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Chelios vs Stevens

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Old
03-26-2007, 09:32 PM
  #51
NOTENOUGHBREWER
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Even if he's only 15 shouldnt he have some memory of 2002?

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Old
03-26-2007, 10:30 PM
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J0e Th0rnton View Post
Let me guess. You started watching hockey a year or 2 ago?
wasn't Stevens lying in a pool of his own karma two years ago?

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Old
03-26-2007, 11:23 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by arrbez View Post
wasn't Stevens lying in a pool of his own karma two years ago?

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Old
03-27-2007, 07:46 AM
  #54
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No, actually I've been watching hockey since the early 70's. How about you!

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Old
03-27-2007, 08:27 AM
  #55
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Originally Posted by DevilSinceDayOne View Post
No, actually I've been watching hockey since the early 70's. How about you!
Then all assume you were not watching the years Chelios won his 2 Norris trophies. He might have been given the first one because it was "someone elses turn", but his second was well deserved, and makes your statement of him "Never being top 5, or top 10 in all the seasons he played" seem pretty much like someone who never watched hockey back then.

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Old
03-27-2007, 08:45 AM
  #56
DevilSinceDayOne
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Admittedly my statement of him NEVER being a top 5 defenseman may have been made for affect. I simply happen to think that he is somewhat overated. My prior posts give him credit for being a very, very good defenseman. Look, baseball players win gold gloves year after year on reputation. Look at Derek Jeter (and I am a Yankee fan). So let's not pretend there are not politics involved.

I just don't ever remember a time when teams had to have any special game plan when matched up against Chelios. It has always been the "other guys" on his team that were the first concern.

Obviously most of the people here don't share my opinion. But I believe I'm entitled to mine.

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Old
03-27-2007, 08:51 AM
  #57
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Originally Posted by DevilSinceDayOne View Post
Admittedly my statement of him NEVER being a top 5 defenseman may have been made for affect. I simply happen to think that he is somewhat overated. My prior posts give him credit for being a very, very good defenseman. Look, baseball players win gold gloves year after year on reputation. Look at Derek Jeter (and I am a Yankee fan). So let's not pretend there are not politics involved.

I just don't ever remember a time when teams had to have any special game plan when matched up against Chelios. It has always been the "other guys" on his team that were the first concern.

Obviously most of the people here don't share my opinion. But I believe I'm entitled to mine.
Fair enough.

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Old
03-28-2007, 03:55 AM
  #58
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I am completely biased on this issue.

I watched Cheli play at the old Stadium and the UC for a number of years. He was without question the heart and soul of the franchise. He logged (heck, at 45 he continues to log) enormous minutes. As the Hawk franchise continued to deteriorate around him, we would regularly log in excess of thirty minutes of ice time.

He was and is physically intimidating, plays tremendous defense, and is one of the smartest players in the game.

No question of my vote on this one.....

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Old
03-29-2007, 10:15 AM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DevilSinceDayOne View Post
Go back to 1970 and aside from Randy Carlyle and Doug Wilson Chris Chelios is the worst defenseman to win the Norris in the last 35 years. He has won multiple Norris trophies based on reputation as much as anything else. Not to say that he has not been a very good defenseman for a lot of years. Great though, I don's think so.
Stop the madness. Chelios in his prime and over his career was the better overall defensemen. He's got the Norris Trophys to back it up, and you don't get a reputation unless you've done something. He may be the greatest US born defensemen, or at least in the top 5, and his longevity speaks to his work ethic and conditioning, even if he's a pale version of the Chelios that played with Montreal and in his early days in Chicago.

I have to disagree with your knock on Doug Wilson. His Norris in a season that he netted 39 goals, yes, 39 goals from the blueline...is so unwarranted. Doug Wilson is so underrated. He doesn't get the recognition he deserves, and had he not had the falling out with Keenan, he probably would've retired in a Blackhawk uniform. He had some injuries and maybe his career numbers don't suit some, but he was a steady a guy on the Blackhawk blueline as there was in the 1980s.

Additionally: This isn't to knock Scott Stevens, who when he was in Washington was a very good offensive player from the blueline. By the time he was in New Jersey he had become a very solid stay-at-home defensemen. I'd also add that Chelios led his entire team in scoring 1 season in Chicago, yep more pts. than Roenick, and I'd venture to say that's a fairly rare occurrence on a playoff team.


Last edited by ered7: 03-29-2007 at 10:26 AM. Reason: addendum
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Old
03-30-2007, 05:30 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DevilSinceDayOne View Post
Not even close. Has Chelios ever even been considered one of the top five (or even ten) defenseman in any single season he has ever played.

Uh, YES! Has Stevens ever been considered a top 5 in any year he played? Not bloody likely.

3 Norris Trophies to 0, plus a better offensive player, means Chelios is the winner. Stevens is like a (much) lesser Denis Potvin, while Chelios is an all-around All-time top 10 defenseman in the NHL.

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Old
03-30-2007, 11:21 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DevilSinceDayOne View Post
Not even close. Has Chelios ever even been considered one of the top five (or even ten) defenseman in any single season he has ever played.
Uhh, yeah? Unless they give three norris trophies out to defensemen who aren't in the top 10 in the league....

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Old
03-31-2007, 06:31 AM
  #62
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I was looking at this post and i honestly do not know how to answer it. straight up, in a 7 game playoff series, there is no doubt i would take stevens at any point of his career over chelios. the guy was just a competitor that never lost. Chelios was perhaps better than stevens in many facits of the game but under NO cercumstances would i chose him over stevens. What stevens did well (defense, positioning, hitting, competitiveness) eclipsed chelios and all of his atributes.

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Old
03-31-2007, 11:22 AM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by defense447713 View Post
I was looking at this post and i honestly do not know how to answer it. straight up, in a 7 game playoff series, there is no doubt i would take stevens at any point of his career over chelios. the guy was just a competitor that never lost. Chelios was perhaps better than stevens in many facits of the game but under NO cercumstances would i chose him over stevens. What stevens did well (defense, positioning, hitting, competitiveness) eclipsed chelios and all of his atributes.
Yeah because Chelios is such a poor playoff performer.

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Old
04-13-2007, 08:12 PM
  #64
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Stevens for me.

He has had more signature moments, and was feared more than Chelios.

Not to mention he played in more games, and has more goals.
Chelios will never pass Stevens in goals, and thats saying something considering Chelios is considered a better offensive defensemen.

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Old
04-14-2007, 02:33 PM
  #65
jiggs 10
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You don't think Chelios won't get 15 goals in the next five years? It will take him 2 years to pass the so-called "great offensive player who becmae defensive" Stevens, and he's already far beyond him in points in less games. Plus, Chelios was always considered a leader, not just in his last 5 or 6 years, like Stevens (Washington Capitals, anyone?). Chelios was a leader in Montreal as a second-year player in 1985-86, was definately the leader of the Hawks in the 90's, and has shown his leadership the last 7 seasons in Detroit.

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Old
04-25-2007, 01:57 AM
  #66
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Scott Stevens is a monster. The Guy did it all with sweat & tears. He also laid it out on the ice, did what it took to win a cup.

Was never a fan of Chelios -- Sure he can score but he doesn't bring the same physical aspect SS does.

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Old
04-25-2007, 04:02 AM
  #67
NOTENOUGHBREWER
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vilela View Post
Scott Stevens is a monster. The Guy did it all with sweat & tears. He also laid it out on the ice, did what it took to win a cup.

Was never a fan of Chelios -- Sure he can score but he doesn't bring the same physical aspect SS does.
Chelios also played a bit of defense every now and then. Better than Stevens did.

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Old
04-25-2007, 12:31 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by Wisent View Post
Didn`t he win 3 Norris trophies compared to Stevens`s how many? Seriously, Stevens was good but Chelios was great.
...BUT HE WAS PLAYING WITH A 324 years old Big Bird!!!

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Old
04-25-2007, 11:41 PM
  #69
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Chelios.

Stevens of course was more physical as one of the hardest hitters game has ever seen and he may have been a little more reliable defensive wise.

Both have some leadership skills, but Chelios in his prime had more offensive tools, almost equally sound defensive play and may be the grittiest and nastiest S.O.B. style of gameplay for a star player. Chelios could poke you in the eye or hack your hands off. I used to hate Chelios and I still think he's a nut, but he also made others nut by either hurting them or insulting them game after game, while playing at allstar level same time. Now since he is tamed a lot, it's easier to give Chelios credit for his good hockey sense. Always been a smart positional player, especially when he keeps his cool.

Chelios was, or is, not very big, but has a superhuman physical stamina. I think he could play in the NHL still after all the other current players have passed away, but he may keep his promise to Gordie Howe and stops when he's turning 50......But then again, that wouldn't be very Chelios like act, so he probably stops when he's 60. And even by then, he probably won't retire, but receives a lifetime suspension from the league.

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