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Will Montoya find his way to Phoenix?

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Old
06-03-2007, 06:31 PM
  #51
CM Lundqvist
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
Dupuis for Bourret? I bet if this was posted on here before the deadline we would have gotten another one of ur ranting posts.
There's a difference, there's a new general manager in Phoenix, and he's not a dumbass like Don Waddell, who went into panic mode and made not only that terrible deal, but traded Braydon Coburn, his best young defenseman, for Alexei Zhitnik.

That comparison is absolutely ridiculous.

Not only that, but "...another one of my ranting posts?"

I'm sorry that you're not smart enough to understand the fact that our garbage (Hollweg, Malik, Immonen, Rachunek, Kasparaitis, etc...) is not going to get us quality assets in return.

Think about it... would you trade the 3rd overall pick for Malik, Hollweg, and Rachunek?

Think before you speak, man.

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Old
06-03-2007, 06:41 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Theoren Fan View Post
And why is everbody so against at least giving some time to Montoya before we package him up with Malik and Hollweg for whatever we can get? For all we know, Montoya bumps Henrik and wins the Vezina in his rookie season and we're talking about what we can get for Lundqvist...
NO ONE is looking to package montoya for whatever we can get just for the sake of moving him...being willing to move him for the RIGHT price and being willing to move him for whatever we can get is hugely different

if you can get what you'd consider the 'right price' now then what is the point of waiting. we need to get a top line player and he's our best tool to do that. if you can make that deal now then his value isn't gonna go up much more then that by waiting.

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06-04-2007, 07:32 AM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GretzNYR99 View Post
There's a difference, there's a new general manager in Phoenix, and he's not a dumbass like Don Waddell, who went into panic mode and made not only that terrible deal, but traded Braydon Coburn, his best young defenseman, for Alexei Zhitnik.

That comparison is absolutely ridiculous.

Not only that, but "...another one of my ranting posts?"

I'm sorry that you're not smart enough to understand the fact that our garbage (Hollweg, Malik, Immonen, Rachunek, Kasparaitis, etc...) is not going to get us quality assets in return.

Think about it... would you trade the 3rd overall pick for Malik, Hollweg, and Rachunek?

Think before you speak, man.

The fact that you put Malik and Immonen into the list of garbage players shows me something about how smart you are. Also no one has put Malik, Hollweg, and Rachunek for 3rd overall except you.

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06-04-2007, 12:54 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
The fact that you put Malik and Immonen into the list of garbage players shows me something about how smart you are. Also no one has put Malik, Hollweg, and Rachunek for 3rd overall except you.
The fact that you think they're worth something, especially with Malik's uncountable amount of defensive gaffes and his overblown salary for his overrated +/- stat, and Immonen's lack of progress at the NHL level, shows how smart YOU are. Immonen's window is closing quickly, and teams aren't exactly lined up at the door for him. Not to mention the fact that guys like Colton Orr are in the Rangers line-up rather than Immonen doesn't look good for his value.

That proposal was made up as an example. People offering players like that with Montoya, and thinking that they'll get Mueller or Hanzal or Lisin along with the 3rd overall because they added those players are out of their minds.

It's amazing how some people just can't stop overrating their own players. What's even more amazing is how quick they'll turn on them once they're traded.

You still didn't my answer my question? Would you trade that package for the 3rd overall if you're Maloney?

Better yet, would you do this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Noonan25 View Post
It wouldnt hurt to ask for Mueller and the 3rd for Montoya and maybe a Jessiman
Wait, I'm sorry, I shouldn't be asking you that, because you're the one who proposed this TERRIBLE offer...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
Sjostrom + Mueller + 1st 4 Montoya + Hollywood
Absolutely Terrible. Sjostrom is worth FAR MORE THAN Hollweg. Mueller and Montoya is about an even swap, and then we just get a 1st rounder for nothing?!?

Don Maloney would spit in your face, and rightfully so, this isn't NHL 07, guy.

I think some people agree with me here...

Quote:
Originally Posted by FLYLine88 View Post
I really doubt PHX would even consider that...

It's going to take a lot more then that to get Mueller and the 3rd overall.
And that's in regards to Montoya and Hollweg going the other way.

Here's someone else agreeing with FLY...

Quote:
Originally Posted by SPG View Post
They should... that proposal is awful.
Then, someone else agreeing with my point of view...

Quote:
Originally Posted by -31- View Post
both, combined with Hollweg and Immonen being worth very little
Are you sensing a trend here? Hollweg and Immonen have almost no value!

Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure this out.

A 'Yotes fan agrees with me here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by XavierX View Post
Thank you.

Guys, just because someone drafts a player, doesn't mean they can't go sour on them over time. That, combined with the fact that all of the Coyotes young players and its #3 pick are off limits entirely, means no trade will happen. I wouldn't even give you the 21st overall for Montoya. We've gone over this before. I could offer you a LeNeveu + Spiller for Montoya swap, but you'd laugh. Theres no trade here between the teams that I can see.
Would you want LeNeveu and Spiller for Montoya??!?

Odds are, you wouldn't. Why? Because Montoya has all of the potential in the world, and Spiller is crap. Basically, it's 1 quality asset for a decent player, and a garbage add-in.

Just think about things before you process them or whatever you do to them, because you apparently have not put yourself in Maloney's shoes at all.

Magical Fairy Tale trades don't happen in real life like they do in EA NHL games.

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06-04-2007, 05:58 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GretzNYR99 View Post
The fact that you think they're worth something, especially with Malik's uncountable amount of defensive gaffes and his overblown salary for his overrated +/- stat, and Immonen's lack of progress at the NHL level, shows how smart YOU are. Immonen's window is closing quickly, and teams aren't exactly lined up at the door for him. Not to mention the fact that guys like Colton Orr are in the Rangers line-up rather than Immonen doesn't look good for his value.

That proposal was made up as an example. People offering players like that with Montoya, and thinking that they'll get Mueller or Hanzal or Lisin along with the 3rd overall because they added those players are out of their minds.

It's amazing how some people just can't stop overrating their own players. What's even more amazing is how quick they'll turn on them once they're traded.

You still didn't my answer my question? Would you trade that package for the 3rd overall if you're Maloney?

Better yet, would you do this?



Wait, I'm sorry, I shouldn't be asking you that, because you're the one who proposed this TERRIBLE offer...



Absolutely Terrible. Sjostrom is worth FAR MORE THAN Hollweg. Mueller and Montoya is about an even swap, and then we just get a 1st rounder for nothing?!?

Don Maloney would spit in your face, and rightfully so, this isn't NHL 07, guy.

I think some people agree with me here...



And that's in regards to Montoya and Hollweg going the other way.

Here's someone else agreeing with FLY...



Then, someone else agreeing with my point of view...



Are you sensing a trend here? Hollweg and Immonen have almost no value!

Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure this out.

A 'Yotes fan agrees with me here.



Would you want LeNeveu and Spiller for Montoya??!?

Odds are, you wouldn't. Why? Because Montoya has all of the potential in the world, and Spiller is crap. Basically, it's 1 quality asset for a decent player, and a garbage add-in.

Just think about things before you process them or whatever you do to them, because you apparently have not put yourself in Maloney's shoes at all.

Magical Fairy Tale trades don't happen in real life like they do in EA NHL games.

Look at the title in the thread, this is all speculation and there is nothing wrong with people speculating on what kind of deal could get done. What are u the trade police?
Unless you are a gm or agent that has contacts behind the scene you have as much of a clue as anyone on here. You are no one to go around calling anyone stupid for posting thier thoughts like u did to me.

As far as my proposal, u just stated that Immonen has zero trade value but Sjostrom does. Why is that? Is Sjostrom not starting to look like an NHL bust? Has he done anything on a regular basis in the NHL to make someone think his trade value is hi? As a matter of fact, I would be willing to bet that Immonen would easily match his 18 pts in the NHL. The only thing that Sjostrom has that Immo doesn't is the speed.

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06-04-2007, 07:23 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by bobbop View Post
Smartest thing said in this entire thread.

thank you. Nicest thing said to me all day.

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06-05-2007, 01:03 AM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
Look at the title in the thread, this is all speculation and there is nothing wrong with people speculating on what kind of deal could get done. What are u the trade police?

Unless you are a gm or agent that has contacts behind the scene you have as much of a clue as anyone on here. You are no one to go around calling anyone stupid for posting thier thoughts like u did to me.
First off, you were the one that bashed me for going off on a senseless tirade, when I was merely stating that our garbage is not going to get us quality assets in return, unlike some of our fellow Ranger fans think (you being one of them). It wasn't aimed directly at anyone. You felt that I was attacking you, and decided to take liberties into your own hands, and out on me.

You provoked this, not me, so don't act like a victim, claiming innocence.

No, but putting myself in Maloney's shoes, and from seeing Phoenix fans say that it would take a lot to pry that 3rd overall pick from them, them giving up the 3rd overall for absolutely nothing in return in a terribly lop-sided trade that favors the Rangers by far is NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.

You don't need to have an inside source or to be a gm to figure out these things...

1. Hollweg has very little trade value, as he is a fringe NHL player with no potential.

2. Sjostrom is still young, and has some potential, but has been buried in Phoenix.

3. PHOENIX IS NOT GOING TO GIVE UP THE 3RD OVERALL PICK FOR ABSOLUTELY NOTHING IN RETURN.

God damn, if you can't see understand those 3 points, then please seek psychiatric help immediately. It's common sense we're talking about here, I gave you some credit, thinking that you would have the common sense to see this, but I guess not. I guess you're STILL stuck in your fairy tale land where everything is peaches and cream, despite the fact that many people seem to echo my sentiments when I say that garbage will not garner quality assets in return.

Quote:
As far as my proposal, u just stated that Immonen has zero trade value but Sjostrom does. Why is that? Is Sjostrom not starting to look like an NHL bust? Has he done anything on a regular basis in the NHL to make someone think his trade value is hi? As a matter of fact, I would be willing to bet that Immonen would easily match his 18 pts in the NHL. The only thing that Sjostrom has that Immo doesn't is the speed.
Immonen has very little trade value because of the fact that he hasn't been a regular in the NHL at any point of his career, and is 25 years old, going on 26. He's been sent down in favor of Colton Orr... jesus christ, that isn't going to help out your trade value at all, even if it is Renney's terrible decision making that facilitated that turn of events.

Sjostrom JUST turned 24, has and has played 210 games at the NHL level. He's been BURIED in Phoenix, playing 3rd and 4th line ice time with linemates who can't generate offense on a team that's DESPERATELY NEEDED offensive firepower ever since it's inaugural season, and even while they were the Jets. So there's your 18 points for you. Sjostrom's situation is VERY similar, if not exactly like Prucha's. Both talented young wingers who can score, but are buried on the 3rd and 4th lines, and have VERY LIMITED power play time.

Not only that, but I compared Sjostrom to Hollweg in your trade, the two NHL regulars, and anyone with a brain would take Sjostrom in a heartbeat, as Hollweg does nothing but take terrible boarding and charging penalties, doesn't fight often, and isn't all that good offensively or defensively. Sjostrom would be a low-risk, high-reward project player that could end up being a 20-30 goal scorer if given the ice time and the chance to produce. I never said Sjostrom's value was through the roof or anything, but if you want me to break down the trade, I will again...

- Sjostrom/Hollweg: The two NHL regulars in your proposed trade, Freddy's got the advantage here. He's young, has potential to score 20-30 goals if given the chance, and has a boatload of speed, something the Rangers love having.

Advantage: Rangers by a landslide.

- Mueller/Montoya: The two prospects in your proposed trade are just about as even as can be, not only in terms of trade value, but in terms of value to the club. Montoya will be a little more expendable to the Rangers than Mueller is to the Yotes, but Montoya as of right now is needed in the system for organizational depth, although who knows with the signing of Miika Wiikman.

Advantage: Even

- Phoenix's 3rd overall pick in 07/Nothing: Do I really have to go into details?

Advantage: If you can't figure this one out, then you shouldn't be on this site.

One other thing, before you bad-mouth Sjostrom, why don't you actually watch him play. It helps to actually know what you're talking about.

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Old
06-05-2007, 05:48 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GretzNYR99 View Post
First off, you were the one that bashed me for going off on a senseless tirade, when I was merely stating that our garbage is not going to get us quality assets in return, unlike some of our fellow Ranger fans think (you being one of them). It wasn't aimed directly at anyone. You felt that I was attacking you, and decided to take liberties into your own hands, and out on me.

You provoked this, not me, so don't act like a victim, claiming innocence.

No, but putting myself in Maloney's shoes, and from seeing Phoenix fans say that it would take a lot to pry that 3rd overall pick from them, them giving up the 3rd overall for absolutely nothing in return in a terribly lop-sided trade that favors the Rangers by far is NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.

You don't need to have an inside source or to be a gm to figure out these things...

1. Hollweg has very little trade value, as he is a fringe NHL player with no potential.

2. Sjostrom is still young, and has some potential, but has been buried in Phoenix.

3. PHOENIX IS NOT GOING TO GIVE UP THE 3RD OVERALL PICK FOR ABSOLUTELY NOTHING IN RETURN.

God damn, if you can't see understand those 3 points, then please seek psychiatric help immediately. It's common sense we're talking about here, I gave you some credit, thinking that you would have the common sense to see this, but I guess not. I guess you're STILL stuck in your fairy tale land where everything is peaches and cream, despite the fact that many people seem to echo my sentiments when I say that garbage will not garner quality assets in return.



Immonen has very little trade value because of the fact that he hasn't been a regular in the NHL at any point of his career, and is 25 years old, going on 26. He's been sent down in favor of Colton Orr... jesus christ, that isn't going to help out your trade value at all, even if it is Renney's terrible decision making that facilitated that turn of events.

Sjostrom JUST turned 24, has and has played 210 games at the NHL level. He's been BURIED in Phoenix, playing 3rd and 4th line ice time with linemates who can't generate offense on a team that's DESPERATELY NEEDED offensive firepower ever since it's inaugural season, and even while they were the Jets. So there's your 18 points for you. Sjostrom's situation is VERY similar, if not exactly like Prucha's. Both talented young wingers who can score, but are buried on the 3rd and 4th lines, and have VERY LIMITED power play time.

Not only that, but I compared Sjostrom to Hollweg in your trade, the two NHL regulars, and anyone with a brain would take Sjostrom in a heartbeat, as Hollweg does nothing but take terrible boarding and charging penalties, doesn't fight often, and isn't all that good offensively or defensively. Sjostrom would be a low-risk, high-reward project player that could end up being a 20-30 goal scorer if given the ice time and the chance to produce. I never said Sjostrom's value was through the roof or anything, but if you want me to break down the trade, I will again...

- Sjostrom/Hollweg: The two NHL regulars in your proposed trade, Freddy's got the advantage here. He's young, has potential to score 20-30 goals if given the chance, and has a boatload of speed, something the Rangers love having.

Advantage: Rangers by a landslide.

- Mueller/Montoya: The two prospects in your proposed trade are just about as even as can be, not only in terms of trade value, but in terms of value to the club. Montoya will be a little more expendable to the Rangers than Mueller is to the Yotes, but Montoya as of right now is needed in the system for organizational depth, although who knows with the signing of Miika Wiikman.

Advantage: Even

- Phoenix's 3rd overall pick in 07/Nothing: Do I really have to go into details?

Advantage: If you can't figure this one out, then you shouldn't be on this site.

One other thing, before you bad-mouth Sjostrom, why don't you actually watch him play. It helps to actually know what you're talking about.


Wow all of this because I made a trade proposal. I didn't know it upset you so very much. I rarely make them and now I know why.......it's cause of people like you. I can sit here and list some trades made that if it was posted here you would have said the same thing. Would u think Todd Fedoruk is worth a 2nd round pick? Well he's not but he was traded for one. I also mentioned the Dupuis trade and u just brushed it off. There are others but i'm not gonna make such a long post to try and prove that point.

Now during this whole thing I haven't once insulted you or said you have no business on here because we disagree, yet you have. Once again telling people how to think. Do I think Montoya is really getting traded to the Yotes? Not really I just threw it out there for fun like this whole thread is supposed to be. All I said was the word rant when u went off on someone else's proposal. Lighten up man this is supposed to be fun.

On Hollweg, yeah he's not a scorer but he is a good energy player and is a great hitter, something I think the Yotes could use on thier bottom lines instead of a player like Sjostrom. Just because a guy doesn't score doesn't mean he has no trade value. Look at my Fedoruk example.

On Sjostrom, you assume I have never seen him play. Your wrong, I have center ice and I try and watch as many games as I can. Some of those are Coyote games. Are the Coyotes a deep team up front like the Rangers that you can say he was burried there or was it he just wansn't good enough to crack the top lines? From actually watching the games and listening to the commentators it seems like he just isnt good enough to hold a spot on the top lines. And how can you compare him to Prucha? They are totally different players and Prucha has 50 goals in two seasons. I don't think Sjostrom has that in 3. Here is Sjostrom's bio at Hockey DB, tell me through his whole career where you see he has 30 goal potential. He put up 34 in the WHL one time. In the AHL he had a hi of 14 goals. I just don't see where you think Sjostrom has 30 goals in him. He has tons of speed which is why I mentioned him in the first place.

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...id%5B%5D=56822


Last edited by Radek27: 06-05-2007 at 05:58 PM. Reason: Forgot
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Old
06-05-2007, 08:40 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Tyutin 51 View Post
only guy i would really want from them is mueller

From Phoenix, Mueller--NEVER !!!!
Otherwise, not much else to offer.

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Old
06-05-2007, 09:39 PM
  #60
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The Bulletin may not be far off. Our first #17 and Montoya for Yotes' #3 and #31 makes some sense.

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06-06-2007, 12:08 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by bobbop View Post
The Bulletin may not be far off. Our first #17 and Montoya for Yotes' #3 and #31 makes some sense.
not bad, for JvR, doesn't sound too bad at all..

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06-06-2007, 10:56 AM
  #62
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Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
Wow all of this because I made a trade proposal. I didn't know it upset you so very much. I rarely make them and now I know why.......it's cause of people like you. I can sit here and list some trades made that if it was posted here you would have said the same thing. Would u think Todd Fedoruk is worth a 2nd round pick? Well he's not but he was traded for one. I also mentioned the Dupuis trade and u just brushed it off. There are others but i'm not gonna make such a long post to try and prove that point.
There's a difference between someone's value at the trade deadline, and in the offseason. At the deadline, people are scrambling to fill needs, therefore players are drastically overpaid for. Would Brendan Witt normally fetch a 1st round draft pick? Better yet, would you give up a 1st round draft pick for Witt, who in reality is more like a #5 defenseman on a good defense corps?

Then what was this...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
Dupuis for Bourret? I bet if this was posted on here before the deadline we would have gotten another one of ur ranting posts.
Now during this whole thing I haven't once insulted you or said you have no business on here because we disagree, yet you have. Once again telling people how to think. Do I think Montoya is really getting traded to the Yotes? Not really I just threw it out there for fun like this whole thread is supposed to be. All I said was the word rant when u went off on someone else's proposal. Lighten up man this is supposed to be fun.

Again, what is this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
Dupuis for Bourret? I bet if this was posted on here before the deadline we would have gotten another one of ur ranting posts.
The hypocricy is just unreal with you man.

Quote:
On Hollweg, yeah he's not a scorer but he is a good energy player and is a great hitter, something I think the Yotes could use on thier bottom lines instead of a player like Sjostrom. Just because a guy doesn't score doesn't mean he has no trade value. Look at my Fedoruk example.
But that means that Hollweg has value? Face it, Hollweg has no potential, and is a fringe NHL player that takes too many dumb penalties, isn't good in either zone, and can't fight. Why do you think Renney benched him for most of the playoffs, as he only played 2 games? What a valuable energy player he was.

Quote:
On Sjostrom, you assume I have never seen him play. Your wrong, I have center ice and I try and watch as many games as I can. Some of those are Coyote games. Are the Coyotes a deep team up front like the Rangers that you can say he was burried there or was it he just wansn't good enough to crack the top lines? From actually watching the games and listening to the commentators it seems like he just isnt good enough to hold a spot on the top lines. And how can you compare him to Prucha? They are totally different players and Prucha has 50 goals in two seasons. I don't think Sjostrom has that in 3. Here is Sjostrom's bio at Hockey DB, tell me through his whole career where you see he has 30 goal potential. He put up 34 in the WHL one time. In the AHL he had a hi of 14 goals. I just don't see where you think Sjostrom has 30 goals in him. He has tons of speed which is why I mentioned him in the first place.

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...id%5B%5D=56822
You apparently don't watch enough of the Coyotes then. Sjostrom was buried in Phoenix, and Phoenix isn't exactly deep at center either. The kid has a boatload of speed, and actually puts in some goals playing on 3rd and 4th lines. He RARELY gets power play time, and isn't a penalty killer either, leaving him with very limited ice time. So, just like Prucha, or any player for that matter, he needs ice time to be effective. I'm not comparing him to Prucha straight up, I said that they have similar situations, where management is not exactly in favor of them.

I'd like to know exactly what Curt and Panger have said about him then, because they actually like the kid from what I've watched on FSN Arizona.

LOL @ having 14 goals in the AHL one year. Since you were on hockeydb, did you forget to look at how bad the Grizz were that year? They were DEAD LAST IN TEAM WINS AND POINTS, with 23 and 53 respectively. I can't believe you would even slam him with that example, that's terrible. It was his 1st full season in the AHL as well, as Phoenix rushed him up to the NHL.

The facts still remain that...

- Sjostrom has more much more value than Hollweg.

- Mueller and Montoya is about even.

- And Phoenix is not going to give up the 3rd overall pick for nothing in return.

If you can't handle the heat in the kitchen, then GTFO man.

"My ranting posts" aren't exactly rants, but moreso me trying to talk sense into people like you.

Don't instigate, and then act like a victim.

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Old
06-06-2007, 11:30 AM
  #63
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Originally Posted by inferno272 View Post
i just.....want.....i mean......

AARRGGHHH


ok, so youre saying, you wouldnt trade a DRAFT PICK, for an existing young star in the making? one who is already just about NHL ready, and has progressed from "unproven" draft pick, to "proven" ahl allstar??

just think about that.

a draft pick has FAR more risk involved with it than an existing star ahler who everyone worth his salt has said is going to be an nhl goalie.

the ONLY reason the Rangers are looking to trade the kid is because we have a franchise young goalie already. if Henrik was say....32 or so, my guess is HE would be the one moved, and Monty brought up. or at the very least monty would be the backup to Henrik and waiting to take over.

ive gotta ask other people....is ducky not making sense to anyone else? or is it just me???


If I'm Phoenix I'm not moving the #3 pick for Montoya either. At this point Montoya is no mor eproven than the #3 overall selection. Come October, both will still be prospects.


The exact position th eRangers are in now, is why I don't think it's a wise move spending a top 5-10 pick on a goalie. You only need one, which lowers the trade value of a goalie, especially one that hasn't proven himself at the highest level.

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Old
06-06-2007, 04:22 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan View Post
If I'm Phoenix I'm not moving the #3 pick for Montoya either. At this point Montoya is no mor eproven than the #3 overall selection. Come October, both will still be prospects.


The exact position th eRangers are in now, is why I don't think it's a wise move spending a top 5-10 pick on a goalie. You only need one, which lowers the trade value of a goalie, especially one that hasn't proven himself at the highest level.
I think this is one reason why I feel goalies are MORE valuable than goal scorers. Because tenders like Hank, Marty, Kipper, Luongo, etc. are pretty hard to find. And Montoya is well on his way to being mentioned with the aforementioned goaltenders. He has what it takes

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06-06-2007, 04:26 PM
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I think this is one reason why I feel goalies are MORE valuable than goal scorers. Because tenders like Hank, Marty, Kipper, Luongo, etc. are pretty hard to find. And Montoya is well on his way to being mentioned with the aforementioned goaltenders. He has what it takes
totally agree. not to mention goaltending is the most important position on the ice all the time.

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06-06-2007, 04:31 PM
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totally agree. not to mention goaltending is the most important position on the ice all the time.
No doubting it, but there's a difference between acquiring goaltending and acquiring proven goaltending. Though I think Montoya will indeed pan out, is taking that risk worth giving up #3 overall?

If it was a proven goalie, then absolutely. But it's not.

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06-06-2007, 05:00 PM
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No doubting it, but there's a difference between acquiring goaltending and acquiring proven goaltending. Though I think Montoya will indeed pan out, is taking that risk worth giving up #3 overall?

If it was a proven goalie, then absolutely. But it's not.
Well, It dfinitely depends on Maloney. He has seen Montoya day in, day out and knows what he will turn into. I think Maloney really likes him and if that is the case, you dont know what he will do. Just because you have the 3rd pick, it doesnt mean that player is going to be a star. Monty was the 6th pick and you caould make the case that he is LESS of a risk than anyone you draft because he has kept up his number on every single level. You have to assume he will be a good as he is in the NHL as the AHL because threw every level of play, he has been pretty much a star goalie. Plus he is further along into his development than any player you will draft, so he can help to turn the franchise around quicker than a draft pick. A draft pick, no matter where is no more of a guarantee than Al Montoya (unless its the likes of a Malkin or Crosby etc.) You could find past draft picks in the early first round that you have never heard of.

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06-06-2007, 05:58 PM
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Originally Posted by motime42 View Post
I think this is one reason why I feel goalies are MORE valuable than goal scorers. Because tenders like Hank, Marty, Kipper, Luongo, etc. are pretty hard to find. And Montoya is well on his way to being mentioned with the aforementioned goaltenders. He has what it takes
A quick look at where the top goalies were drafted:

Brodeur - 20th
DiPietro - 1st
Lundqvist - 205th
Miller - 138th
Kipper - 116th
Luongo - 4th
Turco - 124th
Nabokov - 219th
Giguere - 13th

Average - 93rd

Here are the top 12 or so fowards

Jagr - 5th
Crosby - 1st
Zetterberg - 210th
Forsberg - 6th
Heatley - 2nd
Iginla - 11th
Sakic - 15th
Thornton - 1st
LeCavalier - 1st
Hossa - 12th
Kovalchuk - 1st
Ovechkin - 1st

Avg. - 22nd ... and all but 1 selected in the top half of the 1st round.

Here are the top 3 goalies selected in the 10 drafts from 2002 - 1993.

2002
Lehtonen
C. Ward
Toivonen

2001
Pascal Leclaire
Dan Blackburn
Jason Bacashihua

2000
DiPietro
Brent Krahn
Ilya Bryzgalov - 2nd rd.

1999
Brian Finley
Maxime Ouellet
Ari Ahonen

1998
Patrick DesRochers
Mathieu Chouinard
Philippe Sauve - 2nd round

1997
Luongo
Mika Noronen
Jean-Francois Damphousse

1996
Craig Hillier
Mathieu Garon - 2nd rd
Francis Larivee - 2nd rd

1995
Jean-Sebastien Giguere
Martin Biron
Brian Boucher

1994
Jamie Storr
Eric Fichaud
Evgeni Ryabchikov

1993
Jocelyn Thibault
Tyler Moss - 2nd rd.
Scott Langkow - 2nd rd.

By my count at least 18 complete busts.

3 studs - Luongo, DiPietro and Giggy. ... and 2 others with a chance - Lehtonen and Ward

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