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Florida shopping first overall pick...

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Old
05-02-2014, 08:44 AM
  #26
Hennig
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I know this has probably been beaten to death..

Phaneuf + 8th OA

for

1st OA + Fleischmann

Leafs take a cap dump, and buy him out for a cap hit of 1.5 million cap hit for the next 2 years, and get their #1C in Reinhart. Panthers drop down 7 spots, but also get a veteran top pairing defenseman, and also still get a good prospect. What would leafs need to add to entice the Panthers to make this trade? Would leafs need to retain some of Phaneuf's salary?

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Old
05-02-2014, 08:44 AM
  #27
Unagi
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Same as every year. The GM with the 1st overall is merely listening what other teams would offer for that pick. Smart to do so, doesn't mean he is on the verge of dealing it.

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Old
05-02-2014, 08:45 AM
  #28
Boom Boom Anton
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 416Leafer View Post
Id be surprised to see him trade it straight up.

IF it were traded, most likely it would be for another pick in the top 10 + a piece that can help now (and longterm, therefore under contract for foreseeable future). That way Tallon would be improving now (while Luongo/Campbell are still good) but still adding to the longterm talent/depth.
No way I see that happening for a pick in the top 10. The #1 pick is usually a stud but once you get past the top 2-3 picks, it's crapshoot at best (and after #5 it's even worse).

Look at the #1 picks in the last 10 years:

Crosby, Ovi, EJ, Kane, Stamkos, Tavares, Hall, RNH, Yakupov, MacKinnon. Most (but not all) are franchise type players and some are tops in the NHL.

Now look at the #8 pick (for example) over that same timeframe: Alex Picard, Setoguchi, Peter Mueller, Zach Hamill, Mikkel Boedker, Glennie, Burmistrov, Couturier, Pouliot, Ristolainen. Some busts, some ok players and some solid players in this group.

Would you go from a chance at the top group to a chance at the 2nd group for just "someone that can help out now"? I wouldn't. The only way I see Tallon trading this is if he is swapping only within the first few picks..and even then I doubt it.

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Old
05-02-2014, 08:45 AM
  #29
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Should be an interesting draft. I could see Florida, Edmonton and/or the Isles trading their first for immediate help. Unfortunately for the Isles, all three are looking for defense.

If there is a team with a young, legit top-4 defenseman that isn't as high on that player as others are, they are going to make out like a bandit.

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Old
05-02-2014, 08:47 AM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boom Boom Anton View Post
IMO, if he is shopping it, he is likely only willing to move down a handful of slots...maybe to 3-4 at most. If that's the case, I would say what he'll get is probably a couple of 2nd round picks OR a pick and player. That's historically what has been given in those cases.

If he is truly shopping it for teams even lower than that (which I would doubt), then said teams are going to have to offer a LOT more than that.
Florida needs wingers, and 5-9 is full of wingers that have potential to be better than the top 3, but, come with more risk (Ritchie/Ehlers/Virtanen etc)
I think as long as he is in the top 9, he's safe, at 10, he's looking at Perlini

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Old
05-02-2014, 08:50 AM
  #31
Marlo Stanfield
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kasper11 View Post
Should be an interesting draft. I could see Florida, Edmonton and/or the Isles trading their first for immediate help. Unfortunately for the Isles, all three are looking for defense.

If there is a team with a young, legit top-4 defenseman that isn't as high on that player as others are, they are going to make out like a bandit.
Isles are pretty loaded at defense and more than likely want a forward who can contribute right away.

If the Islanders are trading up to 1, it's more than like to get Sam Reinhart to play with his brother. He addresses both a need and would be a BPA

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Old
05-02-2014, 08:51 AM
  #32
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Eberle + what?

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Old
05-02-2014, 08:56 AM
  #33
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Fla: Kessel

Tor: 1st Overall and 31st overall

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Old
05-02-2014, 08:57 AM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dunkster19 View Post
Buffalo offers Myers
Ekblad will not be as good as Myers if that's what you were thinking

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Old
05-02-2014, 08:58 AM
  #35
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Every year.

And every year after the draft it's "we listened to offers but nothing came even close to being good enough to trade the pick".

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Old
05-02-2014, 08:59 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boom Boom Anton View Post
No way I see that happening for a pick in the top 10. The #1 pick is usually a stud but once you get past the top 2-3 picks, it's crapshoot at best (and after #5 it's even worse).

Look at the #1 picks in the last 10 years:

Crosby, Ovi, EJ, Kane, Stamkos, Tavares, Hall, RNH, Yakupov, MacKinnon. Most (but not all) are franchise type players and some are tops in the NHL.

Now look at the #8 pick (for example) over that same timeframe: Alex Picard, Setoguchi, Peter Mueller, Zach Hamill, Mikkel Boedker, Glennie, Burmistrov, Couturier, Pouliot, Ristolainen. Some busts, some ok players and some solid players in this group.

Would you go from a chance at the top group to a chance at the 2nd group for just "someone that can help out now"? I wouldn't. The only way I see Tallon trading this is if he is swapping only within the first few picks..and even then I doubt it.
I see this draft as more similar to the 2010-2012 drafts.

Hall/RNH/Yakupov vs Skinner/Burmistrov/Granlund, Scheifele/Couturier/Hamilton, and Dumba/Pouliot/Trouba (if looking at 7-9 range). Some pretty good names in those groups.

The gap between the top 3 and the 7-9 range isnt as obvious as the drafts that had Stamkos/Doughty/Pietrangelo, Tavares/Hedman/Duchene, etc in the top 3-4.

Nylander is the probably the most skilled Swedish forward since Backstrom, Ehlers is putting up arguably the best offensive numbers in the draft (looks like a late riser similar to Skinner, only he has a better rounded game then Skinner did when drafted), and then Virtanen/Ritchie are the best powerforward prospects in years.

People call this a "weak" draft, but to me it just looks like it lacks obvious elite talent at the top, but it definitely has depth, at least in the top 9-10.

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Old
05-02-2014, 08:59 AM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Intense Rage View Post
How about...

Nashville
1st overall pick

Florida
Seth Jones

The Preds draft Reinhart/Bennett and get their future #1 center. I would jump at that if I were Tallon but I doubt the Preds have any interest in letting Jones go.
Huh?! Preds decline unless the "+" button is broken on your keyboard. And the "Huberdeau" keys, too.

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Old
05-02-2014, 08:59 AM
  #38
mydnyte
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diesel77 View Post
Fla: Kessel

Tor: 1st Overall and 31st overall
Leafs say no, quickly, and easily.

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Old
05-02-2014, 09:01 AM
  #39
mydnyte
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Next years #1 pick you can write your own ticket, but, this year, not so much.

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Old
05-02-2014, 09:03 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diesel77 View Post
Fla: Kessel

Tor: 1st Overall and 31st overall
Huberdeau-Barkov-Kessel

might be the best scoring line in the league for many years :drool

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Old
05-02-2014, 09:07 AM
  #41
mydnyte
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beer123 View Post
Huberdeau-Barkov-Kessel

might be the best scoring line in the league for many years :drool
perhaps, but, Forida will not get Kessel for this years 1st, and a 2nd. ...pot would need to be sweetened a lot.

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Old
05-02-2014, 09:09 AM
  #42
Boom Boom Anton
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 416Leafer View Post
I see this draft as more similar to the 2010-2012 drafts.

Hall/RNH/Yakupov vs Skinner/Burmistrov/Granlund, Scheifele/Couturier/Hamilton, and Dumba/Pouliot/Trouba (if looking at 7-9 range). Some pretty good names in those groups.
.
That's fine, but I pretty much guarantee you that in 2010, on or before the draft, no GM would have traded the #1 pick (consensus was Hall) for something in the 7-9 range and an NHLr who could help now.

Same goes for 2012. No GM would have traded the pick of Yakupov or Murray for a chance at one of (but uncertainty over which one) guys like Dumba, Pouliot, Trouba, or Koekkoek.

Remember, #1 is a sure thing in terms of you completely control who you draft and it's almost always a sure thing that the guys going to be a stud. Moving down to 7-10 range and you don't control the guy you get any longer and the chance of him being a star goes way down.

If Tallon was looking to trade the #1, I'd be surprised if it was outside of the top 3-4 picks.


Last edited by Boom Boom Anton: 05-02-2014 at 09:18 AM.
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Old
05-02-2014, 09:12 AM
  #43
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There's no clear cut #1 this year. There's 5-6 players that could end up being the best player in the draft.

EDM makes sense if they really feel they want Ekblad.

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Old
05-02-2014, 09:17 AM
  #44
Boom Boom Anton
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Originally Posted by mydnyte View Post
Florida needs wingers, and 5-9 is full of wingers that have potential to be better than the top 3, but, come with more risk (Ritchie/Ehlers/Virtanen etc)
I think as long as he is in the top 9, he's safe, at 10, he's looking at Perlini
He's not safe. He's taking on more risk, no two ways about it.

1) He no longer controls who he picks.
2) The chances of one of those guys being as good as the #1 pick goes way down. It's possible they will be just as good, but history shows that it's not likley.

If he does move it (and I'm skeptical he will), I'd be surprised if he moved outside of the top 3-4 picks.

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Old
05-02-2014, 09:20 AM
  #45
mydnyte
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boom Boom Anton View Post
That's fine, but I pretty much guarantee you that in 2010, on or before the draft, no GM would have traded the #1 pick (consensus was Hall) for something in the 7-9 range and an NHLr who could help now.

Same goes for 2012. No GM would have traded the pick of Yakupov or Murray for a chance at one of (but uncertainty over which one) guys like Dumba, Pouliot, Trouba, or Koekkoek.

Remember, #1 is a sure thing in terms of you completely control who you draft and it's almost always a sure thing that the guys going to be a stud. Moving down to 7-10 range and you don't control the guy you get any longer and the chance of him being a star goes way down.

If Tallon was looking to trade the #1, I'd be VERY surprised if it was outside of the top 3-4 picks.
of course not, but Hall was not the consensus #1, Seguin was in serious competition for top spot, and then there was a HUGE dropoff.
also the fact that Hall was considered a 'franchise' calibre player, and those from 3 down were not even close in talent
in 2012, the top 5 were interchangeable ...the only team that actually went off the board was the Isles (and Leafs a little)
Grigorenko/Forsberg were also considered for #1 overall almost as much as Galy/Murray.
Grigorenko was #1 until about the combines

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05-02-2014, 09:26 AM
  #46
mydnyte
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boom Boom Anton View Post
He's not safe. He's taking on more risk, no two ways about it.

1) He no longer controls who he picks.
2) The chances of one of those guys being as good as the #1 pick goes way down. It's possible they will be just as good, but history shows that it's not likley.

If he does move it (and I'm skeptical he will), I'd be surprised if he moved outside of the top 3-4 picks.
exactly, he's not safe, but, for sure a top winger prospect will be available, and if he doesn't have a pref, it doesn't really matter, if he does, then he moves down accordingly.

I say one of Ehlers, or Nylander may be the best player in the draft, or for that matter the 2 best players in the draft.
It is hard to say anyone in the draft has more talent than those 2.

they are higher reward, but, more risk players, and that is the only reason they are ranked below a Bennett/Reinhart

...Ekblad just happens to be the only decent d-man available, but, I'd want no part of him. (not saying he'll bust, but, is WAY overrated because he's the only decent d-man available this year)

I'd want a good asset to move down, and the further I moved, the more I'd try to get. ...personally, I'd try to grab a spot between 5-7 for the best selection of wingers.

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Old
05-02-2014, 09:36 AM
  #47
Boom Boom Anton
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mydnyte View Post
of course not, but Hall was not the consensus #1, Seguin was in serious competition for top spot, and then there was a HUGE dropoff.
also the fact that Hall was considered a 'franchise' calibre player, and those from 3 down were not even close in talent
in 2012, the top 5 were interchangeable ...the only team that actually went off the board was the Isles (and Leafs a little)
Grigorenko/Forsberg were also considered for #1 overall almost as much as Galy/Murray.
Grigorenko was #1 until about the combines
You didn't follow the full conversation. I never said this draft was like 2010, I was responding to the other poster that said this draft is like the 2010 and 2012 draft in that: "The gap between the top 3 and the 7-9 range isn't as obvious as other drafts" and that because of that, he could see Florida trading down.

My point is that if HE feels that way (not saying I agree), there was no way a GM would have traded down from #1 to the 7-10 spots in those drafts and I don't see it happening now. I think even you are agree on 2010 and 2012 because you are saying no way they would have done it in 2010..and that in 2012, the top 5 were interchangeable.

Obviously anything can happen for the right price, but in the last 15 years, no GM has ever traded #1 pick other than by moving down a couple of spots. I may end up being wrong in the end, but I don't see FLA moving down further than the 3-4 spot (if they even trade it).

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Old
05-02-2014, 09:39 AM
  #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Intense Rage View Post
How about...

Nashville
1st overall pick

Florida
Seth Jones

The Preds draft Reinhart/Bennett and get their future #1 center. I would jump at that if I were Tallon but I doubt the Preds have any interest in letting Jones go.
This makes zero sense, as Preds passed on same calibre forward prospect last year in Monahan/Nichushkin/Lindholm to draft Jones.

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Old
05-02-2014, 09:39 AM
  #49
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The Flyers will be dangling the Schenn brothers and the 17th overall for sure.

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Old
05-02-2014, 09:40 AM
  #50
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Rumor he wants to take ehlers but doesnt want to take the heat if he picks him at #1 so he wants to trade down.


He could get him at #6 after the top 5.

Canucks could offer #6 overall, Edler/Garrison(whoever waives) + small piece.

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