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Changes to NHL draft voted in 23-6.

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Old
03-13-2007, 03:10 PM
  #1
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Changes to NHL draft voted in 23-6.

Not sure if this was posted already, if so. Sorry.

I like the change, do you?

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There will be a new format for determining the order of selection for the 2007 NHL Entry Draft.

Sources tell TSN that NHL teams have voted 23-6 (with one abstention) in favor of introducing a ranking system that places a greater emphasis on playoff performance than regular season results.

Under the existing format, non-playoff teams were placed one through 14 with the lowest regular-season point totals getting the higher pick in the draft, subject to the draft lottery which allows the winning non-playoff team to move up as many as four places.

The remaining 16 teams were seeded 15 through 30 based on inverse order of regular-season finish with one exception - the Stanley Cup-winning team automatically received the 30th and final pick of the first round.

The new format will work as follows:





- The 14 non-playoff teams will be seeded in inverse order of regular-season finish, just as they used to be, with the draft lottery remaining the same.

- Teams that lose in the first round of the playoffs, except those that won regular-season division titles, will be slotted next in inverse order of regular-season point totals.

- Regular-season division winners that did not advance to the Conference finals will be slotted next, in inverse order of regular-season point totals.

- Teams that make the Conference finals will be slotted next, in inverse order of regular-season point totals.

- The two teams that make it to the Stanley Cup final will get the final two picks - No. 29 for the Cup finalist and No. 30 for the Cup champion.

It is a little more difficult to explain than it was, but the basic premise is the farther a team proceeds in the playoffs, the later it will pick in the entry draft.

The concept was initially proposed by the Detroit Red Wings, who argue that playoff success is the true measure of a team's success in any given year and the draft order should reflect that.

The six teams which voted against the change were the Buffalo Sabres, Florida Panthers, Minnesota Wild, New York Islanders, San Jose Sharks and Washington Capitals. The Montreal Canadiens abstained. All remaining NHL teams voted in favor of the change

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03-13-2007, 03:57 PM
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I think teams like the Oliers last year who eek their way into the playoffs and then go far are screwed with this format, but i like the division winner gets pushed back even if they lose in the first round idea.

Not much of a change, but it makes some sense.

I think with this format you might see a few less teams trading at the deadline if they are convinced their team needs a good draft.

If a lower bubble team makes a deal or two and goes out and trades for two rentals - and say they make it to the second or third round, they might lose about 5-10 spots or even more than the previous draft selection method - and might lose those rentals on top of it. You might see some early sellers with this next year. Maybe a little more than usual.


Last edited by HockeyBasedNYC: 03-13-2007 at 04:04 PM.
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03-13-2007, 04:34 PM
  #3
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I don't see any reason to change it.

reverse order from the season ending standings. No one should be "rewarded" for an early playoff exit.

Example, Nashville gets the top seed in the league and gets bounced in the 1st round, they do not deserve the 17th, 18th, 19th or 20th pick, they should still get the 28th pick based on their regular season finish.

This is foolish to think about rewarding teams that get bounced early.

NOT EVERYONE WINS.

SOMETIMES PEOPLE LOSE AND THAT'S OK.

geez, what kind of culture are we creating?


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03-13-2007, 05:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pld459666 View Post
I don't see any reason to change it.

reverse order from the season ending standings. No one should be "rewarded" for an early playoff exit.

Example, Nashville gets the top seed in the league and gets bounced in the 1st round, they do not deserve the 17th, 18th, 19th or 20th pick, they should still get the 28th pick based on their regular season finish.

This is foolish to think about rewarding teams that get bounced early.

NOT EVERYONE WINS.

SOMETIMES PEOPLE LOSE AND THAT'S OK.

geez, what kind of culture are we creating?

One of the reasonings is that I think that the logic is that it's much better to win a playoff round than it is to have a slightly better draft pick.

So you're not really hitting on the point here, IMO.

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Old
03-13-2007, 05:48 PM
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It does screw...

overachieving teams, like the Oilers.

I'm a bit indifferent anyways - but don't think there's a problem with the current format.

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03-13-2007, 05:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
overachieving teams, like the Oilers.

I'm a bit indifferent anyways - but don't think there's a problem with the current format.
How does it screw them? Do you really think that the Oilers would've traded their place in the SCF for a higher draft pick!?

It's not fair for a team that makes it all the way there, if they were an 8th seed, to get the 15th or 16th pick. It's just not the way it should be.

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03-14-2007, 01:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pld459666 View Post
I don't see any reason to change it.

reverse order from the season ending standings. No one should be "rewarded" for an early playoff exit.

Example, Nashville gets the top seed in the league and gets bounced in the 1st round, they do not deserve the 17th, 18th, 19th or 20th pick, they should still get the 28th pick based on their regular season finish.

This is foolish to think about rewarding teams that get bounced early.

NOT EVERYONE WINS.

SOMETIMES PEOPLE LOSE AND THAT'S OK.

geez, what kind of culture are we creating?

I don't necessarily think this is some kind of PC measure to make teams feel better about losing. If anything, I'm surprised it hasn't been set up this way already. The Cup finals teams should be 29 and 30. Teams bounced out of the playoffs first ought to be next on the draft list after the 14 teams who didn't qualify.

It's not like a playoff team who had a great regular season gets into the playoffs and says "Gee fellas, we'd better cool off now, lest we get a worse draft pick." Come on now...

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03-14-2007, 01:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch View Post
overachieving teams, like the Oilers.

I'm a bit indifferent anyways - but don't think there's a problem with the current format.
I agree, I don't see the need for the change to be honest.

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03-14-2007, 05:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Rx View Post
One of the reasonings is that I think that the logic is that it's much better to win a playoff round than it is to have a slightly better draft pick.

So you're not really hitting on the point here, IMO.
I fully agree that it's better to win a PO series than it is to have a better draft position, but what's the point then of giving teams like Nashville the better draft choice if they happen to falter and bet bumped in the 1st round?

It makes no sense.

To me, if there's no inherent reason for making a move like this, then the only logoc I can come up with is that they are looking to make getting an early PO exit a bit softer on those teams and that's absurd.

If the top 14 teams are based on standings (with the lottery affesting maybe the top 5 teams) then 15-30 should also be set by standings. I also think that it's screwed up that the team in the SC Finals get the 29th and 30th picks.

Anyway, I just don't see the need to do this.

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03-14-2007, 05:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRGNYR View Post
I don't necessarily think this is some kind of PC measure to make teams feel better about losing. If anything, I'm surprised it hasn't been set up this way already. The Cup finals teams should be 29 and 30. Teams bounced out of the playoffs first ought to be next on the draft list after the 14 teams who didn't qualify.

It's not like a playoff team who had a great regular season gets into the playoffs and says "Gee fellas, we'd better cool off now, lest we get a worse draft pick." Come on now...

No one is saying that.

As I stated in another post, I have no doubt that every teams goal is to win their PO series once they get in and to go as far as possible, but my question is, and I can't seem to find a logical answer and neither you nor Jon RX have addressed the question, why would the NHL make this type of move if they weren't looking to soften the blow of an early PO exit?

These are grownass men we are talking about and they need to be coddled about with a better draft spot for failing in the PO's??

Additionally, as stated previously, the draft should be set based on the final standings from the regular season 1-30 and the 2 teams playing for the SC should not be "screwed" in that if one were a cinderella team it shouldn't drop from 18th to 30th in the draft.

like I said, there doesn't seem to be a real reason to do this other than basically rewarding teams for an early PO exit.

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03-14-2007, 07:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pld459666 View Post
I don't see any reason to change it.

reverse order from the season ending standings. No one should be "rewarded" for an early playoff exit.

Example, Nashville gets the top seed in the league and gets bounced in the 1st round, they do not deserve the 17th, 18th, 19th or 20th pick, they should still get the 28th pick based on their regular season finish.
Read the paragraph about "division" winners.

Quote:
This is foolish to think about rewarding teams that get bounced early.

NOT EVERYONE WINS.

SOMETIMES PEOPLE LOSE AND THAT'S OK.

geez, what kind of culture are we creating?

But the current draft system rewards the worst losers most. Heck, you don't even have to try - in fact, you're encouraged NOT to try - if you want to pick some surefire superstar.

You say fans are supposed to accept losing on the ice but not "losing" in the draft order?

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03-14-2007, 08:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GuloGulo View Post
Read the paragraph about "division" winners.



But the current draft system rewards the worst losers most. Heck, you don't even have to try - in fact, you're encouraged NOT to try - if you want to pick some surefire superstar.

You say fans are supposed to accept losing on the ice but not "losing" in the draft order?
so basically you are questioning the integrity of the teams in the league.

Again, I'm not saying that teams will throw a PO series to ensure a better draft position, but the regular season has already been decided and that alone should be the determining factor for draft position.

What you bring up has nothing to do with being rewarded a better draft spot for getting ousted early.

As for rewarding the worst loser, that system is meant to balance out the league. Teams that lose to the point where they are dead last in the league, more often than not (I'd say 99.99% of the time), lose because of the players they have playing for their team not because they are instructed to lose. Those are the teams that need to be assisted. Teams that make the playoffs do so because they were good enough, and obviously do not need the added assistance of a better Draft position.

To take that team (Nashville for instance because they have the most to gain from this situation) and give them the 16th, 17th, 18th or 19th pick because of an early PO exit (in an at most 7 game series) after winning the Presidents trophy after an 82 game season is absurd and I can't see how it can be viewed otherwise.

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03-14-2007, 09:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pld459666 View Post
so basically you are questioning the integrity of the teams in the league.
There's no doubt several teams each season throw the post-deadline games to the wind in order to "build for the future". These (in my book ********ing loser teams) retain their picks as usual.

Quote:
Again, I'm not saying that teams will throw a PO series to ensure a better draft position, but the regular season has already been decided and that alone should be the determining factor for draft position.
If the schedule was perfectly balanced, yes. Since it ain't, no. The regular season does not give a black and white image of which of the playoff teams that is in most need of high draft picks. Having 100 points in one division could equal 90 in another. Remember these changes only affect playoff teams. THEIR internal order is adjusted by playoff results.

Quote:
What you bring up has nothing to do with being rewarded a better draft spot for getting ousted early.
Which I just explained above.
Playoff teams "strength" is measured with playoff results.

Quote:
As for rewarding the worst loser, that system is meant to balance out the league. Teams that lose to the point where they are dead last in the league, more often than not (I'd say 99.99% of the time), lose because of the players they have playing for their team not because they are instructed to lose. Those are the teams that need to be assisted. Teams that make the playoffs do so because they were good enough, and obviously do not need the added assistance of a better Draft position.
Sucking today doesn't mean you'll suck in 4 years when your draft pick hits the ice.

Quote:
To take that team (Nashville for instance because they have the most to gain from this situation) and give them the 16th, 17th, 18th or 19th pick because of an early PO exit (in an at most 7 game series) after winning the Presidents trophy after an 82 game season is absurd and I can't see how it can be viewed otherwise.
Nashville would pick in 22nd in your example.
14 teams ahead of them, those that are out of playoffs. Then 7 teams that lose in the 1st round, all seeded lower than NSH.

If Nashville wins the President's trophy by playing amazing hockey in October, yet smells balls in April, what is the evidence they were indeed the "best team least in need of assistance" during that season, when other teams evidently knocked them out?

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03-14-2007, 10:44 AM
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http://tsn.ca/nhl/news_story/?ID=200073&hubname=nhl

"New Draft Order only affects Final Four"

Quote:
So here's all you need to know about the new rules for entry draft order of selection: The only change to the existing format is that the final four teams that make it to the Conference finals will get the final four picks in the draft, regardless of where they finished in the regular season.

The Cup champion will pick 30th, the Cup finalist 29th and the two losers from Conference championships will pick 28th and 27th. Whichever of those two teams finished lower in the regular season standings will get the 27th pick.
Bob McKenzie understood it incorrectly..

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03-14-2007, 12:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GuloGulo View Post
There's no doubt several teams each season throw the post-deadline games to the wind in order to "build for the future". These (in my book ********ing loser teams) retain their picks as usual.
Most teams that trade their stars at the deadline already know that theri team is not going to make the post season, additionally they usually trade players that are in the last years of their contracts which means they gain assets for an asset that had the potential to leave, and not provide any return at all. That is called good asset management. The result in that is there is a higher probability of a better draft position due to not having that player anymore, but in reality, could they do much worse with that player if they were already NOT IN THE PLAYOFFS? I can see your point, but don't put much value into it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by GuloGulo View Post
If the schedule was perfectly balanced, yes. Since it ain't, no. The regular season does not give a black and white image of which of the playoff teams that is in most need of high draft picks. Having 100 points in one division could equal 90 in another. Remember these changes only affect playoff teams. THEIR internal order is adjusted by playoff results.
Who cares what a playoff team needs, they already are in the playoffs and the team that gets slotted with the 17th selection shouldn't lose out on that spot becuase a Nashville got dumped early, nor should that team lose out because they win the stanley cup. The regular season is used to determin playoff positioning, why isn't that also good enough to determine draft position?


Quote:
Originally Posted by GuloGulo View Post
Which I just explained above.
Playoff teams "strength" is measured with playoff results.
Playoff strength? Please, I've seen enough cinderella runs to know that a hot goalie alone can win you 2 rounds. That doesn't tell me that the team is strong, just that the golaie was solid in both rounds. your playoff strength issue has to many holes as we have seen time and again that some mis-matches or what we thought were mis-matches ended up being upsets of legend, or as a RedWing fan do you not remember what San Jose did to you guys a few years ago??


Quote:
Originally Posted by GuloGulo View Post
Sucking today doesn't mean you'll suck in 4 years when your draft pick hits the ice.
Which is why teams that suck today get the higher picks. So that they do not suck in 4 years



Quote:
Originally Posted by GuloGulo View Post
Nashville would pick in 22nd in your example.
14 teams ahead of them, those that are out of playoffs. Then 7 teams that lose in the 1st round, all seeded lower than NSH.
22nd is still better than 30th which is where they should be picking.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GuloGulo View Post
If Nashville wins the President's trophy by playing amazing hockey in October, yet smells balls in April, what is the evidence they were indeed the "best team least in need of assistance" during that season, when other teams evidently knocked them out?
Please, no team wins the Presidents trophy in October even if they were to win EVERY game in the month.

I just don't see the logic behind it and now that it's been confirmed that it will only affect the final 4 teams I'm still not sure what the logic is, but whatever. It's not going to change because I don't like it.

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03-18-2007, 04:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dank View Post
http://tsn.ca/nhl/news_story/?ID=200073&hubname=nhl

"New Draft Order only affects Final Four"



Bob McKenzie understood it incorrectly..
That works fine for me.

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03-18-2007, 06:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dank View Post
http://tsn.ca/nhl/news_story/?ID=200073&hubname=nhl

"New Draft Order only affects Final Four"



Bob McKenzie understood it incorrectly..
That works for me too. There's one other reason I can think of in which I wouldn't like the 16-30 picks all up for grabs and that is a very good team getting blasted by injuries in the playoffs and just wiping out. Take us for example last season--not saying that New Jersey wasn't going to win anyway but as soon as Jagr went down and with Henrik not altogether recovered we were sitting ducks. One could see where Detroit is coming from--they always have some kind of plan for the finals but they are older and if they got bounced early--maybe because of a lot of injuries they'd be picking maybe 8-10 slots earlier than where their regular season record would have them. The four finalists idea is okay--the rest should stay the same.

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