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Why is Patrick Kane behind Voracek in the 2007 draft?

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Old
04-17-2007, 02:45 PM
  #51
WOTR
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Originally Posted by slade View Post
honestly- its the so called "complete player" clones that have me more worried than anything else.

Although I get your point, complete player means good at Offense and Defense. Why would anyone want to limit either side of the game?

When you don't have the puck, you are trying to get the puck or force the puck to a teamate. When you have the puck you are trying to create a goal. This game IS all about the balance of both ends and the middle.

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04-17-2007, 02:55 PM
  #52
LaLaLaprise
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Originally Posted by slade View Post
two way play is a style...why would a high scoring winger really NEED to focus on defensive play?

its that thought process that made the nhls dead puck era come to fruition...when teams were only drafting size and led to the nhl being a horrible product.





every player does NOT need to be doug gilmour. in kanes defense he is an offensive player in an offensive system. honestly- its the so called "complete player" clones that have me more worried than anything else.
Youre logic is flawed.

This day and age, 1 error leads to a great scoring chance...do you think any NHL coach is going to want their players floating around??

Kane is an offensive machine but there is no way an NHL coach will give him icetime if he doesnt want to play in both ends.

Im not saying he cant learn, but youre logic of Kane doesnt have to play defense is severly flawed.

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04-17-2007, 03:17 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by LaLaLaprise View Post
Youre logic is flawed.

This day and age, 1 error leads to a great scoring chance...do you think any NHL coach is going to want their players floating around??

Kane is an offensive machine but there is no way an NHL coach will give him icetime if he doesnt want to play in both ends.

Im not saying he cant learn, but youre logic of Kane doesnt have to play defense is severly flawed.
let me clarify...the london knights play a system. kane is in that system. he plays how he is told. we really have no idea what his duty is on the back check.

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04-17-2007, 03:25 PM
  #54
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Too many posters in this thread making assumptions about the type of player Kane is or his ability to translate his game to the next level. One thing he has shown is he's very coachable. I have no doubt he can adapt to any number of systems at the next level. All this talk of "playing scared" and not being effective is a bad joke.


Last edited by Rabid Ranger: 04-17-2007 at 04:03 PM.
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04-17-2007, 03:44 PM
  #55
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-led US team in WJC scoring
-led CHL in scoring in his first year
-broke usndp scoring record
-currently leads ohl in playoff scoring


notice a trend? he is pretty dominant in any level he plays right away..i have no doubt that he will when he hits the league; which is SEVERLY lacking exciting players...


there are many arguments about 2 way hockey. players should be responsible for thier own end. understood. but he is a DYNAMIC SCORER....that is what he will be if he is going to thrive in the nhl. if he is molded into a two way guy his talent will be wasted.

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04-17-2007, 04:05 PM
  #56
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but he is a DYNAMIC SCORER....that is what he will be if he is going to thrive in the nhl. if he is molded into a two way guy his talent will be wasted.
I agree that it would be a complete waste to turn Kane into a typical two-way forward, but every player on the ice has to be defensively responsible to a certain point. So far, Kane has shown almost zero defensive responsibility. That may very well be a result of the London way of doing things, but it does raise questions about his ability and desire to be more than a cherrypicker.

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04-17-2007, 04:34 PM
  #57
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I agree that it would be a complete waste to turn Kane into a typical two-way forward, but every player on the ice has to be defensively responsible to a certain point. So far, Kane has shown almost zero defensive responsibility. That may very well be a result of the London way of doing things, but it does raise questions about his ability and desire to be more than a cherrypicker.
Agreed with you here.

I've notice in the past few years that players who graduated out of the London Knights were all pretty poor Defensively !!

Rick Nash, Rob Schremp, Corey Perry, David Bolland, Dylan Hunter, Patrick Kane and Sam Gagner now, and so on. All offensive stars when they played with London, but Zero notions of what defence was !!

Rick Nash and Corey Perry are slowly learning the defensive side of the game in the NHL, so is Bolland and Schremp in the AHL.

The only one that is good in all 3 zones when they were in juniors is Sergei Kostitsyn who is the most complete player of the London Knights.

The fact is, because of the London System, the offensive stars of London that graduated comes in the PRO and don'T know anything about Defence, which is not a very good thing because they will need time to learn it.

Patrick Kane will follow the same path no doubt. The only one I see having an immediate impact in the NHL is Sergei Kostitsyn, but he will likely play in the AHL for 1 year.

With all that said, That's why Patrick Kane is behind Jakub Voracek. Voracek has size, has the offensive skills and plus he has the two-way play !! Which can not be said for Patrick Kane. To play in the NHL, you have to know the minimum defensive side of the game or else, coaches will not give you big minutes and you'll be an unidimensional player. Not saying that Patrick Kane has to become a two-player, but he has to learn the minimum if he don't want to be a Pylon in the defensive zone.


Last edited by Erika: 04-17-2007 at 04:40 PM.
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04-17-2007, 04:44 PM
  #58
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I've notice in the past few years that players who graduated out of the London Knights were all pretty poor Defensively !!

Rick Nash, Rob Schremp, Corey Perry, David Bolland, Patrick Kane, Sam Gagner, Dylan Hunter, and so on. All offensive stars when they played with London, but Zero notions of what defence was !!
Really?

And I didn't know the Knights were responsible for making Nash a defensive allstar after leaving the team at 17.

Schremp, Perry, and Kane are OFFENSIVE players. If they don't produce in the point department, they aren't going to play in any league regardless their defensive abilities.

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04-17-2007, 05:12 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by RUSqueelin View Post
Really?

And I didn't know the Knights were responsible for making Nash a defensive allstar after leaving the team at 17.

Schremp, Perry, and Kane are OFFENSIVE players. If they don't produce in the point department, they aren't going to play in any league regardless their defensive abilities.
I dont think anyone was saying for them to turn into grinders.

It seems that whenever someone says "Kane needs to improve his defense" people take it to the extreme and say "he is offensive, he is a goal-scorer, he is a point-producer" And while I dont argue that, there is such a thing as a goal-scorer who can help out his team in all 3 zones.

No one is asking Kane to turn into Martin Gelinas.

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04-18-2007, 12:07 PM
  #60
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ISS- do you think kanes playoff production can move him back to the top spot in your standings? Word is he just got his wisdom teeth removed because they were impacted pretty badly....he just started solid food in the last 48 hours.
That's a question best answered by our scouts when they have their next conference call to determine the rankings. Based on what I've heard, though scoring more points in junior is not what Kane needs to do to prove to our scouts that he will be a better all-round NHL player than Voracek. Having said that, He is No. 2 and that's not a lot of ground to make up, so we'll see.

We're still trying to confirm that Kane had his wisdom teeth removed. Other than a post on this board, we've not heard anything about it. Certainly, that would affect his performance if his diet was compromised. It will be interesting to see how Kane performs against Plymouth. I think they'll be a tough test for the Knights. If Kane can fight through their checking and beat their goalies, he'll impress a lot of people -- including us.


Last edited by ISS Hockey: 04-18-2007 at 12:53 PM.
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Old
04-18-2007, 12:14 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by ISS View Post
That's a question best answered by our scouts when they have their next conference call to determine the rankings. Based on what I've heard, though scoring more points in junior is not what Kane needs to do to prove to our scouts that he will be a better all-round NHL player than Voracek. Having said that, He is No. 2 and that's not a lot of ground to make up, so we'll see.

We're still trying to confirm that Kane had his wisdom teeth removed. Other than a post on this board, we've not heard anything about it. Certainly, that would affect his performance if his diet was compromised. It will be interesting to see how Kane performs against Plymouth. I think they'll be a tough test for the Knights. If Kane can fight through their checking and beat their goalies, he'll impress a lot of people including us.
It's well Known now that Kane had his wisdom teeth surgery. Played Mon, Tues, had them removed on Wed. Played Fri, Sun, Mon. He wasn't supposed to dress for a couple of those games but did anyways. I don't know how he did it - but it was obvious is play was subpar because of it.

You are right about Plymouth. Biggest, Baddest, Skilled team in the league. Kane should be healthy now. This will be a huge test for him.

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04-18-2007, 12:28 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by RUSqueelin View Post
It's well Known now that Kane had his wisdom teeth surgery. Played Mon, Tues, had them removed on Wed. Played Fri, Sun, Mon. He wasn't supposed to dress for a couple of those games but did anyways. I don't know how he did it - but it was obvious is play was subpar because of it.
Not that I'm doubting what you say, but can you provide a link to a Free Press article or something to corroborate what you say? Please and thanks. If you like, you can send me an e-mail to info@isshockey.com.

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04-18-2007, 12:37 PM
  #63
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Ask and ye shall receive...

http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/Sports/H...12869-sun.html

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04-18-2007, 12:43 PM
  #64
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thanks for the link...

now i know i officially did my part in helping kane take that #1 spot.

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04-18-2007, 12:45 PM
  #65
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Thank you.

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04-18-2007, 12:47 PM
  #66
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thanks for the link...

now i know i officially did my part in helping kane take that #1 spot.
I hope with everything in me Kane goes first overall to Chicago. The kid is incredibly talented, but not the player I want to see in Philadelphia. I may live to regret those words, but only time will tell.

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04-18-2007, 01:01 PM
  #67
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I don't know if it's an accurate comparaison since i haven't seen much of him but for some reason Kane reminds me of younger Paul Kariya.I'm not sure if Kane can have the same impact as early as Kariya had in his NHL career but i see him having the same kind of potential.

He's behind Voracek in the rankings but i wouldn't be surprised if he was picked 1st overall.

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04-18-2007, 01:13 PM
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i dont see kariya...who in my eyes always looked much smaller than kane. kariya relied on quickness- and kane is much more smooth then kariya- who is very choppy in his skating stride and stick handling.



but, thank GOD hes not compared to forsberg. (like 98 percent of all prospects).

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04-18-2007, 01:13 PM
  #69
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I don't know if it's an accurate comparaison since i haven't seen much of him but for some reason Kane reminds me of younger Paul Kariya.I'm not sure if Kane can have the same impact as early as Kariya had in his NHL career but i see him having the same kind of potential.

He's behind Voracek in the rankings but i wouldn't be surprised if he was picked 1st overall.
Kane's behind Voracek in *a* ranking.

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04-18-2007, 01:34 PM
  #70
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Voracek hasn't shown much in the way of goalscoring in the Q. During both the regular season and the playoffs he wasn't close to leading the league in that respect. His shooting percentage is also considerably lower then most of the top goalscorers.

What is the likely reason for this? Poor shot? Poor teammates? Does he seem like a guy that will have trouble breaking the 20 goal mark during an NHL season?

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04-18-2007, 01:47 PM
  #71
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Originally Posted by Bank Shot View Post
Voracek hasn't shown much in the way of goalscoring in the Q. During both the regular season and the playoffs he wasn't close to leading the league in that respect. His shooting percentage is also considerably lower then most of the top goalscorers.

What is the likely reason for this? Poor shot? Poor teammates? Does he seem like a guy that will have trouble breaking the 20 goal mark during an NHL season?
Hes a playmaker...

He needs to imrpove his shot, but its just a case of him going into the attacking zone, sucking in 2-3 defenders and finding the open team mate.

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04-18-2007, 01:50 PM
  #72
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i guess stats shouldnt be looked into- he is an 89 rookie. voraceks shot isnt what worries me- its those sloooooooooow legs of his.

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04-18-2007, 01:51 PM
  #73
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i guess stats shouldnt be looked into- he is an 89 rookie. voraceks shot isnt what worries me- its those sloooooooooow legs of his.
The ones that won him the timed races at the Prospects Game??

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04-18-2007, 02:07 PM
  #74
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Voracek hasn't shown much in the way of goalscoring in the Q. During both the regular season and the playoffs he wasn't close to leading the league in that respect. His shooting percentage is also considerably lower then most of the top goalscorers.

What is the likely reason for this? Poor shot? Poor teammates? Does he seem like a guy that will have trouble breaking the 20 goal mark during an NHL season?
He had 7 goals in 12 playoff games, which is only 2 behind the leader. So yeah, he wasn't even close to leading the league.

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04-18-2007, 02:56 PM
  #75
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The ones that won him the timed races at the Prospects Game??
talking more in terms of actual footwork, agility and first step. it is pretty well known that he is lacking in those departments.





as an aside i thought aliu had won the speed trials?


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