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Old
05-31-2007, 05:57 PM
  #1
nashtrash25
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All Preds\hamilton Talk\argument\debate Goes Here

The Board of Governors will not approve a new owner who doesn't even bother to pretend that he's keeping the team in Nashville.

Already, Balsillie has violated "good faith" by brazenly dealing with Hamilton and making promises to their chatty mayor before even owning the team.

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05-31-2007, 06:14 PM
  #2
Joe T Choker
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nashtrash25 View Post
The Board of Governors will not approve a new owner who doesn't even bother to pretend that he's keeping the team in Nashville.

Already, Balsillie has violated "good faith" by brazenly dealing with Hamilton and making promises to their chatty mayor before even owning the team.
remember we're the most classless team in the league (according to Lites and some other GMs/Owners) and we also suck the most from the Revenue Sharing Nipple

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05-31-2007, 07:33 PM
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belle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nashtrash25 View Post
The Board of Governors will not approve a new owner who doesn't even bother to pretend that he's keeping the team in Nashville.

Already, Balsillie has violated "good faith" by brazenly dealing with Hamilton and making promises to their chatty mayor before even owning the team.
I don't see how they don't approve it. They're probably smacking their lips thinking about a team valued at around $135M being sold for $220M.

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06-01-2007, 07:19 AM
  #4
handtrick
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Originally Posted by belle View Post
I don't see how they don't approve it. They're probably smacking their lips thinking about a team valued at around $135M being sold for $220M.
Exactly....it sets a new benchmark for the NHL franchise valuation....

And that is truly where these owners recoup the "losses" that they will so gladly tell you about that in reallty becomes quite an attractive profit.

There is no way the Board doesn't approve this sale.

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06-01-2007, 07:42 AM
  #5
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My eyes have now been opened.

Bettman and the owners don't give a squat about the fans.

It's all about the bottom line --- cash is king and the NHL is a business.

It's a true shame how big league sports are no longer are about the game and all about the almighty greenback...

That being said, I still don't think we have a prayer longterm. I think if Balsillie gets this team, its just a matter of time until we are toast. It may be a year or two or three, but we will be gone.

</bashingNHL>

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06-01-2007, 11:21 AM
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PredDave View Post
My eyes have now been opened.

Bettman and the owners don't give a squat about the fans.

It's all about the bottom line --- cash is king and the NHL is a business.

It's a true shame how big league sports are no longer are about the game and all about the almighty greenback...

That being said, I still don't think we have a prayer longterm. I think if Balsillie gets this team, its just a matter of time until we are toast. It may be a year or two or three, but we will be gone.

</bashingNHL>
Yeah, it sucks. What can ya do though

The guys with the big bucks will just throw money around until they get what they want. That's how professional sports work, and thats how life works, period.

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06-01-2007, 11:36 AM
  #7
jstreet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nashville108 View Post
Yeah, it sucks. What can ya do though

The guys with the big bucks will just throw money around until they get what they want. That's how professional sports work, and thats how life works, period.
however ture that may be, at least I will be able to sleep at night knowing that I am not a part of it. If the Preds move, the NHL is dead to me.

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06-06-2007, 05:15 AM
  #8
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Canada's Competition Bureau to launch inquiry on NHL's relocation policies

I thought you guys should be aware of this recent news in Canada.

According to the National Post:

"Canada's Competition Bureau is believed to have launched an inquiry into the franchise relocation practices and policies of the National Hockey League amid speculation that one of its financially strapped teams in the United States could be relocated to Southwestern Ontario.

Sources familiar with the probe told the National Post the federal independent law enforcement agency notified the NHL's executive offices in New York last month. Officials from the NHL did not respond to a request for an interview yesterday.

At the same time, it is believed Canadian billionaire Jim Balsillie, who signed a letter of intent to purchase the struggling Nashville Predators for US$220-million last month, has also been contacted by the Canadian competition watchdog."


Full article here:

http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/n...0e1fa02456&k=0

GHOST

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06-06-2007, 07:41 AM
  #9
AdsSabresRule
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Federal law...

Quote:
Originally Posted by GHOSTofMAROONSroad View Post
I thought you guys should be aware of this recent news in Canada.

According to the National Post:

"Canada's Competition Bureau is believed to have launched an inquiry into the franchise relocation practices and policies of the National Hockey League amid speculation that one of its financially strapped teams in the United States could be relocated to Southwestern Ontario.

Sources familiar with the probe told the National Post the federal independent law enforcement agency notified the NHL's executive offices in New York last month. Officials from the NHL did not respond to a request for an interview yesterday.

At the same time, it is believed Canadian billionaire Jim Balsillie, who signed a letter of intent to purchase the struggling Nashville Predators for US$220-million last month, has also been contacted by the Canadian competition watchdog."


Full article here:

http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/n...0e1fa02456&k=0

GHOST
Well, I'm a U.S. Federal Agent - not Canadian, but IMO this is the key phrase -

["According to insiders, the competition bureau is reviewing whether the territorial rights and vetoes ascribed to the league and its individual members in its constitution contravene civil sections of the Canadian Competition Act that deal with abuse of dominant position and market restriction provisions. The watchdog is attempting to determine whether the NHL and its member teams are engaged in anti-competitive practices that substantially lessen competition in a market, or, are likely to do so.

In July, 2006, the bureau launched a similar investigation into the NHL's relocation practises and expressed interest in "how those procedures might be applied with respect to a proposed relocation to southern Ontario," sources say."]

- You would have to separate the business's right to 'free market trade and ability to be successful in spite of others inability to compete with you - versus you and others in some form of collusion to deliberately affect someone elses right to compete with you that was beyond their control...I also think that with their look at this 'bylaw 36' or whatever, and the U.S. law involving franchise relocations = perhaps they think that NHL relocations are not permissible 'on its face' unless under very tight parameters...(?)

Gosh - listening to what I just wrote is why people can't stand to talking to us and lawyers!

I am sure, if this article is legit, that the Sabres and the Maple Leafs are thinking Balsillie is already getting ready to move to their area - and they don't like it! Interesting. I would like to see how U.S. law would affect an inter - national move like this. I assume the NHL is an organization with a board of directors that can make and change bylaws (?) I look at 2 teams in LA, and 3 in NYC. So, if a precendent has been set to 'payoff' rival teams, then why would not BUF and TOR go for that? Really interesting development!


Last edited by AdsSabresRule: 06-06-2007 at 07:54 AM.
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Old
06-06-2007, 12:06 PM
  #10
barrytrotzsneck
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Ghost, this isn't the first time this has been addressed or tried. Similar campaigns(not just on this matter, but the process of involving red tape and microscoping loopholes\flaws in the bylaws) have not been successful. It's, basically, throwing something at the wall and hoping it sticks.

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06-06-2007, 01:03 PM
  #11
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Are you reading this to mean that the Canadian government is putting pressure on the NHL to allow freer access to moving teams to Canada? The investigation appears to center around the restrictions the NHL has on moving into another team's territory.

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06-06-2007, 01:28 PM
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Seems to me that the issue is legally murky with regards to a team in Hamilton infringing on the territory of Buffalo, since this is a Canadian legal question and Buffalo is still in the U.S. Where's the jurisdiction here???

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06-06-2007, 02:04 PM
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AdsSabresRule
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Balsillie...

I almost think that Balsillie may want to know if he even has to pay another team for the right to move his team where he wants to...I know that the gal that wrote the article is going to be on Tatti/Green Power Play on XM in a little bit...can't listen though, will be out of the car for a bit...
I do think that the fact that CA was looking at this in July of 2006 is interesting...It is almost like some sinister plan was in the works all along...If it wasn't PIT it would be Nashville...who knows.

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06-06-2007, 04:01 PM
  #14
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Let me be one to send condolences to all rabid Pred fans. I remember when the Atlanta Flames got ripped out of our city.

The attendance was never a question here either, the loyal 15,870 (OMNI sellout number) kept the place rocking, but since the OMNI didn't have the luxury suites, the owners ran to the Calgary buyers like Mike Vick's dogs running to a morsel of food.

I wish the pep rallies and letters could change things, but you aren't dealing with hearts and minds. You are dealing with dollars and greed. It's just a shame that corporate heads don't give a rat's ass about the fans AT ALL.

It will be a sad, sad day and you will have everyone in Hartford, Winnepeg, Atlanta, Cleveland (Browns and Barons), Baltimore and every other city that sees money pigs bully the state and city for tax dollars to build new stadiums and then rips the team up by the roots at a whim.

The hope is that this Hamilton thing gets nutted up in the courts for years so that Basille and everyone else with the deep pockets suffer while the team stays put.

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06-06-2007, 05:44 PM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chucky17 View Post
Let me be one to send condolences to all rabid Pred fans. I remember when the Atlanta Flames got ripped out of our city.

The attendance was never a question here either, the loyal 15,870 (OMNI sellout number) kept the place rocking, but since the OMNI didn't have the luxury suites, the owners ran to the Calgary buyers like Mike Vick's dogs running to a morsel of food.
There must have been more to it than you are suggesting. The Atlanta Flames moved to Calgary and played in a 7,000 seat arena (Stampede Corral) from 1980-1983 before the Saddledome was completed. I'd be shocked if attendance in Atlanta wasn't an issue at that time for ownership to accept three years of such small crowds if attendance in Atlanta was strong.

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06-06-2007, 06:53 PM
  #16
triggrman
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Attendance wasn't an issue, ownership was, don't assume.

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06-06-2007, 07:28 PM
  #17
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One of Balsillie's laywers, Richard Rodier, was on a radio show on the Fan590 (Toronto's sport station) with Bob McCown this afternoon talking about moving the Predators out of Nashville.

http://www.fan590.com/features/primetimesports.jsp

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06-06-2007, 07:33 PM
  #18
barrytrotzsneck
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vanek-26 View Post
One of Balsillie's laywers, Richard Rodier, was on a radio show on the Fan590 (Toronto's sport station) with Bob McCown this afternoon talking about moving the Predators out of Nashville.

http://www.fan590.com/features/primetimesports.jsp
Gee, the same guy that keeps assuring the Nashville papers that Balsillie is just a "rabid hockey fan" and has no intention of moving the team if it will work in Nashville.

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06-06-2007, 08:03 PM
  #19
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Summary of Richard Rodier Interview on FAN590, Toronto

http://www.fan590.com/features/primetimesports.jsp

Contrary to another post elsewhere, he was not "talking about moving the Preds" as the other poster suggested. He was being interviewed and answered questions about the topic as asked by the interviewers. He repeated ad nauseum that the lease governed and there were no guarantees that the team would move.

Some interesting tidbits:

RE the lease:

- Balsillie's offer is NOT contingent upon Leipold giving notice under the lease (which notice has not been given at this time).

- the 14,000 attendance clause is a cumulative average; that is, the attendance must average 14,000 over the two seasons combined. Paid attendance last year was 13,815. Accordingly, attendance next year must be 14,185.

- the city's obligation to pick up tickets must be at the average price at that time.

- the lawyer's interpretation is that the tickets cannot be bought at season's end to make up a shortfall (not definitive though).

- the city is still maintaining the position that the notice cannot be given until after next year (if applicable).

- the lease rent is $150,000 per month. ("a very good lease").

RE "territorial rights":

- the applicable line is the city's corporate limits (not the arena).

- they believe that Hamilton is outside the territorial rights of Buffalo, but is inside Toronto.

- however, the position re Buffalo is based on merely the fact that Buffalo has never demanded compensation for exhibition games at Hamilton, despite Toronto being paid (omiting the fact that the last Hamilton game was a Buffalo game - weak argument - why would they pay themselves?).

- for the last exhibition game in Hamilton, they paid the Leafs $300,000 (!!).

- he messed up on his interpretation of the NHL constitution. He quoted the provision which is an absolute prohibition on relocation, but then mixed it in with th eprovision regarding the granting of franchises (expansion franchises). He was really muddled on this point.

RE Price:

- the $220 million price quoted is LOW (!!!). The real price is between $220 and $240 million.

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06-06-2007, 10:37 PM
  #20
barrytrotzsneck
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Thanks for the recap, gsc. The poster that provided that link is a southern Ontario "local" who is likely just hearing what he wants to hear.

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06-07-2007, 12:39 AM
  #21
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New developments in the Nashville deal

Balsillie's lawyer was on Prime Time Sports on the Fan 590 in Toronto and it's a very interesting interview.

He believes that they would NOT have to pay territorial rights to either Buffalo or Toronto...particularly Buffalo, if the team relocated to Hamilton.

Also, he (not in so many words) says the board of governors has already approved the relocation of the Preds, otherwise he would not have paid the money he did.

Apparently the $220 million was a low figure and he actually paid more.

http://www.fan590.com/features/primetimesports.jsp

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06-07-2007, 12:53 AM
  #22
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so what? hockey is lame

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06-07-2007, 01:21 AM
  #23
barrytrotzsneck
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HamiltonBruins View Post
Balsillie's lawyer was on Prime Time Sports on the Fan 590 in Toronto and it's a very interesting interview.

He believes that they would NOT have to pay territorial rights to either Buffalo or Toronto...particularly Buffalo, if the team relocated to Hamilton.

Also, he (not in so many words) says the board of governors has already approved the relocation of the Preds, otherwise he would not have paid the money he did.

Apparently the $220 million was a low figure and he actually paid more.

http://www.fan590.com/features/primetimesports.jsp
He's insane if he thinks they wouldn't have to. If that were the case, the Ducks would be knocking on the Kings' door right about now, looking for the money THEY paid because of territorial infringement.

Not that it matters. If you're getting your hopes up for an NHL team in Hamilton, you're getting played just as badly as us. You're a pawn, just like us.

And as far as the BOG approving the relocation, either he's lying, delusional...or you are. There's been no vote yet, nor can there be any such vote because he DOES NOT EVEN OWN THE TEAM YET. Unless Leipold did him a favor and ran it by the board, just because that's the kind of guy he is, there is not a shred of truth to it.

Look, I know you're hopeful about having an NHL team to root for, but if you can't get your facts straight or at least choose who you believe a little better, you're going to be in for just as much heartache as we could possibly be looking at, a couple years from now.

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06-07-2007, 11:55 AM
  #24
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Quote:
- Balsillie's offer is NOT contingent upon Leipold giving notice under the lease (which notice has not been given at this time).
No, it was hinted by the host (and Rodier would not deny) that Leipold would give notice as part of the deal. I believe McCown said he would have demanded that up front, to which Rodier replied "Interesting". He said that Balsillie can't this year because the deadline to do so will have passed when the sale goes through.

Quote:
- the city is still maintaining the position that the notice cannot be given until after next year (if applicable).
Again, Rodier would not confirm or deny that they can give notice before the 07-08 season.

Quote:
- however, the position re Buffalo is based on merely the fact that Buffalo has never demanded compensation for exhibition games at Hamilton, despite Toronto being paid (omiting the fact that the last Hamilton game was a Buffalo game - weak argument - why would they pay themselves?).
After the interview (not online) McCown and Kelly said that Hamilton is 63 miles (based on their experience driving from one to the other, which Kelly does a lot), which out outside the area. Also Kitchener/Waterloo is ouside of both teams protected areas. It has been reported here that Balsillie has booked Cops Collisum in Hamilton for the 08-09 season, and that he would keep the team in Hamilton (paying the Leafs, not the Sabres) for 2 seasons while a new arean was built in Kitchener Waterloo.

Quote:
- he messed up on his interpretation of the NHL constitution. He quoted the provision which is an absolute prohibition on relocation, but then mixed it in with th eprovision regarding the granting of franchises (expansion franchises). He was really muddled on this point.
If you mean the first (or one of the first) points he brings up, he didn't miss-interpret, the constitution contridicts itself.

Quote:
Thanks for the recap, gsc. The poster that provided that link is a southern Ontario "local" who is likely just hearing what he wants to hear.
All I said was they talk about moving team, seems like that was what the conversation was about.

Quote:
He believes that they would NOT have to pay territorial rights to either Buffalo or Toronto...particularly Buffalo, if the team relocated to Hamilton.
No, while in Hamilton they would have pay Toronto (but they would challange that, as it has never been enforced by the league, the Ducks and Kings settled it themselves). However the belief is the team will ultimatly be in Kitchener Waterloo, which outside of both the Sabres and Leafs territories.

Quote:
He's insane if he thinks they wouldn't have to. If that were the case, the Ducks would be knocking on the Kings' door right about now, looking for the money THEY paid because of territorial infringement.
Again the Ducks and Kings settled it out on their own, they were talking about whether the league could force the Predators to do it and whether or not Balsillie would have a legal argument.

Quote:
you're going to be in for just as much heartache as we could possibly be looking at, a couple years from now.
From everything I've read, 07-08 could be the teams last year in Nashville.


Last edited by sluggo*: 06-07-2007 at 01:53 PM.
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06-07-2007, 12:47 PM
  #25
barrytrotzsneck
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vanek-26 View Post



From everything I've read, 07-08 could be the teams last year in Nashville.
That's because everything you've read is hoping for just that, but there's still a lot of lawn to be mowed before it comes to that. This whole thing seems to have "woken up" the city of Nashville, especially on a corporate level.

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