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Edm/Nas contingency Proposal

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Old
05-20-2007, 08:06 PM
  #1
FacelessButcher
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Edm/Nas contingency Proposal

To Edmonton:
Zidlicky

To Nashville:
NYI 1st round pick (15th overall)


Reasoning for Edmonton: While not my first choice for offseason acquisitions we could use a defense man than can move the puck and has a clue on the PP. We could also quite easily get shut out of the UFA defense man market in the offseason and I see Zidlicky as a reasonable alternative that is locked up for 3 more years at a reasonable price and may be acquirable.

Reasoning for Nashville: Nashville has 12 unrestricted free agents this offseason in Kariya, Hartnell, Forsberg, Nichol, Fiddler, Smithson, Abid, Leahy, Timonen, Vishnevski, Zanon, Brookbank, and Goehring; while I'm sure they have little to no interest in retaining many of these guys they will still need to pony up for the guys they do wish to keep and trading Zidlicky for a pick frees up some cash. I also noticed Nashvilles' defense got pushed around by the larger Sharks forwards two years in a row (not trying to rub it in) so figured they might want to add a more physically imposing veteran defender like a Scott Hannan with their freed up cash to change their defensive mix.

Side note: proposal ways heavily on presumptions of Nashville signing Timonen and the Oilers not getting the defensive need addressed in the offseason from the UFA market.

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05-20-2007, 08:58 PM
  #2
Richter35
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dude zidlicky is a pretty ballin player on the pp. and the fact that he's signed is a plus, considering all these other unsigned players could hypothetically just walk. no go.

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05-20-2007, 09:18 PM
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I'd think Zidlicky is worth more than a mid-1st round pick. Plus, for a guy like him, he's relatively cheap.

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05-20-2007, 09:34 PM
  #4
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nashville WILL NOT sign vishnevki, more of the reason why they shouldnt even think about trading zidlicky just like the kings and visnovsky.

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05-20-2007, 09:40 PM
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nashville WILL NOT sign vishnevki, more of the reason why they shouldnt even think about trading zidlicky just like the kings and visnovsky.
We could trade him, regardless of the fact that Vishnevski won't be retained. Zanon likely WILL be re-signed. Say Zidlicky is traded, and Timonen and Zanon are resigned...

Weber Hamhuis
Suter Timonen
Klein(or reasonably priced UFA d-man...Sarich, Vaananen?) Zanon

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05-20-2007, 09:55 PM
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I'd do it. I wouldn't put Klein in that spot though, we need to get bigger on the blueline, more physical so either bring Klein up in Zannon's spot or keep Zannon and sign someone big to replace Zidlicky.

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Old
05-20-2007, 10:26 PM
  #7
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I think it's possible Nashville trades him, and I'd like to get him, but I have to imagine it'd take more than that.

I've always thought the kind of guy Nashville needs is Jason Smith. It'd suck to see him go to a team I hate though.

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Old
05-21-2007, 11:02 AM
  #8
FacelessButcher
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richter35 View Post
dude zidlicky is a pretty ballin player on the pp. and the fact that he's signed is a plus, considering all these other unsigned players could hypothetically just walk. no go.
While I think he is a good player on the PP it should be said he had a rather awful this year in that regard, so there is some risk in it for Edmonton. Zidlicky is not strong defensively so if he's not putting the points up on the PP he's nowhere near as useful.

His PPP/hr (powerplay points per hour) dropped massively from his 05-06 season to this year

2006-07 = 1.739 PPP/hr
2005-06 = 4.306 PPP/hr
2003-04 = 4.008 PPP/hr

To put this into context anyone with about a 3.5 PPP/hr is adequate at the job, anything above a 4 is good, and 5 or above is godly or Prongeresque.

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05-21-2007, 03:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FacelessButcher View Post
While I think he is a good player on the PP it should be said he had a rather awful this year in that regard, so there is some risk in it for Edmonton. Zidlicky is not strong defensively so if he's not putting the points up on the PP he's nowhere near as useful.

His PPP/hr (powerplay points per hour) dropped massively from his 05-06 season to this year

2006-07 = 1.739 PPP/hr
2005-06 = 4.306 PPP/hr
2003-04 = 4.008 PPP/hr

To put this into context anyone with about a 3.5 PPP/hr is adequate at the job, anything above a 4 is good, and 5 or above is godly or Prongeresque.
A big part of that was that he was a) shifted to the point, where his passing is nowhere near as effective and shot far less accurate...as opposed to right above the left circle, where in years passed he was deadly in both regards b) the emergence of Shea Weber and how much of Zidlicky's PP time he ended up usurping.

Nashville fans kind of made ZIds a whipping boy, as evidenced by some threads throughout the year on the Preds board, but make no mistake...he could and should still be a top PP defenseman.

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05-21-2007, 04:08 PM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FacelessButcher View Post
To Edmonton:
Zidlicky

To Nashville:
NYI 1st round pick (15th overall)


Reasoning for Edmonton: While not my first choice for offseason acquisitions we could use a defense man than can move the puck and has a clue on the PP. We could also quite easily get shut out of the UFA defense man market in the offseason and I see Zidlicky as a reasonable alternative that is locked up for 3 more years at a reasonable price and may be acquirable.

Reasoning for Nashville: Nashville has 12 unrestricted free agents this offseason in Kariya, Hartnell, Forsberg, Nichol, Fiddler, Smithson, Abid, Leahy, Timonen, Vishnevski, Zanon, Brookbank, and Goehring; while I'm sure they have little to no interest in retaining many of these guys they will still need to pony up for the guys they do wish to keep and trading Zidlicky for a pick frees up some cash. I also noticed Nashvilles' defense got pushed around by the larger Sharks forwards two years in a row (not trying to rub it in) so figured they might want to add a more physically imposing veteran defender like a Scott Hannan with their freed up cash to change their defensive mix.

Side note: proposal ways heavily on presumptions of Nashville signing Timonen and the Oilers not getting the defensive need addressed in the offseason from the UFA market.
Its a weak draft, In my opinion this offer is not even close. Predators would laugh at Lowe and hang up the phone.

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Old
05-21-2007, 04:13 PM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nomorekids View Post
A big part of that was that he was a) shifted to the point, where his passing is nowhere near as effective and shot far less accurate...as opposed to right above the left circle, where in years passed he was deadly in both regards b) the emergence of Shea Weber and how much of Zidlicky's PP time he ended up usurping.

Nashville fans kind of made ZIds a whipping boy, as evidenced by some threads throughout the year on the Preds board, but make no mistake...he could and should still be a top PP defenseman.
Actually I believe were looking for a PP defenseman to play the point to play give and go with Hemsky on the half-boards and feather passes across to Stoll on the other point for one timers. Not to say that our power-play couldn't use more talent wherever we can get it but if Zidlicky is not capable of playing the point we'll still need to address that.

2ndly whether or not Shea Weber ate into Zidlicky's PP time really doesn't affect the numbers I was using as it is a ratio, although the sample size would be smaller and more prone to statiscal anomalies (good bounces/bad bounces).

We use it on the Oiler board quite often if your interested it's calculated as
Total number of power play points scored over the season / (Total number of power play minutes played over the season / 60)

e.g. for Pronger in 2006-07 (regular season)

36 PP points scored / (382 PP minutes played / 60) = 5.65 PPP/hr

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Old
05-21-2007, 04:45 PM
  #12
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There was a thread not too long ago where a Habs fan offered the 22nd-overall pick for Zidlicky, and most of the Preds fans who answered were all for it. If that proposal was good, why isn't this one? Same conference?

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Old
05-21-2007, 04:55 PM
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There was a thread not too long ago where a Habs fan offered the 22nd-overall pick for Zidlicky, and most of the Preds fans who answered were all for it. If that proposal was good, why isn't this one? Same conference?
I'd personally do it, but I may just want Zidlicky's salary for more pressing needs that desperately

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Old
05-21-2007, 09:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dogbert View Post
There was a thread not too long ago where a Habs fan offered the 22nd-overall pick for Zidlicky, and most of the Preds fans who answered were all for it. If that proposal was good, why isn't this one? Same conference?
Hmm didn't even realize that was up there, guess I should of used the search function and posted my proposal in there.

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Old
05-21-2007, 09:47 PM
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it would require edmontons pick and a prospect. The higher pick is somwhat more fair, and a prospect guarantees some return in a weak draft. Because the predators seem to have a very good prospect system themselves, i dont think they'd be demanding 'a' level prospects, but something decent with good potential upside (ie a project winger)

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Old
05-21-2007, 10:25 PM
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it would require edmontons pick and a prospect. The higher pick is somwhat more fair, and a prospect guarantees some return in a weak draft. Because the predators seem to have a very good prospect system themselves, i dont think they'd be demanding 'a' level prospects, but something decent with good potential upside (ie a project winger)
we're looking for guys for the third line...preferably big...that can maybe pot 12 goals...

is JFJacques available? It seems like he fell out of favor a little, this year...

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05-21-2007, 10:44 PM
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we're looking for guys for the third line...preferably big...that can maybe pot 12 goals...

is JFJacques available? It seems like he fell out of favor a little, this year...
How about JF Jaques and the 28th pick for Zidlicky or the 15th pick straight up.

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05-21-2007, 10:47 PM
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How about JF Jaques and the 28th pick for Zidlicky or the 15th pick straight up.
Hm, interesting proposals, and I'm not sure which I'd be inclined toward...

Would other Oilers fans make this deal? Preds fans?

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05-21-2007, 11:10 PM
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Originally Posted by nomorekids View Post
Hm, interesting proposals, and I'm not sure which I'd be inclined toward...

Would other Oilers fans make this deal? Preds fans?
Both deals intrigue me but I'm a little hesitant after reading your post about Zidlicky's role on the powerplay. Any trade for Zidlicky would likely be made with the thought process that Zidlicky could play one of the point positions on the powerplay. You said he struggled from the point this year - was this true last year as well?

In regards to value, I think both are pretty fair. I'd be extremely hesitant to move Jacques though - he has really struggled at the NHL level but he's a legit 6'4, 220, he's only 22 years old and he has performed pretty well offensively in the AHL. The Oilers need a puck-moving defenceman though and Zidlicky is reasonably affordable as well.

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05-21-2007, 11:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nomorekids View Post
Hm, interesting proposals, and I'm not sure which I'd be inclined toward...

Would other Oilers fans make this deal? Preds fans?
I've wanted Zids for quite awhile now, so my POV could be slanted.

Personally, I think it would take the 15th and Jacques/prospect.

I think Zidlicky will be traded to clear budget room for Timonen, I only hope he ends up in Oiler silks. IMO, Zidlicky is exactly what we need...along with one more D-man of course.

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05-22-2007, 12:28 AM
  #21
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I would do the 15h pick + Jacques and a depth defensemen like Mathiu Roy.

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05-22-2007, 12:31 AM
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Lowball has the right idea.

Nashville already has a surplus of good d-men, with more in the fold (Klein, Franson, Laakso). Zidlicky had a down 06-07, and is signed to around $3.5M. With Timonen, Kariya, and Hartnell UFA, it would make sense for Nashville to deal Zidlicky. Personally, I think this deal favors them.

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05-22-2007, 12:35 AM
  #23
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I would do the 15h pick + Jacques and a depth defensemen like Mathiu Roy.
that's probably an overpayment.

how about the 15th and Jacques for Zidlicky and Sheldon Brookbank?

Now, I know that the name "Brookbank" evokes his worthless brother Wade, but Brookbank was an AHL all-star this year, and played the point on Milwaukee's power play. He's big, gritty...and is likely worth a shot if you really need a point-man. Preds management feels that on a lot of teams he could easily be an NHL defenseman...he and Jacques are both "project" types that could reward both sides.

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05-22-2007, 03:08 AM
  #24
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that's probably an overpayment.

how about the 15th and Jacques for Zidlicky and Sheldon Brookbank?

Now, I know that the name "Brookbank" evokes his worthless brother Wade, but Brookbank was an AHL all-star this year, and played the point on Milwaukee's power play. He's big, gritty...and is likely worth a shot if you really need a point-man. Preds management feels that on a lot of teams he could easily be an NHL defenseman...he and Jacques are both "project" types that could reward both sides.
Done

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