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When healthy and motivated, Forsberg head/shoulders above anyone else in the league

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Old
02-14-2004, 05:26 PM
  #1
Matts
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When healthy and motivated, Forsberg head/shoulders above anyone else in the league

It's hard to get a like for the man because his father is such a tool and Forsberg is prone to fits of diving and those Lidstrom-Naslund-esque empty "want to play in Sweden" threats but I was watching the game from Detroit today and the guy is just a remarkable player.

He sort of reminds me of what Lindros was like at his best but Forsberg is probably the best playmaker since Lemieux and if he'd played in the era of Gretzky and Mario, he would be comparable at the very least. Hard to say what kind of a goalscorer he is because he really doesn't seem all that interested in scoring.

Anyway watching that game today and he was playing against one of the best teams in the league and he just about dominated.

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02-14-2004, 06:03 PM
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Mizral
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You're right. When healthy, Forsberg I put up there in terms of talent as high as the bets whom have ever played. He will have have as an illustrious career as Gretzky or Lemieux due to the way the game has changed over the years, but the man right now is the Wayne Greztky of hockey today.

The only reason his profile isn't even higher is due to his injuries over the years.

When all is said and done, I think he'll be thought of as something like Mario Lemieux. He's that good.

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02-14-2004, 07:27 PM
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and this is in the Edmonton boards because???

u might want to try the National Hockey League Board

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02-14-2004, 09:16 PM
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Mr Sakich
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Originally Posted by streetballer03
and this is in the Edmonton boards because???

u might want to try the National Hockey League Board
well that is easy to fix, Matts, could you add a Salo sucks to your post to legitimize it. Mizral, maybe can you add something like " Smith is the best oiler dman and is worth at least the playing rights to Pokey Reddick in a trade"

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02-14-2004, 10:15 PM
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Matts
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Yeah

or I could talk about someone's father.

That's right, I know your old username.

More likely I'll say you'll see Forsberg eat Salo and the Oilers on Wed because he always plays great in Col vs Edm.I guess that makes it Oilers relevant


Last edited by Matts: 02-14-2004 at 10:17 PM. Reason: conte
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02-14-2004, 10:43 PM
  #6
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be my guest

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02-14-2004, 10:56 PM
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Well, since Forsberg beats us like a rented mule every time he plays us, it's somewhat surprising there aren't more threads about him. There was a time when Modano was the one player I hated to see crossing the Oiler blueline, now Forsberg is the one.

Plays at a higher level than anyone in the game, unless Jagr wants to.

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02-14-2004, 11:01 PM
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Talking about the Colorado Avalanche and Peter Forsberg isn't exactly off-topic when discussing the Edmonton Oilers. After all, they are in the same division that we are and we play them pretty soon. I think it's perfectly fine to discuss Foppa. Though he does indeed dive, he is still the most complete package in the league at the moment.

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Old
02-15-2004, 02:38 AM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matts
...
He sort of reminds me of what Lindros was like at his best but Forsberg is probably the best playmaker since Lemieux and if he'd played in the era of Gretzky and Mario, he would be comparable at the very least.
...
Ya, I think so too. And the Lindros comparison is interesting. I think that Forsberg is a much better powerplay contributor that Big E, but they are probably the two best all-around 5on5 players in the last couple decades. Maybe Messier in his prime too.

Mario and Gretzky, even Jagr and Bure for a while there ... they were just so good offensively that the goals-against were easily forgotten.

You know, I can appreciate that guys like Forsberg and Federov and Modano (when healthy and motivated, enigmatic beggars the lot of them) are very complete players, that they don't just play to score, they play to outscore. But wasn't it a lot more fun to watch the games when the star players were just sent out on the ice to trade chances?

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02-15-2004, 03:48 AM
  #10
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What's really pathetic is how everyone backs off the guy. When he gets hit he's completely neutralized, and if ya slash and poke him enough times, he gets really stupid. Plus, how pathetic is it to cheer for that guy if you're a REAL hockey fan??? I await Avs-fans flaming, in fact, I WANT IT.

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Old
02-15-2004, 07:25 AM
  #11
Bohologo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mizral
the man right now is the Wayne Greztky of hockey today.

he'll be thought of as something like Mario Lemieux
This is the sort of silly revisionist thinking that denigrates what Gretzky and Lemieux accomplished, and is typically foisted by people who: a) never saw Gretzky or Mario play during their prime, b) were cross-eyed with rage that Gretzky/Mario didn't play for their team and decided to be Gretzky/Mario Haters, c) the sort of people who can't imagine that things in the past were superior to something today, and say that Oasis are as good as the Beatles, d) are just here to bait rational types, and e) forget that Mario came back in his late 30s and put up similar points-per-game averages, which certainly undermines the knee-jerk Yeah But The Game Has Changed bleating responses. The game has changed, but not that much. Forsberg is fantastic, but is no Gretzky, let alone another Mario.

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02-15-2004, 08:44 AM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bohologo
The game has changed, but not that much. Forsberg is fantastic, but is no Gretzky, let alone another Mario.
The most dominant player I've seen was Orr. After that, despite my undying love for Mark Messier's game, no one I've seen could do what Mario did. Completely dominant.

Gretzky? He was much different from any of them really. I remember watching him from high up an Northlands and he was amazing at placing the puck exactly where his linemate was going to be. He also scored a ton of goals just by changing his position on the ice just before shooting (I often wonder why more players don't do that, move the goalie and his angle just before shooting).

Anyway, my dad once said the difference between 99 and everyone else is that Gretzky played on the downbeat. That's about the best description I've heard.

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02-15-2004, 10:57 AM
  #13
Mizral
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bohologo
This is the sort of silly revisionist thinking that denigrates what Gretzky and Lemieux accomplished, and is typically foisted by people who: a) never saw Gretzky or Mario play during their prime, b) were cross-eyed with rage that Gretzky/Mario didn't play for their team and decided to be Gretzky/Mario Haters, c) the sort of people who can't imagine that things in the past were superior to something today, and say that Oasis are as good as the Beatles, d) are just here to bait rational types, and e) forget that Mario came back in his late 30s and put up similar points-per-game averages, which certainly undermines the knee-jerk Yeah But The Game Has Changed bleating responses. The game has changed, but not that much. Forsberg is fantastic, but is no Gretzky, let alone another Mario.
A) I saw Gretzky and Mario in their primes many times. Live sometimes too.

B) Never bothered me that Greztky and Mario were on other teams. In fact, when I was very young, Gretzky was my favorite player, and the Oilers were my favorite team (yes, like many young tots, I was a bandwagoner).

C) Perhaps this is me. I don't believe any one generation from the past is better than the generation of the future simply because they are older. I've said it a few times before, but I feel if Forsberg was brought back in time to the 80's, he'd be putting up 200 point situations (with some good linemates at least).

D) Funny how you look at me that way, Bohologo, I've always looked at you that way too.

E) Mario did put up nice point totals, but had become a peremitre player, and his goal totals were anything but eye popping. Had he scored more goals, Mario's comeback would have impressed me more. Mario was a fine player when he came back, but not the same Mario of the past. Not even close.

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02-15-2004, 11:54 AM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matts
or I could talk about someone's father.

That's right, I know your old username.

More likely I'll say you'll see Forsberg eat Salo and the Oilers on Wed because he always plays great in Col vs Edm.I guess that makes it Oilers relevant
Is there a way Lowe could capitulate the 2 points before it even comes to game time? I hope so........

If anything, after we get our a$$e$ handed to us by the powerful Preds, the team will probably be relaxed and loose by tuesday, knowing they are eliminated from the playoffs. Then..... Mr. Aebischer, watch out .

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Old
02-15-2004, 01:34 PM
  #15
Matts
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Yeah I never looked at ES points

but Forsberg frightens the life out of me on ES and yeah in the playoffs Modano would get the puck from Turco or Belfour and I would shiver. Now I do that as soon as Forsberg gains possession. I don't think I've ever seen anyone make the cross crease pass better. I remember Comrie once made one to Smyth in a gmae at Phx and I almost stood and applauded Say what you want about MC but we lost skill when we lost him.

Meanwhile Forsberg brings boatloads of skill and then he gets it in his head to run over people as well.

And for the record, I don't think its out of place to say Forsberg is up there with the big two. he's not the size of Leclair so he's small enough to fit in that era and he would've dominated for sure.

And for the record to close, Wayne most certainly the smartest I ever saw. Went to the puck before the puck was there and what a deft passer.

But most skilled I ever saw was Mario.

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Old
02-16-2004, 04:58 AM
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lowetide
Anyway, my dad once said the difference between 99 and everyone else is that Gretzky played on the downbeat. That's about the best description I've heard.
What does downbeat means? Sorry, Im swedish

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02-16-2004, 09:03 AM
  #17
Lowetide
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BF_Sweden
What does downbeat means? Sorry, Im swedish
lol, I was wondering if anyone would ask me about this one. Here's the dictionary definition of downbeat:

"the first beat in a measure (or "bar") of music."

When a conductor is leading an orchestra, the downbeat comes when his baton goes downward.

What I meant by the description is that Gretzky played counter to everyone else, his style of play was against what we might have expected or have to come know as predictable. He often found open spaces by going to areas about to be vacated by the opponent, instead of spots that were currently open.

In that way, he was unlike anyone I've ever seen. If Gretzky had been a drummer, he'd have been a jazz drummer.

Clear as mud, right?

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Old
02-16-2004, 12:28 PM
  #18
IceDragoon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lowetide
...Anyway, my dad once said the difference between 99 and everyone else is that Gretzky played on the downbeat. That's about the best description I've heard.
Your dad gave you an excellent analogy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lowetide
lol, I was wondering if anyone would ask me about this one. Here's the dictionary definition of downbeat:

"the first beat in a measure (or "bar") of music."

When a conductor is leading an orchestra, the downbeat comes when his baton goes downward.

What I meant by the description is that Gretzky played counter to everyone else, his style of play was against what we might have expected or have to come know as predictable. He often found open spaces by going to areas about to be vacated by the opponent, instead of spots that were currently open.

In that way, he was unlike anyone I've ever seen. If Gretzky had been a drummer, he'd have been a jazz drummer.
Quote:
Clear as mud, right?
On the contrary. You paint a beautifully clear picture. Now, whenever I hear someone say; "Gretzky thought a step ahead of everyone else."; I'll see your (and your dad's) words and smile.
Thanx LT.

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Old
02-16-2004, 05:29 PM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matts
It's hard to get a like for the man because his father is such a tool and Forsberg is prone to fits of diving and those Lidstrom-Naslund-esque empty "want to play in Sweden" threats but I was watching the game from Detroit today and the guy is just a remarkable player.

He sort of reminds me of what Lindros was like at his best but Forsberg is probably the best playmaker since Lemieux and if he'd played in the era of Gretzky and Mario, he would be comparable at the very least. Hard to say what kind of a goalscorer he is because he really doesn't seem all that interested in scoring.

Anyway watching that game today and he was playing against one of the best teams in the league and he just about dominated.

Totally agree, best player in the league. He creates so much out of nothing..

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