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Girardi's Upside

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Old
05-22-2007, 09:42 AM
  #26
Larry Melnyk
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
I like Sauer but his injuries have to be a concern.

He's better defensively than Jame Patrick and not as good offensively. Let's just say his upside is Lidster the way he played in the Devils series in '94.
Actually, I think Patrick was under-rated defensively and If Girardi keeps progressing he can turn into a steady but not spectacular offensive contributor..So, I Won't throw the Patrick possibilities out the window..Although a carfeer like lidster's would be fine also...

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05-22-2007, 09:56 AM
  #27
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Girardi = Solid #4 guy who can pitch in 20-25 points.

He's already proven me wrong once in a positive way, so if he does it again, I'll be pretty happy with it.

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05-22-2007, 12:28 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
I like Sauer but his injuries have to be a concern.

He's better defensively than Jame Patrick and not as good offensively. Let's just say his upside is Lidster the way he played in the Devils series in '94.
Interesting that you mention Patrick in a Girardi thread because Patrick's best play as a Ranger came when he first appeared with the Rangers. Hopefully that won't be the case with Girardi.

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05-22-2007, 12:30 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by chosen View Post
Interesting that you mention Patrick in a Girardi thread because Patrick's best play as a Ranger came when he first appeared with the Rangers. Hopefully that won't be the case with Girardi.
Acutally, Larry brought up Patrick. I was just responding to him.

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05-22-2007, 12:51 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Acutally, Larry brought up Patrick. I was just responding to him.
Interesting that Larry mentioned Patrick in a Girardi thread because Patrick's best play as a Ranger came when he first appeared with the Rangers. Hopefully that won't be the case with Girardi.

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05-22-2007, 02:38 PM
  #31
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if girardi/tyutin is our 3rd pair for the next 7-10 years we're in REALLY good shape lets put it that way

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05-22-2007, 03:08 PM
  #32
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If Tyutin's only a third pair guy...

then I'm not sure that's too good.

Tyutin-Girardi, I think, would've been classified as this team's second pairing, when they were together. Girardi was averaging nearly 20 minutes per night with little PP ice time. That sure ain't third pair minutes.

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05-22-2007, 03:28 PM
  #33
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#3-#4, 2nd pairing defenseman.

If his offense gets a little better, this guy could be a real minute-logger.

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05-22-2007, 03:40 PM
  #34
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I don't think Girardi will get that much better. In 5 years, he's still going to have the same strengths and weaknesses that he does now, but his strengths will be better and his weaknesses will be rounded out. He's not going to be a physical presence or a point producer. He's going to still be a steady d-man who makes a nice first pass. Think Sylvain Lefebvre but better with the puck.

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05-22-2007, 03:47 PM
  #35
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He can only get better. I mean he's a 23 year old and he's playing like he's 30. I think he can only get better. Maybe not in an offensive sense, but in a defensive sense, definitely.

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05-22-2007, 06:14 PM
  #36
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Unlike forwards, who peak in their early 20's, defensemen tend to peak in their late 20's. So knowing that, I expect we haven't seen the best from him yet. And what we have seen is certainly top 4 material. Girardi demonstarted poise, talent and the ability to grow during his stay in New York. By the playoffs he was getting constant second pair ice time -- well earned and much deserved. If he continues to develop at the rate he has demonstarted (and don't you think this run has made him even hungrier?) I could see him being a solid 3-4 for many years or perhaps the mate for a top defenseman with flair. What a pleasant and welcome surprise!

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05-22-2007, 06:15 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by JayMan82 View Post
Why can't be the type of defenseman like Tallinder and Lydman are on the Sabres (Who I think are EXTREMELY underrated)?
Iagree, Tallindere was dominating Jagr in the P/O's
That tandom was the Sabres best skaters

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05-22-2007, 06:15 PM
  #38
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Interesting that Larry mentioned Patrick in a Girardi thread because Patrick's best play as a Ranger came when he first appeared with the Rangers. Hopefully that won't be the case with Girardi.
Had something to do with Leetch arriving. Patrick was the top young gun until 2/29/88.

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05-22-2007, 06:50 PM
  #39
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Girardi will be around for years 2 come

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05-22-2007, 09:04 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by bobbop View Post
Had something to do with Leetch arriving. Patrick was the top young gun until 2/29/88.

I think it had more to do with the arrival of a) Keenan and b) Zubov.

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05-22-2007, 09:59 PM
  #41
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I said it when I first saw him...He plays just like Aaron Miller did in his prime..Just steady and always in the right place...

I think Girardis career will mirror Millers career...

Girardi might be the perfect partner for a #1 d-man....

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Old
05-23-2007, 08:54 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Kodiak View Post
I don't think Girardi will get that much better. In 5 years, he's still going to have the same strengths and weaknesses that he does now, but his strengths will be better and his weaknesses will be rounded out. He's not going to be a physical presence or a point producer. He's going to still be a steady d-man who makes a nice first pass. Think Sylvain Lefebvre but better with the puck.

One would think that looking at his skill set, he wouldn't get a lot better. But guys like him who work as hard as he does do tend to get better as time goes. He's improved since being around and that constant improvement is what usually makes really good players.

Also, any time you put a comparison to xxxxxxxx defenseman, but say that Girardi is better with the puck doesn't follow a ton of logic... Better with the puck is a HUGE factor in determining how good a defenseman is. Its like saying that Girardi is better than Igor Ulanov, except he's better with the puck and has better positioning.

There are two things that could push Girardi to being a potential top 2 defenseman. Right now because he makes so few errors, he's a 2nd pairing type of guy. But, if he were to really make strides offensively or with his physical play, he could be a 2nd defenseman type of guy. He improves his physical play, and he's a shut down type of guy where if he improves his offensive play, then he's extremely well rounded with a style that isn't overly physical.

So right now he's a 2nd pair guy where if he makes real improvement in either of those facets, and he could be a top pair guy.

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05-23-2007, 10:07 AM
  #43
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Originally Posted by bobbop View Post
Had something to do with Leetch arriving. Patrick was the top young gun until 2/29/88.
I disagree. I don't think Patrick ever looked as good as he did in his first season, for whatever reason. He looked like a future perennial all-star upon arrival.

Statistically, 91-92 was Patrick's best season.

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05-23-2007, 01:30 PM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kodiak View Post
I don't think Girardi will get that much better. In 5 years, he's still going to have the same strengths and weaknesses that he does now, but his strengths will be better and his weaknesses will be rounded out. He's not going to be a physical presence or a point producer. He's going to still be a steady d-man who makes a nice first pass. Think Sylvain Lefebvre but better with the puck.
I was thinking Lefebvre right when you said that.

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05-23-2007, 01:34 PM
  #45
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I disagree. I don't think Patrick ever looked as good as he did in his first season, for whatever reason. He looked like a future perennial all-star upon arrival.

Statistically, 91-92 was Patrick's best season.
I blame it on the neck brace he had to wear on the ice.

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Old
05-24-2007, 05:17 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Kodiak View Post
I don't think Girardi will get that much better. In 5 years, he's still going to have the same strengths and weaknesses that he does now, but his strengths will be better and his weaknesses will be rounded out. He's not going to be a physical presence or a point producer. He's going to still be a steady d-man who makes a nice first pass. Think Sylvain Lefebvre but better with the puck.
That does not make sense. Lefebvre was a 2nd pairing defenseman on Stanley Cup winning teams. If that is what Girardi becomes, then he is, in fact, going to get better. I think that he is just quitely solid in what he does. He does not get rattled. He may not be a physical mauler, but he understands how to use his body to seperate the oncoming forward from the puck. He certainly managed to emerge from the corners with the puck enough times.

I do not like the Malik comparisons that I saw. Unlike Malik, Girardi is not afraid to use his body to play the defender. Also, unlike Malik, Girardi does not seem to have a penchant for throwing the puck through the middle of the ice or for stopping skating and getting caught flat footed.

Him and Tyutin seem to make a fine pair. If he can handle playing the role of a #4 defenseman, it would be a huge coup.

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05-24-2007, 07:24 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by True Blue View Post
That does not make sense. Lefebvre was a 2nd pairing defenseman on Stanley Cup winning teams. If that is what Girardi becomes, then he is, in fact, going to get better. I think that he is just quitely solid in what he does. He does not get rattled. He may not be a physical mauler, but he understands how to use his body to seperate the oncoming forward from the puck. He certainly managed to emerge from the corners with the puck enough times.

I do not like the Malik comparisons that I saw. Unlike Malik, Girardi is not afraid to use his body to play the defender. Also, unlike Malik, Girardi does not seem to have a penchant for throwing the puck through the middle of the ice or for stopping skating and getting caught flat footed.

Him and Tyutin seem to make a fine pair. If he can handle playing the role of a #4 defenseman, it would be a huge coup.
How isn't he like Malik?

He's not overtly physical but to say Malik never hits anything is false information. Malik is very good at seperating the puck from a player using his body. The fact that he doesn't have to do that often is a testament to his stick checking ability and positioning. He's far from a bad defenseman and gets a bad reputation here based on those risky passes.

The only difference is their passing skills. Maliks are better, but it comes with the catch of the occasional bonehead pass. Girardi doesn't seem to have that problem as he makes the safe play more often than not.

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05-24-2007, 07:28 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by MisterUnspoken View Post
How isn't he like Malik?

He's not overtly physical but to say Malik never hits anything is false information. Malik is very good at seperating the puck from a player using his body. The fact that he doesn't have to do that often is a testament to his stick checking ability and positioning. He's far from a bad defenseman and gets a bad reputation here based on those risky passes.

The only difference is their passing skills. Maliks are better, but it comes with the catch of the occasional bonehead pass. Girardi doesn't seem to have that problem as he makes the safe play more often than not.
I thought that I listed how he isn't like Malik? Suffice it to say, we are in a disagreement here. No, I do not think that Malik uses his body to seperate anything from anyone. There are other differences besides passing skills. Girardi does not stop skating, which leads to getting caught flat footed, which leads to either a penalty for water skiing or an odd-man rush. To me, that, along with better positional play, and the lack of the glaring turnover in the center of the ice, makes for a huge difference.

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05-24-2007, 07:36 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by True Blue View Post
I thought that I listed how he isn't like Malik? Suffice it to say, we are in a disagreement here. No, I do not think that Malik uses his body to seperate anything from anyone. There are other differences besides passing skills. Girardi does not stop skating, which leads to getting caught flat footed, which leads to either a penalty for water skiing or an odd-man rush. To me, that, along with better positional play, and the lack of the glaring turnover in the center of the ice, makes for a huge difference.
Malik takes some penalties because he's slow not because he stops skating. Speedy forwards give him trouble and Girardi isn't fleet of foot either. The comparison is fairly accurate imo, but like you said we'll have to disagree TB.

If you want to point fingers at Maliks turnovers that's fine, but I never hear anyone saying how good he is at getting the puck to the forwards quickly so they can work their magic. There is no one better on the team in that regard. Both Rosival and Tyutin are okay at it, but not as good as Malik.

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05-24-2007, 10:12 PM
  #50
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My take on him is different, MU

Yes, Malik can make some nice passes, but there was just something not there this year. Not like in the prior year. Maybe it is a down year (IMO), or maybe he could not readjust, once the league adjusted (going back to the end of last year). This is one we'll have to disagree on. I think that Girardi played a better game. Let's hope he can do better next year. If he really can play a 2nd line defensive role, then Sather will have himself quite the find.

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