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"Blame the refs" vs. "Blame the team"...which camp are you in?

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Old
06-15-2014, 01:02 PM
  #51
HatTrick Swayze
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Originally Posted by haveandare View Post
Also, maybe I'm alone on this, but I blame AV to an extent. That defensive shell strategy was mind numbingly stupid. Do whatever you have to to win, but that strategy wasn't helping them win at all. It led to the kings absolutely dominating them, and Hank trying to stop them all by himself. Mark my words, that strategy will never, ever work against a serious offense in a 7 game series.
I definitely understand feeling this way, and agree to an extent. I will counter with the fact that AV did the exact same thing in the Philly/Pitt Game 7s and absolutely surgical execution won those games.

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06-15-2014, 01:17 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by HatTrick Swayze View Post
I definitely understand feeling this way, and agree to an extent. I will counter with the fact that AV did the exact same thing in the Philly/Pitt Game 7s and absolutely surgical execution won those games.
Sure. But neither of those teams had the offense the Kings did, and neither of those teams routinely outshot the rangers 3 and 4 to 1 while they used that strategy.

It's not the strategy that bothered me, it's the fact that there was no plan B at all for if/when they hit a team who would play against that strategy well.

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06-15-2014, 01:18 PM
  #53
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How about conditioning? They lost 3 games in OT after getting off to good starts in every one.

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06-15-2014, 01:34 PM
  #54
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It's real simple, as long as fans tolerate bad calls and lousy officiating, this is what you get. As soon as the game was tied in game 2, I turned it off never to watch again until next season. And the fact I don't give this team or league any of my money (at least not directly) helped soften the pain of losing. That's how I dealt with it


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06-15-2014, 01:40 PM
  #55
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Combination... bad calls against both teams. Kings capitalized and a bad call leads to a goal it's much worse

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06-15-2014, 01:42 PM
  #56
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I blame the obscene amount of commercials during each game.

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06-15-2014, 04:06 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yrrebbor View Post
The refs made bad calls, but the Rangers blew A LOT of opportunities and leads.
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Originally Posted by RangerBlues View Post
Rangers could not finish. Simple as that.
^^ This. Pissed off that the refs changed the course of multiple games, but the Rangers could have made it a non-story by scoring on breakaways, rebounds, wide-open nets, etc.

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06-15-2014, 04:59 PM
  #58
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I blame the refs for putting game two into overtime but I blame the Rangers for losing all three overtime games. I blame the team for a lifeless effort in game 3. A game AV called a "must win." I blame AV for not preparing his players for a "must win." I blame Rick Nash for being a bum all four series.

The refs don't screw us in game 2, it's a 3-2 series. We actually win a game in overtime, it could have been 3-2 in our favor but what's past is past. It's useless to blame anyone outside of the context of how can we make this team better?

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06-15-2014, 07:06 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by SnowblindNYR View Post
An underdog team can beat a better team in a 7 game series. Pro sports, especially hockey where so much depends on luck and a goalie is not like a math problem. It's not as simple as LA>NYR. I don't think they were gifted the series, I think LA probably takes the series in 7 not 5, if not for incompetent reffing. That said, due to luck and Lundqvist going into superhuman mode at times, no one knows how it would have ended. The Kings should have lost games 2 and 5, but the refs made sure they didn't. So unless the Kings changed their intensity or something in game 4, we'd likely be up 3-2. At that point, while I still think LA would win the series, a Lundqvist masterpiece along with a fluky bounce or two could mean that we're parading the cup despite not being as good as LA. Or are you one of the people that doesn't believe that the better team ever loses? That's simplistic thinking.
The refs gave the Rangers two power plays in overtime during game five. If the Rangers had scored on one of them, we'd be talking about how much game 6 tickets were going for, not chewing over "who" is to blame.

And yes, better teams tend to win when your best player is the goaltender. In the end a team has to score to win--the goalie can only keep you in the game until someone puts the puck in the other guy's net.

I'm not saying the Rangers could not have won because the Kings were a better team (and they were), just that everything has to go right and even then, you have to make something out of nothing and put the puck in the net when you have the opportunity. The boys tried, but....when two teams play for a championship, one of them is going to lose--even in horseshoes.

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06-15-2014, 07:08 PM
  #60
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Both. Can't keep blowing 2 goal leads and expect to get away with it though.

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06-15-2014, 07:09 PM
  #61
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No lie, but I had a dream that I would read these exact posts like 3 months ago. But after that I had another dream like 5 days later that we'd win the cup again Saint Louis in 6 games.

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06-15-2014, 07:11 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by SnowblindNYR View Post
That may be true when you're playing Vancouver circa 94, not when you're playing one of the top 2 winners in recent memory in the Kings. I'm sorry I disagree. It's so easy to say that, but reality is when you're the underdog and playing a great team manufactured adversity by the refs will **** you up. Teams in general are too close, but when one is better than the other, that's enough of an edge. 3 gift goals in 5 games is way too much to give a team like the Kings in a series that featured 3 OT games and 5 OT periods.
I like your posts - you are passionate, insanely behind the team, and have good hockey knowledge. But blaming things and making excuses is a mentality that basically all successful people agree is a failure mindset. Read a couple of hundred books on the most successful people and these people simply do not do it. One after another after another you'll see this:

"I was always taught not to make excuses." -Derek Jeter ... "Ninety-nine percent of the failures come from people who have the habit of making excuses." -George Washington Carver ... "He that is good at making excuses is seldom good for anything else." -Benjamin Franklin ... "No excuses and no sob stories. Life is full of excuses if you're looking. I have no time to gripe over misfortune." -Junior Seau ... "Never make excuses." -John Wooden ... "Do not make excuses, whether it's your fault or not." -George S. Patton ... "I do not believe in excuses." -J. C. Penney

I can post dozens more, but that would be silly. Basically, I grew up impoverished in the South Bronx, a disaster childhood. My younger brother is dead, my older brother in prison for life. I refused to accept that path. I have spent my life studying what it takes to persevere and succeed - a library of over 2,000 books - and the most successful people do not make excuses, they focus on results. If they do not get the desired result, they take ownership for it, and seek to learn from it and find a better path. You can disagree with that, and that is perfectly okay. And nothing I am saying is meant to be personal or in any bad spirit. I am simply relaying what I have seen repeated over and over by highly successful people. Be well

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06-15-2014, 07:13 PM
  #63
Tawnos
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HatTrick Swayze View Post
I definitely understand feeling this way, and agree to an extent. I will counter with the fact that AV did the exact same thing in the Philly/Pitt Game 7s and absolutely surgical execution won those games.
And Montreal Game 6. And nearly every other game in the playoffs where the Rangers took a lead into the 3rd.

I do have an issue with AV not recognizing after games 1 and 2 that the strategy was no longer working, but to quote The West Wing... "some people will tell you that the hardest thing to do in sports is hit a baseball. But I once had a coach tell me that the hardest thing to do in sports is to go into the locker room at half time of the Super Bowl and throw out the strategy that got you there in the first place." (phrasing might be slightly different, but you get the point)

I can forgive him for it.

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06-15-2014, 07:13 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SnowblindNYR;86495255[B
]That may be true when you're playing Vancouver circa 94,[/B] not when you're playing one of the top 2 winners in recent memory in the Kings. I'm sorry I disagree. It's so easy to say that, but reality is when you're the underdog and playing a great team manufactured adversity by the refs will **** you up. Teams in general are too close, but when one is better than the other, that's enough of an edge. 3 gift goals in 5 games is way too much to give a team like the Kings in a series that featured 3 OT games and 5 OT periods.
Or maybe Richter was talking about overcoming the perception of a 54 year "curse" where regardless of how good the Rangers were, something always came up.

Imagine if the internet was widely used in 1994--think about how it felt after games 4 and 5 against the Devils and then after game 6 in the Finals. Nothing was guaranteed then. A team could break the record for most wins in a season and still end up getting swept in the first round.

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06-15-2014, 07:15 PM
  #65
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This is really embarrassing and needs to stop. I have not posted on here in many months, but felt the need to say how stupid this post is. We got beat by a better team plain and simple. Could we have won this series? For sure we could have....we lost 3 OT games.

We got 2 Powerplays in overtime's of game 5, I don't see how anyone can complain about the refs, I really don't.

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06-15-2014, 07:17 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by SauceCheese91 View Post
This is really embarrassing and needs to stop. I have not posted on here in many months, but felt the need to say how stupid this post is. We got beat by a better team plain and simple. Could we have won this series? For sure we could have....we lost 3 OT games.

We got 2 Powerplays in overtime's of game 5, I don't see how anyone can complain about the refs, I really don't.
There is a difference between complaining about the refs and blaming them for the loss. The refs deserve all the criticism they've gotten.

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06-15-2014, 07:24 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
There is a difference between complaining about the refs and blaming them for the loss. The refs deserve all the criticism they've gotten.
Completely disagree, I thought the officiating was fair, and the fact that so many people on here are complaining about it makes me wonder if people even watched the games. Officials make mistakes, always, but we also got some fortunate calls that people will choose to "forget". The bottom line is we didn't capitalize on our opportunities and we lost to a better team.

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06-15-2014, 07:32 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by SauceCheese91 View Post
Completely disagree, I thought the officiating was fair, and the fact that so many people on here are complaining about it makes me wonder if people even watched the games. Officials make mistakes, always, but we also got some fortunate calls that people will choose to "forget". The bottom line is we didn't capitalize on our opportunities and we lost to a better team.
No dispute on the Rangers missing opportunities.

But show me one blatantly blown call in favor of the Rangers in the series. I'm not talking about a missed call, like Kreider's glove in Doughty's face or the missed stick in M.Richards' face. I'm talking about decisions made by officials that were simply wrong. The closest you can come are dives on plays that would have been penalties embellishment or not. This isn't an exercise in equal treatment. Saying that the Rangers got fortunate calls, true or not, doesn't make the officials responsibility for those blown calls any less.

I'm not saying that the Rangers were the victims of biased refereeing. I'm not saying that they were made incapable of winning these games by the refereeing. I am saying that the referees deserve the criticism they're getting.

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06-15-2014, 07:33 PM
  #69
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It's very frustrating to watch such obvious bad calss and non-calls when it goes against your team.

Truth be told we had our share of breaks throughout the playoffs. We had chances to win even after the reffing blunders we hits posts, shot high/wide/deflected etc.

I'm happy with our team in as much as they did not lay down. They wanted it and we didn't get swept.

That said, I can't help but think we are heading back to MSG Monday if it wasn't for that call on Zucc. And it's infuriating because it is blatant miss call. And it rewards the guy diving by making the penalty against the guy who clearly went out of his way NOT to embellish. What kind of message does that send?

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06-15-2014, 07:39 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by SauceCheese91 View Post
Completely disagree, I thought the officiating was fair, and the fact that so many people on here are complaining about it makes me wonder if people even watched the games. Officials make mistakes, always, but we also got some fortunate calls that people will choose to "forget". The bottom line is we didn't capitalize on our opportunities and we lost to a better team.
Of course "we" don't watch the games-- "we" just come here and post. Give me a break. Everyone here is allowed their opinion. Want to argue about it? No problem. But don't suggest that posters here don't watch as closely as you do or that your opinion is more valid than theirs.

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06-15-2014, 08:11 PM
  #71
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Originally Posted by SauceCheese91 View Post
This is really embarrassing and needs to stop. I have not posted on here in many months, but felt the need to say how stupid this post is. We got beat by a better team plain and simple. Could we have won this series? For sure we could have....we lost 3 OT games.

We got 2 Powerplays in overtime's of game 5, I don't see how anyone can complain about the refs, I really don't.
I'm certainly in your camp. I'd say this whole thread is an embarrassing soup of whining. Classless.

Did someone actually say there would have been a game 6 if it wasn't for that Zucc penalty?

I'm glad it's possible to "delete" the thread on my screen. Done.

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06-15-2014, 08:20 PM
  #72
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I like to misquote people and act like a self-righteous *****.

Now I shall delete and disappear for I am superior to all!! bwa ha ha!

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06-15-2014, 08:34 PM
  #73
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We were lucky to get this far and managed to get the Kings to OT 3 times in LA. This team performed better than everyone expected.

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06-15-2014, 09:27 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by ReggieDunlop68 View Post
The best team may lose a shift.

The best team may lose a string of games in the regular season

The best team may get behind during a playoff round

but the best team wins, and that is why the Stanley Cup is so great

What burns me is not the bounces. What burns me is that the team was built in such a manner that they needed the goaltender to play as if he weren't human and the unfortunate loss of St. Louis' mother to spark the brotherhood just to almost get swept in the finals.

I can't recall every single non call, post, missed shot, etc. from every team from opening day until the cup is handed to the victor, but from what my neurons do recall over the years is that the sum total of a franchise's success over a decade or more is not a simple crapshoot.
I completely disagree. 4 rounds of 7 games means most likely a great or at least very good team wins. But once you have one series it's based a lot on luck. Seriously we get the calls and 1 lucky win and we have the cup. A ****** team isn't winning the cup, but to say that 100% of the time the best team wins is foolish and simplistic. Are you telling me that LA is 100% better than Chicago when they won that series on a fluke goal? It's silly, winning 4 of 7 games doesn't automatically make you the best team. Goaltending is very important, so is luck, and so is reffing.

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06-15-2014, 09:32 PM
  #75
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Originally Posted by HatTrick Swayze View Post
I definitely understand feeling this way, and agree to an extent. I will counter with the fact that AV did the exact same thing in the Philly/Pitt Game 7s and absolutely surgical execution won those games.
I understand Montreal was tired and not the Kings, but the strategy in game 6 against Montreal was to put it deep and just dominate the puck. Against the Kings AV coached scared.

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