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2014 NHL Draft - Philadelphia - Rounds 2-7 9:00 AM NHLN

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Old
06-15-2014, 11:08 PM
  #401
maplepred
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Originally Posted by Gnashville View Post
The only way they acquire Spezza is a sign and trade deal. No way you give up anything just to watch him walk next year.
Oh I completely agree with that, the first paragraph of my post above states that as well.

My point is we do have the assets to get spezza without creating a major hole in the lineup.

But it definitely has to be a sign and trade, otherwise not interested.

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06-16-2014, 03:35 AM
  #402
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Originally Posted by maplepred View Post
Oh I completely agree with that, the first paragraph of my post above states that as well.

My point is we do have the assets to get spezza without creating a major hole in the lineup.

But it definitely has to be a sign and trade, otherwise not interested.
A sign and trade usually requires the player to be signed before being traded, in which case spezza commands a much higher price than wilson/elllis+1st. That's the issue. Trading for Spezza and hoping he resigns is not a smart plan for the team right now. The team isn't one spezza away from competing for a cup so it doesn't make sense to gamble on him at this point.

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06-16-2014, 10:04 PM
  #403
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Originally Posted by GeauxPreds View Post
A sign and trade usually requires the player to be signed before being traded, in which case spezza commands a much higher price than wilson/elllis+1st. That's the issue. Trading for Spezza and hoping he resigns is not a smart plan for the team right now. The team isn't one spezza away from competing for a cup so it doesn't make sense to gamble on him at this point.
What do you think a signed spezza gets?

More than Wilson, Ellis and 11th overall? Maybe add in someone like aberg? Watson?

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06-16-2014, 11:43 PM
  #404
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For spezza signed long term Ottawa is probably asking for Josi or Jones. I'm sure teams would step up and beat a 3rd line center, a 2nd pairing defenseman and a 1st for a signed spezza.

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06-17-2014, 02:14 AM
  #405
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Originally Posted by GeauxPreds View Post
For spezza signed long term Ottawa is probably asking for Josi or Jones. I'm sure teams would step up and beat a 3rd line center, a 2nd pairing defenseman and a 1st for a signed spezza.
True, and I'm not arguing that fact, but I mean stranger things have happened. Keep in mind spezza has asked for a trade so that leaves ottawa's hands a little tied rather than just shopping him, they 'have' to trade him.

He has also had a bit of an injury bug the last few years, although he seemed to be pretty solid last season.

And for the proposal I made for a signed spezza, I also said we would include aberg or Watson.

I think Colin Wilson, Ryan Ellis, aberg, and 11th overall would land a spezza who has asked to be traded anyways. Ottawa said they want a good prospect, roster player and a pick, and that's all that but even more.

I guess we will have to wait and see what happens. But I'm hoping poile finally makes some bold moves this offseason, but I'm also planning for plan b which usually happens anyways and we do nothing, or we sign fourth line guys to multi million dollar deals...

If we do not trade for spezza than who else will we get for our laviolette offense next season??
There is slim chance we sign free top free agents who may be available. And other players on block are from western conference so kesler, marleau, Thornton etc probably will be moved to the east. Just my two cents...

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06-17-2014, 05:31 AM
  #406
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maplepred View Post
True, and I'm not arguing that fact, but I mean stranger things have happened. Keep in mind spezza has asked for a trade so that leaves ottawa's hands a little tied rather than just shopping him, they 'have' to trade him.

He has also had a bit of an injury bug the last few years, although he seemed to be pretty solid last season.

And for the proposal I made for a signed spezza, I also said we would include aberg or Watson.

I think Colin Wilson, Ryan Ellis, aberg, and 11th overall would land a spezza who has asked to be traded anyways. Ottawa said they want a good prospect, roster player and a pick, and that's all that but even more.

I guess we will have to wait and see what happens. But I'm hoping poile finally makes some bold moves this offseason, but I'm also planning for plan b which usually happens anyways and we do nothing, or we sign fourth line guys to multi million dollar deals...

If we do not trade for spezza than who else will we get for our laviolette offense next season??
There is slim chance we sign free top free agents who may be available. And other players on block are from western conference so kesler, marleau, Thornton etc probably will be moved to the east. Just my two cents...
Much rather have Stastny if he goes to FA.

That way we keep our assets, get a new shiny toy in the draft and we get our center to play with smith.


Last edited by iKiwi: 06-17-2014 at 05:33 AM. Reason: added some stuff
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06-17-2014, 09:59 AM
  #407
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I agree you get Stastny. If not go hard after Vanek. Fail on that get two of Raymond, Vrbata, Pouliot, Moulson.


Last edited by PFL615: 06-17-2014 at 10:01 AM. Reason: phone issues
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06-17-2014, 11:45 AM
  #408
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I agree, keep assets and sign stastny to multi year deal, or moulson, vanek, whoever. But how many times has a top flighty free signed in Nashville?
I would love the idea but I think a trade may have to happen because that guarantees us a top forward, and say we got spezza or whoever in trade at draft, well then come free agency we may look more attractive to other higher profile free agents because we have spezza or whoever for them to play with.

Currently we do not even have a sixty point forward, I know that may change with laviolette system, but it's still fact as of now.


Also,
https://twitter.com/JoshuaCooper/sta...25503051862016
This supports my idea as well.

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06-17-2014, 12:58 PM
  #409
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Poile said a team has approached him about trading the first and he has approached another team about trading them the first.

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06-17-2014, 04:24 PM
  #410
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smilodon View Post
Poile said a team has approached him about trading the first and he has approached another team about trading them the first.
Saw that as well. Personally, I prefer to keep the pick unless we are trading for a young high end but unproven prospect. I don't believe we will get an elite, established player in his prime in a trade, short of including a player we don't want to give up and it isn't worth it to sacrifice for an aging veteran given our team make up. I'm afraid Poile will be tempted to try the quick fix solutions to his problems- I prefer the slow fix. Done correctly, this team's window can be 2-4 years from now and can include a high end forward from this draft.

I hope he also is exploring moving up by using the 11th and other assets.

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06-17-2014, 07:59 PM
  #411
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I would rather have a proven top 3-6 NHL forward in his late twenties or thirty-ish that can provide offense as long as weber and rinne are around which would end up being out window in a couple years because it's not everyday you get a rinne or weber.

Or we could just make the pick and end up with possibly a Scottie upshall?
There is no guarantee on a guy at eleventh to be a top six forward ever, let alone be a steady NHL player.

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06-17-2014, 08:04 PM
  #412
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Looking at the last two guys Poile traded firsts for, I'd like to take our chances on the draftee.

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06-17-2014, 08:39 PM
  #413
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Poile also has never drafted an offensive top six forward in the first since being our gm.

Not including radulov who took off anyways.

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06-17-2014, 08:44 PM
  #414
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I think it's going to be harder to get a legit top 6 forward using the 11th as the centerpiece than some folks are thinking.

11th++ might get it done, but I really don't see a whole lot of targets out there on the trade block that we could craft a realistic trade for.

It wouldn't be the worst thing in the world to add a Fiala, Perlini, Kapanen, or Virtanen to the farm. Throw enough forwards against the wall and something will stick.

I'd actually like us to craft a package and move up 4-5 spots to land a Nylander or Ehlers type guy.

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06-17-2014, 10:33 PM
  #415
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Originally Posted by RaiderDoug View Post
I think it's going to be harder to get a legit top 6 forward using the 11th as the centerpiece than some folks are thinking.

11th++ might get it done, but I really don't see a whole lot of targets out there on the trade block that we could craft a realistic trade for.

It wouldn't be the worst thing in the world to add a Fiala, Perlini, Kapanen, or Virtanen to the farm. Throw enough forwards against the wall and something will stick.

I'd actually like us to craft a package and move up 4-5 spots to land a Nylander or Ehlers type guy.
Agreed, a package to move up into the 7th or 8th spot would be better, only problem is how long will it take to get that pick into the NHL. Wouldn't mind going for Virtanen, a little bit different player then we a re used to drafting.I could see him being in the NHL, and playing well, after another year in juniors

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06-18-2014, 05:42 AM
  #416
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Two new videos of Poile on the preds website, for those who don't want to watch all 34 minutes or so of it here are the highlights in regards to the draft.


Admits predators are targeting a forward and that there is pressure on him to draft a forward, though he believes you have to take BPA so we might end up drafting a defenseman. (Hopefully he is just saying that in case something absurd like ekbald falling to 11 happens, though it may mean he's open to taking fleury at 11 if he believes him to be clear and away the best pick there.

Mentioned there is a very small chance the predators trade up, and a slightly larger chance that they trade back some depending on who's available. Probably teams that would consider moving up to 11 for Fleury if he's there. Mentioned that there was activity from other GM's propositioning trading both our seconds this year for a late first depending on who's available and called it the most likely of the three options.

Mentioned the possibility of trading 11 for a top 6 forward, but said he didn't really expect it to happen.

Little bit of a change in terms of drafting for a new coach, but suggested the predators template is "out there"

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06-18-2014, 08:10 AM
  #417
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Originally Posted by GeauxPreds View Post
Mentioned that there was activity from other GM's propositioning trading both our seconds this year for a late first depending on who's available and called it the most likely of the three options.
Thanks for posting the recap.

I like this idea the best.

Someone like a Tuch, Fabbri, Milano, Barbashev, etc will drop into the mid 20s. It happens every year.

Coming out of the draft with 2 high end forwards from the first 2 rounds can likely help this team quite a bit in the next few years.

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06-18-2014, 08:37 AM
  #418
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Originally Posted by dougie1107 View Post
Looking at the last two guys Poile traded firsts for, I'd like to take our chances on the draftee.
Poile has never traded our first at the draft, always at the deadline. There is a different market at the draft, and I suspect Poile could get a better deal.

I think he will move it if someone offers him a decent player. poile needs us to be competitive next year and someone picked @11 is a minimum of 3 years from even cracking the lineup most likely

Quote:
Originally Posted by maplepred View Post
Poile also has never drafted an offensive top six forward in the first since being our gm.

Not including radulov who took off anyways.
Scott Hartnell says hi... (and i wont even go there with Legwand... we had enough of those threads)

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06-18-2014, 09:15 AM
  #419
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Never drafted a top six forward... Uh, what would you call Scott Hartnell, then?

EDIT: Thanks, Volde.

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06-18-2014, 10:10 AM
  #420
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yeah but Poile was drafting for Trotz. The whole idea of what the Preds are changes with the coaching change.

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06-18-2014, 10:51 AM
  #421
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Hornqvist is a top 6 forward on most teams in the NHL.

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06-18-2014, 01:33 PM
  #422
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Originally Posted by triggrman View Post
Hornqvist is a top 6 forward on most teams in the NHL.
Technically the complaint was about the first round. This suggests that the actual accusation was less about ability and performance and more about hype.

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06-18-2014, 01:58 PM
  #423
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Technically the complaint was about the first round. This suggests that the actual accusation was less about ability and performance and more about hype.
Ahh, thanks for the clarification.

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06-18-2014, 09:59 PM
  #424
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Guess I mean more of a top 3 forward, which is what I would hope he would be trading for, we need a top 3 guy whether it costs us a trade or signing.

I think it will all come down to who is available at 11 based on what poile wants/wanted and what other teams want and are willing to trade for the pick.

Poile has struck out a lot more in the first round then he has done well,

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06-18-2014, 10:51 PM
  #425
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maplepred View Post

Poile has struck out a lot more in the first round then he has done well,
Simply not true. I'm unhappy with Poile but look at the record:
1. Legwand- no player picked after him in the top 10 had more goals/points in nhl.
2. Finley-bust
3. Hartnell- no player in the next 20 picks with more goals/points
4. Hamhuis- more games than any other player drafted after him. More points than any d-man in the 1st round
5. Upshall- Lupul went right after him and Semin 7 spots later but at the time it was only a question of Upshall or Lupul by every account and Upshall was generally considered safer and Lupul more boom/bust. Hardly a strike out by Poile.
6. Suter- Hall of Fame. end of story.
7. Rads- strike out? Certainly not on talent. We can argue the head case angle I guess.
8. Parent- strike out. Oshie still on the board. Could you predict the blown back though?
9. Blum-strike out. Perron still on the board.
10 Wilson/Pickard. Wilson is incomplete and Pickard a strike out. I'll give you this one.

At worst, he is even at 5-5. No coincidence that the strike outs are later in the round when the talent is thinner. If anything he has been excellent in the top 10-12, which this pick is.

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