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Oilers sign Draisaitl to ELC

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Old
08-14-2014, 04:31 PM
  #101
Dabomb
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Jim Matheson @NHLbyMatty · 33m Draisaitl cannot go to Europe to play if doesn't make oilers. Because drafted out of chl has to play for junior team, so say Oilers.#oilers

Didn't Yakupov have the same issues with Sarnia when he went to play in the KHL? Wasn't he allowed to go in the end because they said his contract he signed with Sarnia wasn't binding because he was under 18?

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08-14-2014, 04:54 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Dabomb View Post
Jim Matheson @NHLbyMatty · 33m Draisaitl cannot go to Europe to play if doesn't make oilers. Because drafted out of chl has to play for junior team, so say Oilers.#oilers

Didn't Yakupov have the same issues with Sarnia when he went to play in the KHL? Wasn't he allowed to go in the end because they said his contract he signed with Sarnia wasn't binding because he was under 18?
Yak's also had something to do with the lockout did it not?

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08-14-2014, 04:54 PM
  #103
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Actually, I'm pretty sure you get paid per game. You still get your pay cheque if you're a scratch. It's when you get re-assigned to another league that your pay cheque is affected when you're on a 2-way.
I thought it was per day. That's why Philly played that game sending a player (I think it may have been Downie) to the Phantoms on non-game days only to recall him on game days. That may only be for cap purposes. Maybe salary is different.

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08-14-2014, 04:55 PM
  #104
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I never worry about other fans or what they say about the team.

Feeding on the hatred and anger of other fanbases is what nourishes Oiler fan's souls...


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08-14-2014, 05:01 PM
  #105
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Haha, yeah.

$925k/190 days = $4868 per day
Well technically he got paid $92,500 when he signed, and will again the next next two July 1sts, and $832,500/190 days = $4382/day during the season while with the club. Still a pretty sweet gig making as much in a day that many of us are lucky to make in 2-4 weeks.

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08-14-2014, 05:09 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
Yak's also had something to do with the lockout did it not?
"Nail Yakupov has been released to play in the KHL," Hockey Canada said. "Hockey Canada and the Russian Ice Hockey Federation have announced that the OHL has determined that Yakupov had no independent legal advice when, at the age of 17 years old, he signed his contract with Sarnia. His release goes into effect immediately."

So whatever that means... not too sure that the decision to let him play in KHL had anything to do with the lockout, even though that was the reason he went over there to play. Also not sure how that kind of ruling would apply in Draisaitl's case.

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08-14-2014, 05:38 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by Dabomb View Post
Jim Matheson @NHLbyMatty · 33m Draisaitl cannot go to Europe to play if doesn't make oilers. Because drafted out of chl has to play for junior team, so say Oilers.#oilers
He's making the team so there is no issue at all with him going to junior or anywhere else. Unless we make a miraculous 9th hour trade for a scoring Centre.

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08-14-2014, 05:54 PM
  #108
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I am glad they signed him to a 3 year deal. It's funny to see all the hate around the net over this. People are saying the Oilers are offering giant contracts again to someone who is unproven. How is offering a basic 3 year contract being reckless? I have not seen how much they signed him for around the net but I bet it was a reasonable amount for a high drafted rookie. I think it's just people being trolls. 3 years is not a extensive contract.
Those people don't know anything. Because of his age, the only deal he could sign was for 3 years. His salary is the rookie max of 925K and he is eligible for some performance bonuses that I think can take him up to the 2.6M range.

http://www.capgeek.com/faq/how-do-en...contracts-work

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08-14-2014, 06:18 PM
  #109
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Not sure why the ELC for top 5's really take this long, is there anything to really discuss?

I don't really care either way, but it just seems odd.
I suspect the delay has to do with the fact that both sides are extremely busy and know the contract will get done. Player agents might prefer...and teams might prefer...to have the player be settled in the summer and then sign. Or the team might make a big pressser out of it closer to the draft to drive tickets.

Lots of factors but basically i dont think either side waits or holds out or anything of the sort. Any delay is likely just the fact the player is making his rounds and running all over. Everyone gets the same deals there is really no negotiating on anything. Its the easiest contract for the organization and for the agent.

People should keep this in mind when there are delays on other contracts. Most of the time its just people having other things to do. I know a few teams and agents have waited for special occassions...players parents bday etc to have the contract delivered etc.

People imagine a GM and an Agent in the same room with a big pot of coffee and a crowd of assistants and lawyers and admin standing around fanning air at rattled GM. GM and agent throwing haymakers and squabbling.

Reality...GM calls, says i want to extend soandso. Ok send an offer. Well we are just in the kicking stage...what are you guys thinking? Ok this is what we are thinking...with this comoarable. Ok talk to you next week. And on and on. Hows the summer? Hows your golf game?
Typical big money deals talk.
Both sides normally know if a deal is workable and then both sides arent in a hurry and want to get the best edge for them.
Entry deals are no brainers and go to show that there is more to delays than animosity or tough negotiations. There is very little to negotiate on an elc. All 3rd overalls get the same contract pretty much theres really nothing to discuss. There are some minor tweaks that can be made but in minor things. I believe there are sections that can be changed based on players health concerns and other individual matters.


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08-15-2014, 12:48 AM
  #110
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Pronman tweeted that Matty is incorrect: Draisaitl can play next year in Europe "on loan" from PA, but it's the Oilers' decision, not Draisaitl's.

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08-15-2014, 04:32 AM
  #111
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If the Oilers were in the WHL I'd realize that this is a junior team and that means once a player can play in the pro leagues they will leave. They should leave.

I actually don't get my pants in a twist over a player leaving the Oilers to look for work elsewhere even as an NHL team. They're not slaves. If Leon suddenly felt he'd rather spend the rest of his career in the Swiss League I wouldn't be happy because it likely makes our team worse but I certainly wouldn't call him a traitor. It's his choice.

I'll just let that europe comment slide.
Agreed, it is ultimately his choice as he would know what's best for himself, but he will be playing in North American Ice for the rest of his career. He's a young lad, and this is the prime time to develop a player's habits, his Junior Team has already started developing those good habits for him, thus his massive pt production increase.
He's going to be playing with A rated players on a small rink with a lot of physicality, a lot. He goes to Europe, he's playing with B/C rated players on an international rink with little physical play compared to the NHL or AHL. This is why I say this would stunt his growth. It's like a chess connoisseur that's been working his way to play with the best, but goes back to his high school chess club to develop. Derp


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Old
08-15-2014, 05:48 AM
  #112
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Agreed, it is ultimately his choice as he would know what's best for himself, but he will be playing in North American Ice for the rest of his career. He's a young lad, and this is the prime time to develop a player's habits, his Junior Team has already started developing those good habits for him, thus his massive pt production increase.
He's going to be playing with A rated players on a small rink with a lot of physicality, a lot. He goes to Europe, he's playing with B/C rated players on an international rink with little physical play compared to the NHL or AHL. This is why I say this would stunt his growth. It's like a chess connoisseur that's been working his way to play with the best, but goes back to his high school chess club to develop. Derp
The NA ice point is valid and also the fact that there's a point in going back to the people who's already managed to develop him well but the SHL/KHL is waaay stronger than the CHL. And despite being a less physical style of hockey it's tougher to handle the physical play of the euro leagues since you're playing full grown men night in night out. Look at a player like Andre Burakowsky who was pretty much a fill out in the 2nd tier swedish league. Then left for the CHL after his draft year and was over PPG last season. Henrik Samuelsson is another example, he was completely worthless in his stint in the SHL, too slow, too little skill, too weak, he was a superb player in the CHL.

The CHL is a great league for developing young players but let's not pretend it's even close to the best pro leagues in europe in terms of quality.

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08-15-2014, 09:07 AM
  #113
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Originally Posted by dustrock View Post
Pronman tweeted that Matty is incorrect: Draisaitl can play next year in Europe "on loan" from PA, but it's the Oilers' decision, not Draisaitl's.
Poor Matty. Loved his columns, but he's just not knowledgeable enough to be a reporter in the internet age.

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08-15-2014, 09:22 AM
  #114
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Originally Posted by Gambl0r83 View Post
Agreed, it is ultimately his choice as he would know what's best for himself, but he will be playing in North American Ice for the rest of his career. He's a young lad, and this is the prime time to develop a player's habits, his Junior Team has already started developing those good habits for him, thus his massive pt production increase.
He's going to be playing with A rated players on a small rink with a lot of physicality, a lot. He goes to Europe, he's playing with B/C rated players on an international rink with little physical play compared to the NHL or AHL. This is why I say this would stunt his growth. It's like a chess connoisseur that's been working his way to play with the best, but goes back to his high school chess club to develop. Derp
Developed those habits FOR him? Christ, give the guy SOME credit.

And I'd rather he play with/against higher skilled players of whatever age, than be saddled playing with/against teams half-full of players that will never make it to KHL/SEL/AHL level hockey. Carrying a team full of dead weight does NOT automatically develop him as a player, after he has done it all the year before.

The main reason why most early first-rounders go back to their junior team is that they're not physically or mentally mature enough to handle the pro game. Not that they can learn that much more in 3 years than they can in 2. Ergo, P.A. can raise #29 to the rafters.

I hope you didn't chase his truck as he drove out of P.A. for the last time.

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08-15-2014, 11:09 AM
  #115
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Originally Posted by Gambl0r83 View Post
Agreed, it is ultimately his choice as he would know what's best for himself, but he will be playing in North American Ice for the rest of his career. He's a young lad, and this is the prime time to develop a player's habits, his Junior Team has already started developing those good habits for him, thus his massive pt production increase.
He's going to be playing with A rated players on a small rink with a lot of physicality, a lot. He goes to Europe, he's playing with B/C rated players on an international rink with little physical play compared to the NHL or AHL. This is why I say this would stunt his growth. It's like a chess connoisseur that's been working his way to play with the best, but goes back to his high school chess club to develop. Derp
You have absolutely no idea about European hockey, don't you?
Most of the players who play WHL would get eaten alive if they played in one of Europe's top leagues, heck, they would have a hard time being good enough for the DEL right now.

There is a huge - huge - difference between kids and men. Pro leagues have men, they are far more physical than any junior league could ever be, as they have plenty of fully developed and experienced hockey players, not some kids who are still growing.

Apart from the very best prospects, most will have a hard time cutting it in a pro league at age 16-19. It doesn't matter how high the ceiling of the players might be, most players in major junior are still far away from reaching it. The opposite is true for pros, they have already reached their ceiling, and that level is still quite a bit higher than the current level of pretty much every junior player (again, not counting the true elite which is ready for the NHL at age 18, which you can count on one hand).

Even the lesser European leagues have quite the number of former NHL-players or AHL-stars. Those players had more success in their careers than at least 95% of all major junior players can ever dream of achieving.

The reason why moving to Europe is a bad idea, is because the ice surfaces are of a different size and thus lead to a different playing style. There is no reason to have a player jump back and forth between rather different concepts, when he can just as well play in the NHL or spend another year in juniors, something which has never hurt a player's development in any noticeable way.

I find it quite astonishing that two or three people here feel the need to bash a player over a rumour that is based on nothing but hot air. How about you wait until the players himself actually says something of that kind, instead of attacking him over something he probably hasn't even heard about.


The fact that you suggest Draisaitl's first year was poor isn't even worth talking about, it's ridiculous.

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08-15-2014, 03:12 PM
  #116
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You have absolutely no idea about European hockey, don't you?
Most of the players who play WHL would get eaten alive if they played in one of Europe's top leagues, heck, they would have a hard time being good enough for the DEL right now.

There is a huge - huge - difference between kids and men. Pro leagues have men, they are far more physical than any junior league could ever be, as they have plenty of fully developed and experienced hockey players, not some kids who are still growing.

Apart from the very best prospects, most will have a hard time cutting it in a pro league at age 16-19. It doesn't matter how high the ceiling of the players might be, most players in major junior are still far away from reaching it. The opposite is true for pros, they have already reached their ceiling, and that level is still quite a bit higher than the current level of pretty much every junior player (again, not counting the true elite which is ready for the NHL at age 18, which you can count on one hand).

Even the lesser European leagues have quite the number of former NHL-players or AHL-stars. Those players had more success in their careers than at least 95% of all major junior players can ever dream of achieving.

The reason why moving to Europe is a bad idea, is because the ice surfaces are of a different size and thus lead to a different playing style. There is no reason to have a player jump back and forth between rather different concepts, when he can just as well play in the NHL or spend another year in juniors, something which has never hurt a player's development in any noticeable way.

I find it quite astonishing that two or three people here feel the need to bash a player over a rumour that is based on nothing but hot air. How about you wait until the players himself actually says something of that kind, instead of attacking him over something he probably hasn't even heard about.


The fact that you suggest Draisaitl's first year was poor isn't even worth talking about, it's ridiculous.
LoL, believe me, I have the entire sports package on my cable plan, I've seen European games, and I've seen CHL/WHL games. This claim of 'Most of the players who play WHL would get eaten alive if they played in one of Europe' is an exaggeration if I've ever heard one. Again, he'll be playing on international ice with little to no physical play, and at such a young age, this is not good for NHL development.

Do you even play hockey? It takes someone who actually goes out there every week to really have the feel and know for the game. It changes the way you watch, perceive and gives you empathic views on almost every player. If you don't, try is sometime, then maybe you won't be so sour and personal towards me and actually perceive in a way that's not the popular opinion, which is what is happening right now.

I've watched ALL of Leon's games that were aired, have you? Or did you just watch his European stint? His play DEFINITELY 110% improved from year one to year two with the PAR. How does this happen? Just a sudden boost from divine intervention? No, it was DEVELOPMENT. It was learning, and yes it was mostly his own motivation, but the guidance was uncanny and unparalleled to what he has received in the past. Proof? The numbers, numbers do not lie, only opinions do.

PS. The fact your from Germany (love the country) is IMO biasing your competitive view on the CHL/WHL compared to, of course, the glorified European hockey


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Old
08-15-2014, 03:30 PM
  #117
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Most WHL players would get killed in a top tier European league though, he's not wrong about that.

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08-15-2014, 03:47 PM
  #118
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Just had another idea...

The USHL has a team of all their best junior aged players... Team USA... which basically puts all the better players together on one team and they play together and the benefits obviously are that the players on this "elite team" benefit by playing with a higher level of teammates + this team plays games versus better opposition during the year as well (top junior teams from other countries etc).


Why couldn't something similar be done with the elite players from the CHL?

Take the best 20-25 WHL/OHL/QMJHL players and have them all on one team... they benefit by playing with other elite players and they get to play all season versus other elite junior teams.

If it works for the USHL why couldn't it work in the CHL?

This in my mind would be a step between playing on a regular WHL/OHL/QMJHL team all season and stepping up to an AHL team... this (in theory) would be a decent compromise.

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08-15-2014, 03:55 PM
  #119
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Just had another idea...

The USHL has a team of all their best junior aged players... Team USA... which basically puts all the better players together on one team and they play together and the benefits obviously are that the players on this "elite team" benefit by playing with a higher level of teammates + this team plays games versus better opposition during the year as well (top junior teams from other countries etc).


Why couldn't something similar be done with the elite players from the CHL?

Take the best 20-25 WHL/OHL/QMJHL players and have them all on one team... they benefit by playing with other elite players and they get to play all season versus other elite junior teams.

If it works for the USHL why couldn't it work in the CHL?

This in my mind would be a step between playing on a regular WHL/OHL/QMJHL team all season and stepping up to an AHL team... this (in theory) would be a decent compromise.
Probably because CHL teams wouldn't want to risk losing the star players that make them money.

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08-15-2014, 04:07 PM
  #120
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Probably because CHL teams wouldn't want to risk losing the star players that make them money.
Ya... no doubt these junior teams wouldn't like having these players they've put time/money into developing being ripped away from them for most/all of the season to have them play on an "all-star team" instead.

It seems to work in the USHL though.... although I assume maybe those junior teams aren't at the same financial levels as CHL teams.

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08-15-2014, 04:08 PM
  #121
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Most WHL players would get killed in a top tier European league though, he's not wrong about that.
Yep. No contest.

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08-15-2014, 04:22 PM
  #122
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A USNTDP-type program wouldn't really work in Canada.

It would be far deeper than the American's. They'd likely have a top9 of first round picks whereas the USNTDP is lucky to have even a top line of top60 picks.

No team in the CHL or CIS would give them a legitimate challenge.

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08-15-2014, 04:42 PM
  #123
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The CHL is just a money making cashcow for the owners who can pay the kids $50/week and make money hand over fist.

Good on Leon for getting away from that if he can.

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08-15-2014, 05:32 PM
  #124
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The CHL is just a money making cashcow for the owners who can pay the kids $50/week and make money hand over fist.

Good on Leon for getting away from that if he can.
This is not true, or at least, not across the board.

http://www.thehockeynews.com/blog/ho...ey-teams-make/

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08-15-2014, 05:50 PM
  #125
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The CHL is just a money making cashcow for the owners who can pay the kids $50/week and make money hand over fist.

Good on Leon for getting away from that if he can.
That's not true at all. The players get all of their expenses paid, plus an allowance, plus access to world-class training facilities, specialized schooling, guaranteed scholarships on a year-for-a-year basis, plus free room and board (billeting families compensated via free season tickets), etc., etc.

Ticket prices are cheap, attendance is often into the low 2000's on weeknights, the team lets STHers reuse unused tickets, they have food specials, giveaways, kids carnivals every Sunday, no tv sponsorship deals, etc., etc.

They donate a lot of money and time to local sports, and I wouldn't be surprised if the Oil Kings are a break-even organization that carries a balance forward to protect against future financial downturn.

It's not a cash cow here. It sure as hell isn't one in Prince Albert, population 30,000. It's probably more a labour of love from local sponsors that keeps the team afloat there.

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