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How come Sather always waits till the last minute

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Old
07-28-2014, 06:54 PM
  #76
GWOW
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The Kings had 12 key players who were home grown. 13 if you count Muzzin the Diver, who like Mcdonagh was drafted elsewhere but developed by another team. 14 if you count Martin Jones who appeared in 19 games.

Stoll and Greene have been Kings for six years since being traded. Only Carter, Gaborik, Williams, Regher, Mitchell and Richards

The 2012 Rangers had 13 if you count MZA, Kreider, McDonagh and Sauer. The 2014 team had eight - 10 if you count Miller and Moore.

I would very much like to see the end of acquiring overpriced or overage veterans and just for ***** and giggles see what a 2017 lineup of mostly homegrown Rangers with a 35-year-old Lundqvist can accomplish.

No Sather. No Nash.

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07-28-2014, 06:57 PM
  #77
Nyrvana
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Originally Posted by GWOW View Post
The point isnt whether he was deserving or not. The point is that Sather has habitually played hardball with the homegrown players. While he deserves credit for being consistent and not playing favorites, the truth is he is not loyal. These kids arent asking for the stars at a young age. But when you throw contracts to goons like Rupp and Brashear and Glass and useless lazy vets like Frolov and Kotalik and Redden while squeezing your younger guys, it creates animosity.

Sather didnt go with kids because he wanted to. He went with kids because he had to. Sather is the last remaining executive from the Wirtz/Ballard was of thinking. He's not liked or respected around the league, and if you think there's an anti-Rangers attitude from the media, you can thank Dolan and Sather for the vanilla coverage the team gets outside of Brooks. Everybody else hates him.



http://snyrangersblog.com/coachesgm/...agency-window/



http://nypost.com/2013/11/08/dubinsk...-with-rangers/



http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2...y-in-new-york/



http://nypost.com/2013/01/12/del-zot...l-before-camp/



http://espn.go.com/new-york/nhl/stor...gm-glen-sather



http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/ho...#ixzz0sABPJSOQ
Honestly, that's what I want my GM to do. I agree with you that it looks bad because he throws money at UFA's but he's got all the leverage in RFA situations. If he was tighter with UFAs it wouldn't be a problem. He's not because he doesn't have a lot of leverage. I think it's working well. How many home grown guys bolt? The recent ones I can think of all got traded: Cally, Dubi, AA, Del Zotto.

I think Sather has been good at not overpaying just because guys have grown up in our system. You could just as easily argue the other way and say they should take a discount because our system helped make them the player they are today. If players get ******** because of 200K why would you want them anyway. You really think MZA is angry at Sather because he signed a deal for 3.5 million dollars?

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07-28-2014, 07:10 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by GWOW View Post
The Kings had 12 key players who were home grown. 13 if you count Muzzin the Diver, who like Mcdonagh was drafted elsewhere but developed by another team. 14 if you count Martin Jones who appeared in 19 games.

Stoll and Greene have been Kings for six years since being traded. Only Carter, Gaborik, Williams, Regher, Mitchell and Richards

The 2012 Rangers had 13 if you count MZA, Kreider, McDonagh and Sauer. The 2014 team had eight - 10 if you count Miller and Moore.

I would very much like to see the end of acquiring overpriced or overage veterans and just for ***** and giggles see what a 2017 lineup of mostly homegrown Rangers with a 35-year-old Lundqvist can accomplish.

No Sather. No Nash.
The Kings also drafted Brayden Schenn and Wayne Simmonds. But they traded them for players that helped them win the cup.

Carter, Gaborik, Williams were extremely influential in their cup this year.

All you are asking for is that we play Fast, Lindberg instead of Glass and Lombardi.

Home grown:
Kreider, Stepan, MZA, Hagelin, JT Miller, McDonagh, Staal, Girardi, D.Moore, J. Moore (sort of), Lundqvist, Talbot

Not Home grown:

MSL, Nash, Brassard, Stempinak, Lombardi, Glass, Boyle, Klein

That's 12 players I would consider home grown (drafted or developed by the Rangers) I think it's a good mix.

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07-28-2014, 07:36 PM
  #79
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Everyone hates reclamation projects that failed (Frolov, Kotalik, etc), but you should remember that Jagr, Pouliot, Moore, even Gaborik (due to injury) and many others were reclamation projects that worked.

Even guys like Boyle, Rucinsky and Straka were projects at the time of their signing. Yes, every player is different, and you can focus on the positives of those who succeeded and the negatives of those that failed. But the truth is that sometimes you take chances on guys like Stemp and Lombardi, Pouliot and Moore because you recognize that without them, you're are out in the first round, and hope they will succeed enough to take you to the Final.

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07-29-2014, 01:11 PM
  #80
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1) Early bird catches the worm
2) Game of chicken

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beacon View Post
Everyone hates reclamation projects that failed (Frolov, Kotalik, etc), but you should remember that Jagr, Pouliot, Moore, even Gaborik (due to injury) and many others were reclamation projects that worked.

Even guys like Boyle, Rucinsky and Straka were projects at the time of their signing. Yes, every player is different, and you can focus on the positives of those who succeeded and the negatives of those that failed. But the truth is that sometimes you take chances on guys like Stemp and Lombardi, Pouliot and Moore because you recognize that without them, you're are out in the first round, and hope they will succeed enough to take you to the Final.
I have no issue with taking risks on signings, especially when the team has the money. I just don't understand why he signs Chris Mueller and not Peter Mueller or why he signs Arron Johnson or Brandon Mashinter instead of Sergey Tolchinsky. That's what drives me nuts.


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Old
07-29-2014, 02:35 PM
  #81
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Penner? AH Sather.

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Old
07-29-2014, 05:44 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Nyrvana View Post
The Kings also drafted Brayden Schenn and Wayne Simmonds. But they traded them for players that helped them win the cup.

Carter, Gaborik, Williams were extremely influential in their cup this year.
Kings can afford to trade some of their youth because they have so many solid prospects coming through their system.

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07-29-2014, 07:14 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Jersey Girl View Post
Kings can afford to trade some of their youth because they have so many solid prospects coming through their system.
Trading Schenn (the best player not in the NHL at the time) and Simmonds for Mike Richards really only "worked" because they won the cup. The trade is VERY lopsided in Philly's favor now.

Trading Johnson and a 1st for Carter didn't involve any players the Kings drafted.

The only prospect-for-NHL player deal the Kings have done since 2011 is Schenn+ for Richards. Which wasn't even a good trade. They also got Schenn as reward for being a garbage team until Doughty and Quick really broke out.

And the Kings prospect pool really isn't that impressive. Zykov, McNabb, and?

I read this and think "grass is greener to a T".

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07-29-2014, 07:33 PM
  #84
Nyrvana
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Originally Posted by Jersey Girl View Post
Kings can afford to trade some of their youth because they have so many solid prospects coming through their system.
That's my whole point. Do you realize how many prospects came through our system the last couple of years? Not only that, but the number of elite, 1st liners, and 2nd liners is quite high.

Traded for better players:
Callahan
Dubinsky
AA
Erixon
Del Zotto

Kept:
Henrik
Stepan
Kreider
Hagelin
McDonagh (sort of)
Staal
Girardi
MZA
Talbot

Unlucky:
Cherepanov
Sauer

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Old
07-29-2014, 07:38 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Raspewtin View Post
Trading Schenn (the best player not in the NHL at the time) and Simmonds for Mike Richards really only "worked" because they won the cup. The trade is VERY lopsided in Philly's favor now.
Lopsided is right. 2 cups in the 3 years since the trade. Doesn't get more lopsided than that.

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07-29-2014, 07:42 PM
  #86
Nyrvana
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Originally Posted by Raspewtin View Post
Trading Schenn (the best player not in the NHL at the time) and Simmonds for Mike Richards really only "worked" because they won the cup. The trade is VERY lopsided in Philly's favor now.

Trading Johnson and a 1st for Carter didn't involve any players the Kings drafted.

The only prospect-for-NHL player deal the Kings have done since 2011 is Schenn+ for Richards. Which wasn't even a good trade. They also got Schenn as reward for being a garbage team until Doughty and Quick really broke out.

And the Kings prospect pool really isn't that impressive. Zykov, McNabb, and?

I read this and think "grass is greener to a T".
The Kings have won because of their draft picks.

Kopitar, Quick, Doughty will do that for you.

They traded good players for Mike Richards that may not have been a great deal - but they did win two cups with him. He scored 15 points in 20 playoff games in 2012.

My point is that we are in a situation similar to the Kings. We have McDonagh/Stepan/Lundqvist. Obviously Kopitar > Stepan. But, we are able to trade some of our prospects and our picks for greater talent. If the Kings didn't have the prospect depth they did, it would have been tougher to make the trade they did for Carter. Just like it would have been tougher for the Rangers to make the trade for MSL.

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07-29-2014, 07:43 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Mikos87 View Post
Lopsided is right. 2 cups in the 3 years since the trade. Doesn't get more lopsided than that.
Yeah, and a Western Conference Finals appearance where they lost to the eventual champ.

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07-29-2014, 07:51 PM
  #88
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Lopsided is right. 2 cups in the 3 years since the trade. Doesn't get more lopsided than that.
You can't possibly argue Mike Richards has been the player LA originally traded for.

Which is my point.

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Old
07-31-2014, 10:39 AM
  #89
GWOW
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Originally Posted by Raspewtin View Post
You can't possibly argue Mike Richards has been the player LA originally traded for.

Which is my point.
He was in 2012 and 2013.

You can look at his play two ways -- either he struggled so mightily that Sutter had no choice to demote him, or the depth on LA was so extensive that he took one for the team and took to a limited role.

The truth is that LA is a putrid offensive team in the regular season. Richards has been a winner everywhere he's been. His postseason PPG on the Kings is about where he was during the regular season as a Flyer.

Philly went to the SCF with him as their best forward (Briere was just offense), then he leaves and the Kings go to three straight CF and win two Cups with Richards playing a huge role in two of those runs.

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