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Old
03-22-2007, 01:01 PM
  #26
Teufelsdreck
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I don't know a blessed thing about Cherepanov but I hope the Habs draft him because it would steam some of the fans.

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03-22-2007, 01:21 PM
  #27
Blind Gardien
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Originally Posted by Diogenes View Post
I don't know a blessed thing about Cherepanov but I hope the Habs draft him because it would steam some of the fans.
I think as we stay afloat in the playoff race and our potential draft position lops off some of the higher end possibilities (i.e. top-10 looks highly unlikely now - Philly, Phoenix, LA, Columbus, Chicago, St.Louis, Edmonton, Washington... Boston, Florida getting there)...

... well, the fact that we have 2 picks ought to give us plenty of pause for thought if a top-end talent like Cherepanov or Espo is falling to our own pick. Reasons why they might fall certainly seem to be emerging. (Espo moreso than Cherepanov, and the Russian situation heavily factored in for any Cherepanov-fall speculation).

But if you could nab one of those big top-10 candidate talents with a 12th-15th pick, and then play the San Jose pick for more of a grit/character/D element, well, it would be lots of fun for the fans. I doubt it would steam (m)anybody at all if we got Cherepanov in the middle of the 1st round! Even if he does slump and get more knocks from the WU-18 or whatever is left for him this year.

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Old
03-22-2007, 01:29 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Turnbuckle,

What can you tell me about Cross, Sweatt, Hoeffel and O'Brien. Since we have Fischer as a project in the system already, can Cross be considered a long-term project as well so Timmins might not go that way this year and maybe go with prospect that could be ready a little sooner?

I've seen Sweatt, Hoeffel and O'Brien a couple of times and was impressed by them every single time I've seen them, who brings different things to table, but who really was impressive by their dedication and hard play. They were really noticeable in all the games that I've seen. Should we go the US way once again?
Well; we have nine Americans ranked between 10 and 27, so there's a darn good chance we'll be picking an American with at least one of our picks.

McDonagh is ranked right where the Habs are currently sitting. He and Shattenkirk are better bets to be picked with the Habs' first selection than O'Brien and Hoeffel.

Hoeffel just blew out his knee - he had limited offensive upside before the injury, and given what Timmins has said about him to me, I would be quite surprised if the ends up a Hab unless he is available in the third round.

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03-22-2007, 01:30 PM
  #29
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What's with the sudden talk about Cherepanov dropping...because Woodlief did his usual thing and overreacted to one tournament?

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03-22-2007, 01:35 PM
  #30
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According to what I read on this draft, I expect the 'predictions' to be far from what will trully happen.

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03-22-2007, 01:35 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by turnbuckle View Post
What's with the sudden talk about Cherepanov dropping...because Woodlief did his usual thing and overreacted to one tournament?
I think people are putting more weight in to the lack of an RSL-NHL transfer agreement than is actually merited. I don't think GMs will shy away from drafting the BPA just because the prospect is Russian. Malkin paved the way for other Russian prospects to come to the NHL if they want to.

One thing that is alarming is that many Russian prospects aren't keen on coming over to play in the AHL for far less money than they earn at their RSL club.

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Old
03-22-2007, 01:59 PM
  #32
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I think people are putting more weight in to the lack of an RSL-NHL transfer agreement than is actually merited. I don't think GMs will shy away from drafting the BPA just because the prospect is Russian. Malkin paved the way for other Russian prospects to come to the NHL if they want to.

One thing that is alarming is that many Russian prospects aren't keen on coming over to play in the AHL for far less money than they earn at their RSL club.
Exactly. For those of us who really never see these guys (save for WJC), we can certainly speculate about any of the standard worries, so long as the player in question isn't truly considered to be head and shoulders above the rest.

Nothing I've read or seen suggests that Cherepanov is thought of as being in the Malkin/Ovechkin class of guy that teams are going to pick at the top no matter what. (Maybe he is, though, I don't know).

If instead he's just approximately on a level with the rest of the "consensus" top 10 - Kane, Turris, Voracek, Alzner, Couture, Gagner, JvR, maybe Espo, maybe Sutter, one's mileage may vary - well, then it becomes fair game to speculate that a guy who could arguably be pegged anywhere in that group... but has the additional knocks of playing in Russia with no transfer agreement... could be slotted behind others for that reason alone.

Then if one really wants to go out on a highly speculative limb... and imagine that something like Woodlief's knocks about attitude/intensity from one tournament viewing were to be repeated in the WU-18... and speculate further that maybe there are teams out there in the draft order who really want to value a defenseman or have a Setoguchi-like off-the-board favourite to slot in... well, it's not necessarily inconceivable that you can speculate about Cherepanov somehow being on the board for, say, a 12th pick.

While still recognizing the improbability of it and not wanting to marry Woodlief for his overreaction, say.

I mean, we talked at length here about taking Kopitar with our #5 pick. He dropped to #11. Frolik's case is probably more like Espo's, but we saw a guy touted as a #1 candidate at one point drop to #10. We've heard some fairly hyped claims about Russian guys like, I dunno, Vasyunov or maybe Anikyeenko or Popov or Zubov being these guys with "1st round talent" or whatever (not as high as Cherepanov of course) but ultimately falling waaaay lower than some of that hype, based on whatever combination of transfer agreement + attitude/intensity questions you want to believe in... so it's probably plenty fair game for us to at least speculate about the potential of something happening to make Cherepanov become miraculously available to us.

I guess we'll see how the season finishes out. Just from the WJC I thought Cherepanov was a clear top-5 guy myself. But I'm open to speculation based on other factors.

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03-22-2007, 02:07 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by RedScull View Post
I think people are putting more weight in to the lack of an RSL-NHL transfer agreement than is actually merited. I don't think GMs will shy away from drafting the BPA just because the prospect is Russian. Malkin paved the way for other Russian prospects to come to the NHL if they want to.

One thing that is alarming is that many Russian prospects aren't keen on coming over to play in the AHL for far less money than they earn at their RSL club.
That's a good point about coming over to play in the AHL. However, it's also why players that aren't as highly touted as Malkin (read every Russian prospect this year except perhaps Cherpy) may indeed drop a bit. Teams are going to want to know beforehand that the player is interested in coming over to play to a certain extent I think.

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Old
03-22-2007, 06:56 PM
  #34
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Turmbuckle, can you tell me a little more about this Shattenkirk defenceman? What kind of game does he play? what does his Nhl future look like, and who does he compare to

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03-22-2007, 07:11 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
Exactly. For those of us who really never see these guys (save for WJC), we can certainly speculate about any of the standard worries, so long as the player in question isn't truly considered to be head and shoulders above the rest.

Nothing I've read or seen suggests that Cherepanov is thought of as being in the Malkin/Ovechkin class of guy that teams are going to pick at the top no matter what. (Maybe he is, though, I don't know).

If instead he's just approximately on a level with the rest of the "consensus" top 10 - Kane, Turris, Voracek, Alzner, Couture, Gagner, JvR, maybe Espo, maybe Sutter, one's mileage may vary - well, then it becomes fair game to speculate that a guy who could arguably be pegged anywhere in that group... but has the additional knocks of playing in Russia with no transfer agreement... could be slotted behind others for that reason alone.

Then if one really wants to go out on a highly speculative limb... and imagine that something like Woodlief's knocks about attitude/intensity from one tournament viewing were to be repeated in the WU-18... and speculate further that maybe there are teams out there in the draft order who really want to value a defenseman or have a Setoguchi-like off-the-board favourite to slot in... well, it's not necessarily inconceivable that you can speculate about Cherepanov somehow being on the board for, say, a 12th pick.

While still recognizing the improbability of it and not wanting to marry Woodlief for his overreaction, say.

I mean, we talked at length here about taking Kopitar with our #5 pick. He dropped to #11. Frolik's case is probably more like Espo's, but we saw a guy touted as a #1 candidate at one point drop to #10. We've heard some fairly hyped claims about Russian guys like, I dunno, Vasyunov or maybe Anikyeenko or Popov or Zubov being these guys with "1st round talent" or whatever (not as high as Cherepanov of course) but ultimately falling waaaay lower than some of that hype, based on whatever combination of transfer agreement + attitude/intensity questions you want to believe in... so it's probably plenty fair game for us to at least speculate about the potential of something happening to make Cherepanov become miraculously available to us.

I guess we'll see how the season finishes out. Just from the WJC I thought Cherepanov was a clear top-5 guy myself. But I'm open to speculation based on other factors.
Not only did he was spectacular in the WJC but he's got insane numbers in RSL, much better than any of Ovechkin, Malkin or Kovalchuk...it should ring a bell...the guy is dynamite. At 17 playing like he is in the RSL...he's a top 3 guy, for sure...

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Old
03-22-2007, 07:21 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by filly_canadiens View Post
Turmbuckle, can you tell me a little more about this Shattenkirk defenceman? What kind of game does he play? what does his Nhl future look like, and who does he compare to
KS is a solid defenceman - he's pretty much a consensus 10-20 pick; many have him in their top four defencemen for the draft.

He's pretty solid in his own end and also has some offensive upside. Seems to come up with big goals at big times; a leader and a solid citizen. His biggest concern remains his backward skating...he just doesn't do it. He gets away with it at this level because he's so exceptional at playing the angles and anticipating, but will it become an issue at the NHL level? Most think he'll make the transition okay.

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