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Old
07-02-2014, 06:09 PM
  #176
gopreds19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarnberg View Post
Ah yes. Announce the need for a #1 center. Fail to land one in free agency. Announce a crap signing. Then say you're working on some other deals. Mention the kids can move up. Quietly back away for the offseason.

David Poile everyone.
This. A thousand times this.

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07-02-2014, 06:11 PM
  #177
Top 6 Spaling
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Originally Posted by Enoch View Post
T6S,

Do you think David Poile does a good job selling Nashville?

I don't. You should see what other GMs in the sports league do to get talent. Our GM can't even call a player or agent to convince them we are a good destination.

Nice.

Great man. Brilliant hockey mind. Passive. Doesn't have what it takes. That is David Poiles career thus far.
I don't think he does a great job selling it, no, but I also thinks it's a tough sell for many people in the hockey world. I think he does all right, all things considered. I also don't think it's entirely a GMs job to sell the team.

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Originally Posted by Preds33 View Post
Exactly. Poile should have tried to sell the team/city to these players, yet he probably did as he admitted to doing with Spezza, which was he didn't want to come here so I was done talking to him. You shouldn't be done until he has signed elsewhere if that is who you really want.
Do you honestly, deep down, believe Poile saying "Yeah, Nashville is great" is all that stood between Jason Spezza wanting to be traded here and not wanting to be traded here?

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07-02-2014, 06:11 PM
  #178
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Tweet from one of the NEWS2 reporters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cory Curtis @CoryCurtis2
UNBELIEVABLE stat about Preds forward Olli Jokinen. He's played 15 NHL seasons and been to the playoffs 1 time! 6 career playoff games.

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07-02-2014, 06:13 PM
  #179
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Originally Posted by Jarnberg View Post
Right. Again, another player who didn't want to play here. That is on Poile.
I just fundamentally disagree that it is somehow 100% on the GM to sell a city. I've never heard a player sign and say the #1 reason was that the GM did a great job selling it. I've heard money, family, competitiveness (this could, in a roundabout way, be attributed to Poile), friends play for that team, etc.

Why is no one mad at Craig Smith for not selling Stastny on the city? He's a friend of Stastny's, supposedly.

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07-02-2014, 06:16 PM
  #180
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Originally Posted by Top 6 Spaling View Post
Do you honestly, deep down, believe Poile saying "Yeah, Nashville is great" is all that stood between Jason Spezza wanting to be traded here and not wanting to be traded here?

No but at the same time, to just give up and admit defeat instead of try to figure out what may change the guy's mind. Especially when this is happening time and time again. If that was truly who he wanted for the team, he should have done more besides one offer and he's done. Who's to say that he will not change his mind? It may not work with Spezza, but the fact he has said the phone works both ways, come on.

Poile just settles for mediocrity.

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07-02-2014, 06:17 PM
  #181
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Top 6 Spaling View Post
I just fundamentally disagree that it is somehow 100% on the GM to sell a city. I've never heard a player sign and say the #1 reason was that the GM did a great job selling it. I've heard money, family, competitiveness (this could, in a roundabout way, be attributed to Poile), friends play for that team, etc.

Why is no one mad at Craig Smith for not selling Stastny on the city? He's a friend of Stastny's, supposedly.
It absolutely is his job.

Poile SHOULD be recruiting team members to help sell the team, but he has to engage them to help. Maybe he has. But you and I both know it is unlikely.

Put together a package of information, woo the wives, speak to them if they are hesitant, put your assistant GM on it if you are too busy, but giving up or not making calls is a cop out on his responsibilities as a GM.

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07-02-2014, 06:18 PM
  #182
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Originally Posted by Top 6 Spaling View Post
What moves are those, exactly? I don't want this to become the UFA thread all over again, but the top guys we not available for us to sign. Stastny went home, Vanek went home, and Moulson went back to his old team. We can't offer them the same thing. Poile almost had Spezza, but he wouldn't come here. He inquired on Kesler, who wouldn't come here. He brought in one of the best shooters in the NHL, addressing our biggest need. The off-season is far from over, with guys like Vrbata still in UFA.

Please, tell me what more he could have done. I am disappointed to, but it's not like Poile didn't try. He went out today and got us some secondary scoring at a low-to-no risk price. Awesome. It's not Stastny, but it's the best he could do.

What moves would you have made, in Poile's shoes?
I don't mind the Jokinen signing on its own (although I don't really follow the NHL outside of Nashville, so there could be obvious red flags and I wouldn't know). Sum total to date, not good enough. Ergo, complaints. Are there valid excuses? To an extent.

One that I do not hold as valid is players who won't waive their NTCs, because by Poile's admission, he makes no attempt to persuade them to change their mind because... why exactly? I mean, they're professionals and would have theoretically moved of their own accord. Not sure why they'd be any less on board than a guy like... oh, say, Neal, who had zero say in the move, and who I can't imagine is doing anything other than putting on a brave face right now.

The approach smacks of entitlement based upon... what, exactly? Can't say I consider that a good faith effort, whatever the reasoning may be.

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07-02-2014, 06:18 PM
  #183
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Originally Posted by Preds33 View Post
No but at the same time, to just give up and admit defeat instead of try to figure out what may change the guy's mind. Especially when this is happening time and time again. If that was truly who he wanted for the team, he should have done more besides one offer and he's done. Who's to say that he will not change his mind? It may not work with Spezza, but the fact he has said the phone works both ways, come on.

Poile just settles for mediocrity.
I think there is some truth to this. Poile does have a tendency to act a bit like a scorned lover after something goes wrong. I think that is a fair criticism. I also don't think Spezza would have changed his mind, and I think Poile didn't want to convince him enough to waive his NTC only to lose him in a year. If Spezza didn't want to get traded here, it's unlikely he wanted to be here long term, which means it would have been bad asset management. But I agree, he should have tried again IMO.

My point here is not that Poile is perfect, it's that he has done about as well as any reasonable person could expect him to do this off-season.

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07-02-2014, 06:20 PM
  #184
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Originally Posted by Enoch View Post
It absolutely is his job.

Poile SHOULD be recruiting team members to help sell the team, but he has to engage them to help. Maybe he has. But you and I both know it is unlikely.

Put together a package of information, woo the wives, speak to them if they are hesitant, put your assistant GM on it if you are too busy, but giving up or not making calls is a cop out on his responsibilities as a GM.
There is absolutely 0 proof that he did or did not do that. Neither of us can prove it. Personally, I think it is very likely he made a big pitch to Stastny. There was a talking period for him to do just that. We'll never know though.

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07-02-2014, 06:21 PM
  #185
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Originally Posted by Top 6 Spaling View Post
I think there is some truth to this. Poile does have a tendency to act a bit like a scorned lover after something goes wrong. I think that is a fair criticism. I also don't think Spezza would have changed his mind, and I think Poile didn't want to convince him enough to waive his NTC only to lose him in a year. If Spezza didn't want to get traded here, it's unlikely he wanted to be here long term, which means it would have been bad asset management. But I agree, he should have tried again IMO.

My point here is not that Poile is perfect, it's that he has done about as well as any reasonable person could expect him to do this off-season.

If he had been following up with these players and these deals, then yes I would agree with you, but the fact he did not follow up makes me have to disagree.

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07-02-2014, 06:22 PM
  #186
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It's not just about the city. Poile needs to sell the Predators organization as committed to winning. He needs to explain (have?) a plan to compete for the Cup in the near term. If he's unwilling to do that, what is there to recommend this situation? Desperation?

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07-02-2014, 06:22 PM
  #187
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Originally Posted by Enoch View Post
It absolutely is his job.

Poile SHOULD be recruiting team members to help sell the team, but he has to engage them to help. Maybe he has. But you and I both know it is unlikely.

Put together a package of information, woo the wives, speak to them if they are hesitant, put your assistant GM on it if you are too busy, but giving up or not making calls is a cop out on his responsibilities as a GM.
If you think a damn fruit basket and welcome Wagon are the only things that stand between us and signing FAs then I don't even know what to say.

Nashville is not some lost city that players have never been to or seen. They've played here or know people that have. It's not hard to find out about a city, and I don't think Poile kissing ass makes a bit of difference.

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07-02-2014, 06:23 PM
  #188
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Originally Posted by Top 6 Spaling View Post
There is absolutely 0 proof that he did or did not do that. Neither of us can prove it. Personally, I think it is very likely he made a big pitch to Stastny. There was a talking period for him to do just that. We'll never know though.
I agree, and frankly I do agree that PS was blues bound from the get go.

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07-02-2014, 06:23 PM
  #189
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Enoch View Post
It absolutely is his job.

Poile SHOULD be recruiting team members to help sell the team, but he has to engage them to help. Maybe he has. But you and I both know it is unlikely.

Put together a package of information, woo the wives, speak to them if they are hesitant, put your assistant GM on it if you are too busy, but giving up or not making calls is a cop out on his responsibilities as a GM.
come on, man. You cant do the full court press on every UFA out there... its a waste of time and resources. Yes, if there is a player who is seriously considering us, and you are in negotiations, then yeah, release the hounds and try to reinforce the fact that this is a good place to be(like we apparently did with Kariya). But if Poile calls Stastnys agent (or Vaneks, or Richards', or Moulson's) and he says, thanks, David but Paul(or whoever) isnt interested in nashville, what makes you think if he said "oh please let me talk to him I know I can sell him on us" that it would make any difference??

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07-02-2014, 06:24 PM
  #190
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And we're back to the usual rants based on at best partial information and in most cases complete ignorance by all of us on the boards ... more of a constant than Poile's perceived traits.

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07-02-2014, 06:24 PM
  #191
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Originally Posted by dknash View Post
It's not just about the city. Poile needs to sell the Predators organization as committed to winning. He needs to explain (have?) a plan to compete for the Cup in the near term. If he's unwilling to do that, what is there to recommend this situation? Desperation?
Again, I would argue neither of us have a clue. Poile could have a damn 800 page write up on our plan to compete and we would have no idea.

He just acquired one of the best shooters in the league at the biggest trade of the draft, does that count as "committed to winning"?

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07-02-2014, 06:35 PM
  #192
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Originally Posted by Top 6 Spaling View Post
Again, I would argue neither of us have a clue. Poile could have a damn 800 page write up on our plan to compete and we would have no idea.

He just acquired one of the best shooters in the league at the biggest trade of the draft, does that count as "committed to winning"?
Not spending to cap doesn't.

My point was that people are taking Spezza's NTC to be about location when it's just as likely to be about the team's spending, or the team's recent finishes, or perceptions of Trotz's system. Those are concerns that Poile should be able to address (unless we really are poor).

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07-02-2014, 06:42 PM
  #193
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Poile could have an excellent pitch, and you are right, none of us knows what it is.

That is not what I am arguing.

I am arguing :

1) it is his job to make that pitch

2) results ultimately matter despite the best efforts or lack thereof

T6S asked a question and I answered v82/101. Both sides of the debate are using hyperbole, but one thing that is unarguable are the results we have had thus far as an organization, especially recent off-season debacles.

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07-02-2014, 06:43 PM
  #194
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Originally Posted by dknash View Post
Not spending to cap doesn't.

My point was that people are taking Spezza's NTC to be about location when it's just as likely to be about the team's spending, or the team's recent finishes, or perceptions of Trotz's system. Those are concerns that Poile should be able to address (unless we really are poor).

This. If Poile was serious. When he is shot down from these players, he should ask them "Why?", if nothing else, at least ask them why. That will give him something to work to correct. Him saying that he's done with them if they don't want to be here means he's not doing his job to address the issue at hand. If it were just 1 or 2 players turning the team down it would be one thing, but it seems like (and this may be overblown here) at least 70% if not more of the league (particularly players with any skill) does not want to be here. Why is that?

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07-02-2014, 06:45 PM
  #195
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Well this got off track.

It looks like Cooper botched Poile's quote. Jokinen is penciled in at center but can play wing.

Neal - Wilson - Fisher
Stålberg - Jokinen - Smith
Forsberg - Järnkrok - Cullen
Nystrom - Gaustad - Bourque
Clune

Still no clue...

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07-02-2014, 06:47 PM
  #196
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Well this got off track.

It looks like Cooper botched Poile's quote. Jokinen is penciled in at center but can play wing.

Neal - Wilson - Fisher
Stålberg - Jokinen - Smith
Forsberg - Järnkrok - Cullen
Nystrom - Gaustad - Bourque
Clune

Still no clue...
Fisher's not going to the wing.

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07-02-2014, 06:53 PM
  #197
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Im kinda bummed...... It is apparent I am no longer the most negative person to visit this board..


However for those of you that are regurgitating lines out there if you think Olli and Fish are not going to be in the top 2 center positions your blinded by the light. This could change with more moves but right now those are the guys.

Also where are the pumpers that Lavy can turn a stump into a 50 point guy?????

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07-02-2014, 06:53 PM
  #198
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Lets be honest here, the UFA market isn't exactly stellar this year.

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07-02-2014, 06:56 PM
  #199
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Poile knows he needs to get a centre or James Neal becomes Jeff carter from Columbus and poile gets fired.

Patience guys, I know it's hard but just give it some time.

I have heard names circulating like mike Richards, max pacioretty, joe Thornton, nazem kadri, etc

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07-02-2014, 07:00 PM
  #200
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Poile knows he needs to get a centre or James Neal becomes Jeff carter from Columbus and poile gets fired.

Patience guys, I know it's hard but just give it some time.

I have heard names circulating like mike Richards, max pacioretty, joe Thornton, nazem kadri, etc
Isn't Pacioretty a winger?

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