....

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Old
03-03-2007, 08:34 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OpenWheel View Post
I like when Radulov is on the ice. But the ass. gm makes me laugh with his "we need to know" comment. Is he going to be making out the lineups in the playoffs? Is he going to be coaching the team and figuring out the strategies? I thought that was Coach Trotz' job? Seems to me that coach Trotz is the one who needs to know and should go about learning in whatever way he feels like. He'll be the one on the hot seat, not some assistant gm.
They needed to know because they wanted to see if they needed to trade for someone at the deadline. You can laugh all you want, but it was a very important issue, no matter how hard you try to gloss it over.

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03-03-2007, 08:38 AM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Enoch View Post
They needed to know because they wanted to see if they needed to trade for someone at the deadline. You can laugh all you want, but it was a very important issue, no matter how hard you try to gloss it over.
Gotta agree with you, Enoch. There's plenty of respectable third line wingers available during the deadline. While I'm not sure it'll make or break the season, I completely understand him wanting to know whether or not they need to pursue a player like that.

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Old
03-03-2007, 11:19 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Enoch View Post
They needed to know because they wanted to see if they needed to trade for someone at the deadline. You can laugh all you want, but it was a very important issue, no matter how hard you try to gloss it over.
I'm not glossing it over in any way. Stating my opinion that the ass. gm sounds a bit out of line regardless of whether it's important.

Couldn't they just ask Trotz if he planned on going into the playoffs with Radulov playing a key role or if he wanted someone else instead? Seems better then telling Trotz to play someone differently, because the non-coach thinks he has a better way to determine the team needs then the guy who's actually going to battle with those players.

But I guess I can see the counter argument. The argument that thinks Trotz is too dumb to evaluate his players without the gm telling him how to go about it. That Trotz doesn't make plans to both win games now and also be ready to win in the playoffs.

Anyway, as long as they can argue and still pull the same wagon... That's all I care about actually.

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03-03-2007, 01:08 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OpenWheel View Post
I'm not glossing it over in any way. Stating my opinion that the ass. gm sounds a bit out of line regardless of whether it's important.

Couldn't they just ask Trotz if he planned on going into the playoffs with Radulov playing a key role or if he wanted someone else instead? Seems better then telling Trotz to play someone differently, because the non-coach thinks he has a better way to determine the team needs then the guy who's actually going to battle with those players.

But I guess I can see the counter argument. The argument that thinks Trotz is too dumb to evaluate his players without the gm telling him how to go about it. That Trotz doesn't make plans to both win games now and also be ready to win in the playoffs.

Anyway, as long as they can argue and still pull the same wagon... That's all I care about actually.
I'm not arguing that Trotz is dumb and cannot evaluate players. I'm simply pointing out that 1) We know what Fiddler is going to bring to the table in the tight situations (2) We do not know what Radulov is going to bring to the table in the tight situations (3) Our team is built for 3 scoring lines, ideally, with Radulov on the third line. With these 3 points, it seems obvious that the GMs need to know if Radulov is going to be able to fill that role. Trotz denied them, and due to this, they were not able to properly evaulate whether or not they needed to acquire a third liner to play with Hartnell and Legwand.

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03-03-2007, 02:09 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Enoch View Post
I'm not arguing that Trotz is dumb and cannot evaluate players. I'm simply pointing out that 1) We know what Fiddler is going to bring to the table in the tight situations (2) We do not know what Radulov is going to bring to the table in the tight situations (3) Our team is built for 3 scoring lines, ideally, with Radulov on the third line. With these 3 points, it seems obvious that the GMs need to know if Radulov is going to be able to fill that role. Trotz denied them, and due to this, they were not able to properly evaulate whether or not they needed to acquire a third liner to play with Hartnell and Legwand.
I can see that side.

I don't know how important it is unless people figure that a combination of Fiddler and Radulov isn't good enough. And Radu did play some with Legwand and Hartnell and got some ice time before the deadline.

Hopefully they felt good about the team we have. Hate to think we'd head into the playoffs with people involved pointing fingers. Although they don't seem like that sort.

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03-03-2007, 09:51 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by handtrick View Post
This is something that we have been following and tracking for a long time now.
And I agree, based on current points and upcoming schedule, the Wings SHOULD win the Central.
IF they don't.....it will the mean the Preds have caught fire, and the Wings have tanked for the playoffs.
The Preds have to realistically win 3 out of 4 of head to head meetings to have any chance at all....
Not really. Bertuzzi won't be in the lineup until April probably and Zetterberg, Cleary, and Samuelsson probably won't be back until late March. Hasek has a "thigh" injury which could mean anything from the 2 games stated to 2 months. Chelios is having groin issues. Don't be shocked if the Wings lose a bunch down the stretch. Somehow, a line of Matt Ellis, Matt Hussey, and Josh Langfeld I don't think will get it done and Andreas Lilja imitate an NHL defenseman forever.

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03-11-2007, 05:10 PM
  #42
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the recent great play has changed the likelihood of things, some thoughts this afternoon after the wings loss to boston;

let's forget the head to head games for a second here (as if that's really possible) and think thru the possible scenarios.. so no matter the result of any of the wing games specifically;

1)if we go 8-4-0 in our last 12 we finish with 54 wins, 114 points. that would mean the wings would have to go 10-3 or better to beat us. that would give them 53 wins, 115 pts. notice we still would have the tiebreaker so they'd have to outpoint us to win. under our 8-4 scenario, buffalo would then the have to go 10-3-1 or better to beat us out for the president's cup. 10-3-1 would give them 54 wins like us, 114 points as well, which would then revert to the second tiebreaker, head to head results.

2)no matter the specific results of the wing games, if we were to go 9-3-0, we finish with 55 wins and 116 points. meaning the wings would have to go 11-2-0 or better to finish with 117 points and beat us out (we still would own the first tiebreaker). under a 9-3 scenario for us, buffalo has to go 11-2-1 to win the president's cup.

3)on the low side, finish at 7-5, (53 wins, 112 pts), wings still have to go 9-4-0 (52 wins, 113 pts) overall to beat us. while buffalo still has to go 9-3-1 or better to beat us out for the president's.

this first tiebreaker could well wind up being huge here people. how exciting to see how close we are to winnning the central, the west and even the overall nhl. you can even paint a scenario where we could now lose 2 of 3 to the wings outright, and if we took care of other business still win this entire thing. (not that anyone in their right mind would want us to have to do that to win). it sure makes it all easier and more likely if we take care of head to head business though.

this is some more exciting stuff right here ladies and gents. it's hard to put this all in perspective if you're a younger or newer fan... but whatever happens, this 12 game stretch will be something we, as loyal hardcore fans, will each remember the rest of our lives whether that's 10 or 60 years.. a possible historic first that will be there forever, like the first time we made the playoffs will always be etched in memory. there's only one first time for anything, whether it's making the playoffs, winning the division, winning the west, winning a playoff series, or winning the cup. this could well be a special time. savor it, enjoy it.

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03-11-2007, 08:30 PM
  #43
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Great post. It really puts in perspective the importance of taking 8 of 10 points on that recent road trip and following it up with two big wins at home. Even more so, they have surged in spite of the injuries.

Suddenly, the Preds look like they have a much better shot. Tuesday and Wednesday are going to be huge games and the winner of the first is going to be able to apply a lot of pressure on Wednesday night. A sweep by either team, but particularly the Predators because of the current point gap, would be very big.

I still am floored when I think of where this team is at after watching them develop over 9 years. These next 12 games should be awesome.

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