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2013-2014 Hartford Wolf Pack/Greenville Road Warriors Thread Part III

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Old
06-10-2014, 08:08 AM
  #601
NYR Viper
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It's not that he's not good enough--he's not good enough to play for the Rangers. And seriously we don't need another small forward.
Things change over an off-season. I wouldn't mind seeing him play on the opposite wing from Kreider.

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06-10-2014, 10:29 AM
  #602
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It's not that he's not good enough--he's not good enough to play for the Rangers and we don't need another small forward.

We should really trade Kristo before he becomes a UFA. Even if he makes the team out of camp, what are the odds he will play 80 games.

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06-10-2014, 10:31 AM
  #603
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Things change over an off-season. I wouldn't mind seeing him play on the opposite wing from Kreider.

Fast has a better shot at that.

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06-10-2014, 01:47 PM
  #604
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We should really trade Kristo before he becomes a UFA. Even if he makes the team out of camp, what are the odds he will play 80 games.
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Originally Posted by Beacon View Post
Fast has a better shot at that.
Agree with both statements. Fast has a two way game. A bit more sandpaper and he'll penalty kill. I don't get the sense that Kristo competes as hard as Jesper either.

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06-10-2014, 03:52 PM
  #605
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It's not that he's not good enough--he's not good enough to play for the Rangers. And seriously we don't need another small forward.
It's not that he's small. He's decent size. But he plays a small mans game. Perimeter player who is not anything special as a skater, and isn't special with or without the puck.

I just don't see how he's an nhl player for anyone. He's probably going to always be an ahl player. Maybe a few call ups here or there. But unless he makes dramatic improvements (unlikely at his age) then he's just never going to be a legitimate nhl player.

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06-12-2014, 03:52 AM
  #606
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The RD might be great in CT if Zamo goes there. Allen, MCI & Zamo would be great there. The team will need at least one veteran LD. Hughes and Bodie can play, but one star AHLer would definitely help.

Noreau likely starts in the ECHL, but one of our RD likely makes the NHL midway through the season, allowing Noreau to get a chance in the AHL.

Hrivik, Bourque, Yogan, McCarthy will be a great LW group.

Kristo, Haggerty and Kantor are solid, but one solid AHL RW vet would be needed.

We are weak at center. Lindberg is good; St. Croix has potential. We need to sign one star center like Newbury and one more for the bottom-6.

In addition, an AHL team needs twice as many replacements. Not only do they get injuries themselves, they get raided by the NHL squads to replace injured NHLers.

Nicholls up front and Noreau on defense isn't enough depth. Several guys will need to be added.

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06-12-2014, 08:56 AM
  #607
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Originally Posted by Beacon View Post
The RD might be great in CT if Zamo goes there. Allen, MCI & Zamo would be great there. The team will need at least one veteran LD. Hughes and Bodie can play, but one star AHLer would definitely help.

Noreau likely starts in the ECHL, but one of our RD likely makes the NHL midway through the season, allowing Noreau to get a chance in the AHL.

Hrivik, Bourque, Yogan, McCarthy will be a great LW group.

Kristo, Haggerty and Kantor are solid, but one solid AHL RW vet would be needed.

We are weak at center. Lindberg is good; St. Croix has potential. We need to sign one star center like Newbury and one more for the bottom-6.

In addition, an AHL team needs twice as many replacements. Not only do they get injuries themselves, they get raided by the NHL squads to replace injured NHLers.

Nicholls up front and Noreau on defense isn't enough depth. Several guys will need to be added.
Noreau is a left shot I'm pretty sure. I remember watching him in Traverse City and he always played left side. He had a pretty decent year in Greenville. Played regular. Very good +/- relative to his teammates.

I agree that the Rangers need to bring in some vets who can lead the way. Two on defense--two forwards and probably a goaltender. Ryan Bourque had his best season by far--and the second part of the season is where he really seemed to start putting up some points for the first time as an AHL'er. A real breakthrough. About two thirds of his 21 goals were scored in the second half of the season. To me it's like a light went on--and I'm intrigued by that. I don't see him making the Rangers out of training camp but if he can take another leap forward he becomes a reality.

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06-12-2014, 09:29 AM
  #608
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Noreau is a righty.

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06-13-2014, 02:34 AM
  #609
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The types of players we need, if we were bringing back our previous guys are (and I am not saying bring them back, just those types):

1. Kris Newbury at center
2. Brandon Segal at rw
3. Shayne Wiebe for bottom-6 depth (AHL deal)
4. Kyle Jean as depth to get called up from the ECHL (AHL deal)
5. Syvret on the top D unit

People need to realize that the HWP is nota prospect list, it is a team. If the Rangers call up 1-2 people when their injuries hit and the HWP suffer 2-3 injuries, they wouldn't even be able to roll 3 lines if we just get 12+6 AHLers. We need scrubs like Kyle Jean to come in when injuries hit.


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06-13-2014, 09:07 AM
  #610
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The types of players we need, if we were bringing bad our previous guys are (and I am not saying bring them back, just those types):

1. Kris Newbury at center
2. Brandon Segal at rw
3. Shayne Wiebe for bottom-6 depth (AHL deal)
4. Kyle Jean as depth to get called up from the ECHL (AHL deal)
5. Syvret on the top D unit

People need to realize that the HWP is nota prospect list, it is a team. If the Rangers call up 1-2 people when their injuries hit and the HWP suffer 2-3 injuries, they wouldn't even be able to roll 3 lines if we just get 12+6 AHLers. We need scrubs like Kyle Jean to come in when injuries hit.
They should also add Rowe Viave and Marcou from Greenville they all had good season.I think Rowe and Marcou were on AHL deals any way .Good Depth

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06-13-2014, 05:27 PM
  #611
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maybe Allen did play Right side when McIlrath, Hughes and Stamler were in the lineup, but that's surprising to me,
I'd assumed he was on the left with Johnson and Syvret, when there were 3 R and 3 L dressed, and those 6 were the crew for most of the stretch run.

Although Andersson and maybe Zamorsky may go back to Europe, and Donnay back to Juunior, that still leaves Hughes, McIlrath, Noreau shooting R. Resigning Marcou seems a longshot, he's also a R shot.
Personally I wished they'd signed Dan Maggio before, and if they think McIlrath will spend much time IN NHL, his size and physical game would be welcome.

Only Allen and Bodie shoot left among the signed young pro's (and Graves, but he's going back to Q)

Maybe they turn a couple RFA's (Missiaen, Jean, Beach, Wilson(haha)) into young D

up front
I do think Vaive should return, he was good during GRW's playoff run and we lack that kind of size.
And Hensick could come back as the vet presence with Powe and Haley leaving

did any one see Latta play in his few games w HWP?

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06-13-2014, 05:51 PM
  #612
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Who the hell would give up a young D for Missiaen, Jean, Beach or Wilson. Talk about wanting something for nothing!

These are ECHL players. You can't trade ECHLers...

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06-13-2014, 06:38 PM
  #613
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Originally Posted by cwede View Post
maybe Allen did play Right side when McIlrath, Hughes and Stamler were in the lineup, but that's surprising to me,
I'd assumed he was on the left with Johnson and Syvret, when there were 3 R and 3 L dressed, and those 6 were the crew for most of the stretch run.

Although Andersson and maybe Zamorsky may go back to Europe, and Donnay back to Juunior, that still leaves Hughes, McIlrath, Noreau shooting R. Resigning Marcou seems a longshot, he's also a R shot.
Personally I wished they'd signed Dan Maggio before, and if they think McIlrath will spend much time IN NHL, his size and physical game would be welcome.

Only Allen and Bodie shoot left among the signed young pro's (and Graves, but he's going back to Q)

Maybe they turn a couple RFA's (Missiaen, Jean, Beach, Wilson(haha)) into young D

up front
I do think Vaive should return, he was good during GRW's playoff run and we lack that kind of size.
And Hensick could come back as the vet presence with Powe and Haley leaving

did any one see Latta play in his few games w HWP?
Beach was acquired for Mashinter (who sucks) and then did nothing. What value would he have? He's a headcase that has sucked at every stop. Who would give up anything for him?

Missiaen is an ECHL-caliber goalie. Again, where is the demand for that? You can find a couple dozen guys like Missiaen each and every summer for nothing other than an ECHL deal.

Jean and Wilson suck. Wilson isn't even a good CHL player. My guess is he gives it another go, plays one more year in the ECHL and then hangs 'em up.

None of these guys have any value whatsoever.

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06-14-2014, 03:09 PM
  #614
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I pray they keep one or both of LeNeveu and/or Dov Grumet Morris. Missiaen can't hack it at the AHL level and Malcolm is progressing well at the ECHL level, Stajcer is done.

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06-14-2014, 10:07 PM
  #615
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when i wrote: "Maybe they turn a couple RFA's (Missiaen, Jean, Beach, Wilson(haha)) into young D"
i am not expecting immediate stars but teams will trade RFAs they don't want to sign/qualify for unproven prospects/'someone else's trash' because its low risk and sometimes it works out

Beach will get a shot somewhere - He was drafted 11th overall -
see how long Jessiman's pro career lasted in North America? - 8 years!

Missiaen has a strong playoff w Greenville but got hurt.
As a former (Habs) draft pick and a young goalie with occasional success, and exposure to Benny Allaire, he'll get interest too.

Kyle Jean had an ok rookie year, a terrible 1/2 year with HWP, a decent 2d 1/2 with Greenville then a strong playoff with Greenville

Agreed Wilson was a bust

There are RFA's around on D that need changes of scenery too - guys like Ben Blood in Ottawa or Tommy Cross of Bruins just to name a couple.

Just like we turned Tommy Grant into Mashinter into Beach, these low level deals happen all the time

OH - and the word on Malcolm is that the Yale kid is leaving full-time hockey for grad school or white-collar career


Last edited by cwede: 06-14-2014 at 10:10 PM. Reason: correction and added sentence
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06-14-2014, 11:07 PM
  #616
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Cswede: nobody is giving up "unproven prospects" for proven busts. Nobody will give up a 7th rounder for all of them combined.

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06-15-2014, 01:14 AM
  #617
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Agree with both statements. Fast has a two way game. A bit more sandpaper and he'll penalty kill. I don't get the sense that Kristo competes as hard as Jesper either.
Yeah Danny's not a bad kid but he took the long route in his development and it really hurt him. Kid didn't look like he was ever coached to play defense in college, and the player you see in him is at best a Devin Setoguchi... at best, and that's not a compliment.

Last year might have been the first time he's had to play D, and he was pretty lost. Compete level not high after the 1st month in the AHL. Stats and performance took a nose dive soon after.

Pro game and college game are two different beasts, the amount of games also got to Kristo as he looked fatigued mid-season. At this point its a do or die year for him, and with a coach like AV that wants consistency in all 3 zones, Marek Hrivik and even Ryan Bourque are ahead of him in that regard.

If Lindberg picks up the pace from the second half of the year, I think its safe to say Kristo is buried in a farm that isn't exactly an the upper echelon of the league. He's six years removed from his draft year and has yet to sniff an NHL game. Top prospect my tuckus.

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06-15-2014, 02:44 AM
  #618
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Every prospect mentioned in your post Mikos87 has been a professional hockey player for at least several years. Fast and and Lindberg both played in one of the better professional leagues in the world. I think you're comparing apples and oranges.

Kristo spent 4 years in college--we can argue over whether he should have left earlier or spent more time learning the defensive side of the game. However, he's only played professionally for a little over a year. It's way too early to suggest he's never going to get any further than the AHL. Let's see what happens over the summer--hopefully Kristo will use this season as motivation and come into training camp fighting to take the next step.

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06-15-2014, 07:38 AM
  #619
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Best not to worry about getting some kind of value out of players who have already busted. There are plenty of free agent prospects running around the hockey world. The point of the Haggerty, McCarthy, Bodie, Zamorsky signings. Guys like Jean, Missiaen, Beach, Stajcer and Wilson are pretty much done. Best they can hope for is the ECHL or even lesser leagues. None of them guys have shown they can be productive AHL players--so they're not going to be NHL players--so why would another team waste their time with them?

What Hartford is going to need are a few AHL vets (some NHL experience helps) who can help stabilize the team and acclimatize young players turning pro. Beacon mentioned Newbury--who has been around a while--has never seriously secured an NHL spot but who is a good and productive AHL player. Guys like that are good to have around. You're not just throwing a bunch of first and second year pros on the ice and saying--'Go win!'--which wouldn't be very likely to happen. Best to have your good prospects in a winning environment and guys like Newbury help to create that. Last year a major, major problem in Hartford was crap goaltending. After Talbot became a Ranger--Missiaen, Stajcer, Malcolm all got shots in goal and the team went down the tubes. They waited way too long deciding on these guys. If Grumet-Morris and/or LeNeveu had been brought in a month earlier Hartford probably makes the playoffs. The team became much, much better with competent goaltending.

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06-17-2014, 08:16 PM
  #620
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Every prospect mentioned in your post Mikos87 has been a professional hockey player for at least several years. Fast and and Lindberg both played in one of the better professional leagues in the world. I think you're comparing apples and oranges.

Kristo spent 4 years in college--we can argue over whether he should have left earlier or spent more time learning the defensive side of the game. However, he's only played professionally for a little over a year. It's way too early to suggest he's never going to get any further than the AHL. Let's see what happens over the summer--hopefully Kristo will use this season as motivation and come into training camp fighting to take the next step.
I don't disagree with you, MSL really didn't become a full time NHLer until 25, as mentioned, I don't think he's ever played 3-zone hockey from what I saw in the A. The tools are there, but the toolbox...? I saw enough where I think he's a ways away from the NHL defensively.

Missing checks, stick not on the ice, stick not in passing lanes, winning board battles or creating turnovers on the forecheck. Basically my pov is that he is an NHL talent with the puck on his stick, but nowhere else.

He did dominate during college and was the best player outside of Lindberg at Traverse City, but that's it so far. He'll need to do a lot more to become an NHLer on a winning team, I don't think Fast is as gifted offensively as Kristo, but he makes the team because he won't hurt you defensively in a game where the margin for error are very small.

Not saying he won't make it, but saying it will be unlikely with the Rangers, especially with him turning UFA next year (unless he plays 80 games with the Rangers).

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06-17-2014, 08:20 PM
  #621
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What Hartford is going to need are a few AHL vets (some NHL experience helps) who can help stabilize the team and acclimatize young players turning pro. Beacon mentioned Newbury--who has been around a while--has never seriously secured an NHL spot but who is a good and productive AHL player. Guys like that are good to have around. You're not just throwing a bunch of first and second year pros on the ice and saying--'Go win!'--which wouldn't be very likely to happen. Best to have your good prospects in a winning environment and guys like Newbury help to create that. Last year a major, major problem in Hartford was crap goaltending. After Talbot became a Ranger--Missiaen, Stajcer, Malcolm all got shots in goal and the team went down the tubes. They waited way too long deciding on these guys. If Grumet-Morris and/or LeNeveu had been brought in a month earlier Hartford probably makes the playoffs. The team became much, much better with competent goaltending.
Newbury would be a great pickup. I think of him as the AHL Mark Messier from the way he plays and what he brings to a team. I'd like to watch HFD become a winning environment. It really helps with developing kids too by getting them used to winning. The Monarchs haven't won championships but they field competitive teams, I think it goes a long way in developing their talent. The top two D from Manchester last year probably won't become top 6 NHLers but they were unbelievably good for them. Having players like that in HFD, a legit AHL top center, and goalie will go a long way in conditioning prospects to fit in seamlessly.

It's great fan service too, I know a lot of us watched some really crappy hockey down in HFD last year, and I'd like to see that changed.

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06-17-2014, 09:29 PM
  #622
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Newbury would be a great pickup. I think of him as the AHL Mark Messier from the way he plays and what he brings to a team. I'd like to watch HFD become a winning environment. It really helps with developing kids too by getting them used to winning. The Monarchs haven't won championships but they field competitive teams, I think it goes a long way in developing their talent. The top two D from Manchester last year probably won't become top 6 NHLers but they were unbelievably good for them. Having players like that in HFD, a legit AHL top center, and goalie will go a long way in conditioning prospects to fit in seamlessly.

It's great fan service too, I know a lot of us watched some really crappy hockey down in HFD last year, and I'd like to see that changed.
I certainly would be in favor of bringing Newbury back for that purpose, but to be fair, the crappy hockey had a lot more to do with how long it took them to bring in DGM and LeNeveu after Talbot got promoted.

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06-17-2014, 10:19 PM
  #623
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I don't know if you guys care, but the AHL has agreed to a framework for moving a whole bunch of teams West, possibly by 2015. The feeling seems to be that Manchester is definitely gone. Possibly Worcester, Adirondack, and Utica as well. Those 4 teams are owned by their NHL parent. We're likely to see 6 or 7 new Western teams. Of course, affiliations move location all the time, so any one of those buildings could be occupied by a relocated Eastern affiliate afterwards. Major shakeup coming in the AHL.

I'm just happy, because it means Charlotte will likely be in the Eastern Conference and I'll get to see the Rangers affiliate, wherever it happens to be by then.

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06-18-2014, 02:34 AM
  #624
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I certainly would be in favor of bringing Newbury back for that purpose, but to be fair, the crappy hockey had a lot more to do with how long it took them to bring in DGM and LeNeveu after Talbot got promoted.

The inability to score for multiple games in a row and rarely be able to sustain offense is in large part due to Noob's absence. He was key to the team.

They should bring back Noob and someone like Brandon Segal and Shayne Wiebe.

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06-18-2014, 07:51 AM
  #625
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The inability to score for multiple games in a row and rarely be able to sustain offense is in large part due to Noob's absence. He was key to the team.

They should bring back Noob and someone like Brandon Segal and Shayne Wiebe.
To add to that-to get behind two or three goals early while your goaltender chalks up only 4 or 5 saves--your team has no momentum at all--it's easier for the other team to defend. Extremely hard to get back into games when you can't trust your goaltending. And if it's a game to game thing--your team's confidence that they actually can win on any given night is going to go right down the toilet. It's completely inexplicable to me why the Rangers waited so long to bring in a competent goaltender. The last couple months of the season the Wolfpack with Grumet-Morris and LeNeveu became a very good AHL team.

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