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Phi La PROPOSAL

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Old
04-19-2007, 12:47 PM
  #1
10 ft. pole
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Phi La PROPOSAL

to LA: 2nd overall
to PHI: Scott Parse, Richard, Petiot, and Lauri Tukonen


A lot of good prospects for 1 very good one. The Flyers have a pretty bad prospect pool and this stuffs their cupboard pretty good. Tukonen is a 2nd line to amazing third line winger, Parse is a sniper who just graduated, and Petiot is a meat and potatoes 4-5 Defenseman. The only reason LA does this trade is they have too mny good prospects in this age group and they can't develop them all. Philly is also going to be in the running for a lottery pick for the next couple of years. This just sets them up for 3-4 years down the road.

In todays NHL depth is more important than anything. Coburn and Petiot give the Flyers 2 more good young D-men to go along with Pitkanen! Tukonen and Parse are two guys that are ready for the NHL jump. Parse is the real centerpiece of this deal and is just a victim of the numbers game in LA.

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Old
04-19-2007, 12:58 PM
  #2
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Philly would be pretty stupid to have a very very very very bad season, and then to trade away the #2 pick for that package...? Yuck.

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Old
04-19-2007, 12:58 PM
  #3
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why?

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Old
04-19-2007, 01:06 PM
  #4
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Brutal deal for Philly.

Parse isn't that good a pro prospect and can become an UFA in a couple of months.

Petiot was a healthy scratch last night, in favor of undrafted college FA Jeff Likens.

Tukonen is the only decent piece going to them, and he has lost alot of value.

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Old
04-19-2007, 01:10 PM
  #5
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I may be biased but I'm not so sure the Flyers will be cellar dwellers next year. They'll pick up some key free agents (as they have loads of cap room to do so) and their younger players like Carter, Richards, and Pitkanen will be all the more better next year. We have a lot of younger guys that will be fighting for roster spots (Potulny, Ruzicka, Parent, Jones) so I don't feel trading away a pick that could get us a guy like Kane or Voracek for young players similar to the ones mentioned above is very smart or progressive move.

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Old
04-19-2007, 01:14 PM
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 10 ft. pole View Post
to LA: 2nd overall
to PHI: Scott Parse, Richard, Petiot, and Lauri Tukonen
This is proof you need a college degree to become a general manger. LA would have to give up their pick to get the second pick. Next time you put up a retarded proposal do some research on the Flyers prospects. I agree that LA has some good prospects, but the Flyers system is very underrated, so theres no reason to get depth of decent former first rounders because thats what they have already.

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Old
04-19-2007, 02:00 PM
  #7
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If the flyers trade the second pick they will be doing it for a proven roster player...

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Old
04-19-2007, 02:08 PM
  #8
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$100 says the Flyers make the playoffs before the Kings.


We have a pretty bad prospect pool, but three marginal prospects "stuffs their cupboard pretty good."

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Old
04-19-2007, 02:19 PM
  #9
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If by prospect pool you mean players in the AHL and lower, then sure, the flyers have an unimpressive pool. . .until you look at the recently graduated players that were on the flyers by the end of the season.

Carter, Richards, Upshall, Umberger, Potulny, Ruzicka, Coburn, Picard. . . .you get the picture.


and no, that's a bad proposal.

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Old
04-19-2007, 02:38 PM
  #10
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I think someone needs a lot of work on their trade logic. This is one of many horrible trade proposals made by this particular poster.

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Old
04-19-2007, 02:45 PM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Switchblade View Post
If by prospect pool you mean players in the AHL and lower, then sure, the flyers have an unimpressive pool. . .until you look at the recently graduated players that were on the flyers by the end of the season.

Carter, Richards, Upshall, Umberger, Potulny, Ruzicka, Coburn, Picard. . . .you get the picture.


and no, that's a bad proposal.
And you can add to that Downie, Girioux, Parent, and Nodl. The Flyers prospect pool is pretty good. You can't look at HF's ranking because they're really not all that accurate. You can add to that the steals that Holmgren and crew will inevitably find in this draft. So if they're going to trade the 2nd pick they're going to do it for an established vet as part of a package, or as part of a package for a very young promising player ala Hemsky, Horton, Getzlaf etc. I've been drooling over the idea of

Hemsky + 6th overall
for
Pitkanen + 2nd overall

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Old
04-19-2007, 02:49 PM
  #12
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The deal just doesn't make any sense from a Flyers' POV

And contrary to popular belief, the Flyers' actually have a decent prospect pool

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Old
04-19-2007, 02:50 PM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Winston Wolf View Post


$100 says the Flyers make the playoffs before the Kings.

Why do you think that?

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Old
04-19-2007, 03:05 PM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 10 ft. pole View Post
to LA: 2nd overall
to PHI: Scott Parse, Richard, Petiot, and Lauri Tukonen


A lot of good prospects for 1 very good one. The Flyers have a pretty bad prospect pool and this stuffs their cupboard pretty good. Tukonen is a 2nd line to amazing third line winger, Parse is a sniper who just graduated, and Petiot is a meat and potatoes 4-5 Defenseman. The only reason LA does this trade is they have too mny good prospects in this age group and they can't develop them all. Philly is also going to be in the running for a lottery pick for the next couple of years. This just sets them up for 3-4 years down the road.

In todays NHL depth is more important than anything. Coburn and Petiot give the Flyers 2 more good young D-men to go along with Pitkanen! Tukonen and Parse are two guys that are ready for the NHL jump. Parse is the real centerpiece of this deal and is just a victim of the numbers game in LA.
lol @ the bolded part...

While Tukonen and Parse sound good, I'd much rather have the #2. While this years draft isn't as good as others, there are still some quality players available. Besides, we have enough wingers in our system with Nodl, Giroux, and Downie, we don't need two more.

I have no interest in Petiot. It sounds weird to say this, but our defense is a little clogged up now, with guys like Hatcher, Gauthier, Kukkonen, Pitkanen, and Coburn, and other guys like Picard, Jones, and probably Parent next year all fighting for a spot on the blueline, it leaves little to no room for Petiot.

Like I said we don't need more prospects, the #2 will do us a lot better, and if we are trading it we're trading for a #1 center or a #1 d-man, not prospects.

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Old
04-19-2007, 03:09 PM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 10 ft. pole View Post
to LA: 2nd overall
to PHI: Scott Parse, Richard, Petiot, and Lauri Tukonen

A lot of good prospects for 1 very good one. The Flyers have a pretty bad prospect pool and this stuffs their cupboard pretty good. Tukonen is a 2nd line to amazing third line winger, Parse is a sniper who just graduated, and Petiot is a meat and potatoes 4-5 Defenseman. The only reason LA does this trade is they have too mny good prospects in this age group and they can't develop them all. Philly is also going to be in the running for a lottery pick for the next couple of years. This just sets them up for 3-4 years down the road.

In todays NHL depth is more important than anything. Coburn and Petiot give the Flyers 2 more good young D-men to go along with Pitkanen! Tukonen and Parse are two guys that are ready for the NHL jump. Parse is the real centerpiece of this deal and is just a victim of the numbers game in LA.
First of all, change your user title.

Second, as already mentioned the Flyers cupboard is far from bare.

Third, that deal doesn't accomplish much for the Flyers. An admirable job of pimping your prospects though. Who is this Richard that you list, or have you split Richard Petiot into two people and are trading both his halves? Petiot doesn't fill a need for the Flyers... no the defense isn't stellar but they've got depth defensemen, they need a first pairing-caliber defenseman. Petiot's not in Coburn and Pitkanen's rank, nice try there. And you forgot about Parent. And with Kukkonen, Picard and Bartulis, young defensemen isn't a need, it's an area of strength for the Flyers, so Petiot isn't needed. There's no guarantee that Scott Parse signs with the Flyers, so that's a gamble. Tukonen, "awesome third liner"? Based on what? He could be a good second liner, but he doesn't have the phyisical game or the defensive prowess to be a stereotypical third liner. He needs ice time, and I don't see him getting enough of it on the Flyers.

There's just no reason for the Flyers to make a deal centered around any of that.

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Old
04-19-2007, 03:09 PM
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ELab2 View Post
And you can add to that Downie, Girioux, Parent, and Nodl. The Flyers prospect pool is pretty good. You can't look at HF's ranking because they're really not all that accurate. You can add to that the steals that Holmgren and crew will inevitably find in this draft. So if they're going to trade the 2nd pick they're going to do it for an established vet as part of a package, or as part of a package for a very young promising player ala Hemsky, Horton, Getzlaf etc. I've been drooling over the idea of

Hemsky + 6th overall
for
Pitkanen + 2nd overall
I would not do that trade either... Players like Pitkanen are a lot harder to find than players like Hemsky, and there's not that much of a difference between 2 and 6 in this draft, or at least that's what I've heard.

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Old
04-19-2007, 03:20 PM
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reaper45 View Post
Why do you think that?
lots of reasons...

*possible $20 million to spend on free-agency
*2nd overall pick this coming draft
*trade deadline acquisitions of Kukkonen, Coburn, Parent, Upshall, and Biron

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Old
04-19-2007, 03:21 PM
  #18
ELab2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wachovia Center View Post
I would not do that trade either... Players like Pitkanen are a lot harder to find than players like Hemsky, and there's not that much of a difference between 2 and 6 in this draft, or at least that's what I've heard.
Your right in the fact that a franchise dman is harder to find that a playmaking winger. The difference here is that Hemsky has the chance to be an absolutely phenominal playmaking winger and he is well on his way. Pitkanen has issues and its quite possible that he never develops in that franchise dman that is so desired. So your cutting your risks with a guy who has some issues and could very well never reach his potential and picking up a guy who is well on his way to being a star. The payment for that is 4 spots in a top heavy draft.

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Old
04-19-2007, 03:33 PM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ELab2 View Post
Your right in the fact that a franchise dman is harder to find that a playmaking winger. The difference here is that Hemsky has the chance to be an absolutely phenominal playmaking winger and he is well on his way. Pitkanen has issues and its quite possible that he never develops in that franchise dman that is so desired. So your cutting your risks with a guy who has some issues and could very well never reach his potential and picking up a guy who is well on his way to being a star. The payment for that is 4 spots in a top heavy draft.
first, I'd rather take my chances with Pitkanen. like I already said, franchise d-men do not come around to often.

second, Pitkanen's issues are overrated, he's only 23, and was asked to do too much on a horrible blue-line. we now know his downside is 43 pts. on a 30th place team, which, imo, isn't half bad. his -25 isn't really an indicator of his play, but really the horrible start and the play of those around him. that's not to say Pitkanen is never at fault for an even strength goal, but -25 is way off.

these stupid pitkanen/hemsky proposals need to stop. philly has no interest in trading pitkanen right now.

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Old
04-19-2007, 03:37 PM
  #20
ELab2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wachovia Center View Post
first, I'd rather take my chances with Pitkanen. like I already said, franchise d-men do not come around to often.

second, Pitkanen's issues are overrated, he's only 23, and was asked to do too much on a horrible blue-line. we now know his downside is 43 pts. on a 30th place team, which, imo, isn't half bad. his -25 isn't really an indicator of his play, but really the horrible start and the play of those around him. that's not to say Pitkanen is never at fault for an even strength goal, but -25 is way off.

these stupid pitkanen/hemsky proposals need to stop. philly has no interest in trading pitkanen right now.
If a good enough offer came along they would move Pitkanen. Look at Homer's comments, its pretty clear that he knowns Pitkanen is a mental mess. I don't care about plus or minus but I watch every game and I KNOW his defensive play is TERRIBLE, he makes some the DUMBEST mistakes I've ever seen from an NHL player. I agree that if his downside is 40+ points than thats certainly pretty promising but his defensive play is a joke.

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Old
04-19-2007, 03:38 PM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 10 ft. pole View Post
to LA: 2nd overall
to PHI: Scott Parse, Richard, Petiot, and Lauri Tukonen
Per forum rules (where we state this numerous times), please put PROPOSAL in the title of your thread.

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No promises this time.
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Old
04-19-2007, 03:38 PM
  #22
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i also forgot to mention that the flyers have giroux coming up in the next couple of years, who is a similar player to hemsky.

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Old
04-19-2007, 03:41 PM
  #23
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This deal is so bad, I would expect a Canadiens fan to make it.

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Old
04-19-2007, 03:45 PM
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wachovia Center View Post
i also forgot to mention that the flyers have giroux coming up in the next couple of years, who is a similar player to hemsky.
Thats true and god do I hope Girioux is as good as Hemsky. I see what your saying but we do both agree at least that the #2 should only be traded if some real proven talent is coming back the other way.

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Old
04-19-2007, 04:17 PM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wachovia Center View Post
lots of reasons...

*possible $20 million to spend on free-agency
*2nd overall pick this coming draft
*trade deadline acquisitions of Kukkonen, Coburn, Parent, Upshall, and Biron
Do not want to start an argument but based on what you wrote we have just as much possible to spend or in similar situation. We have the 4th overall two picks down in a draft where there is no consensus. We added several picks and youth too. It is very well possible that you guys make playoffs before the Kings yet those are really weak arguments.

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