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Does anyone think Turco is in contention for the Vezina this year?

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Old
02-28-2004, 07:20 AM
  #26
Wyvern
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chicpea
I don't think Turco is even in the top 5 to be honest. I like him, but I don't think Turco and Vezina fit in the same sentence this year.
Above him would be:
1. Brodeur
2. Luongo
3. Theodore
4. Kipprusoff
5. Cloutier
6. Raycroft
7. Vokoun
8. Cechmanek
9. Kahbibulin or Grahame
10. Belfour (maybe shoulf be higher up).

Of course this list is not definitive, just off the top of my head. Turco will win one day, just not any day this year.
Broduer winning it last year goes to show that anyone can be a contender for it. If they can reach down to a player that was not even in the Top 10 in several key categories for a selection, they could do it for Turco.

Right now Turco's GAA is better than Broduers, when he won it last year. But Turco also broke a record that stood for 50 years last year, and did not win. So I guess that goes to show that stats not everything.

Howabout Turco playing in all but 3 of the Stars games with a broken foot and injured groin for the last month or so? His 6 shutouts??

Of goalies who have played more than 40 games, Turco is ranked 2nd in GAA.

I think he is definately in the running for the Veznia and/or Hart Trophy. Without Turco, Dallas would not be in the hunt for a playoff spot.

I think he is probably more deserving of the Hart than the Vezina at this point, but there is still quite a bit of hockey to be played.

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Old
02-28-2004, 08:52 AM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sharif
Of course people tried to use that exact same argument against Brodeur last year. What it comes down to is that Turco can't win the Vezina the year he has the best stats in the modern era and can't win the Vezina when he replicates the stats of the goalie who won the Vezina the same year Turco had the best stats in the modern era. It's pretty damn ridiculous if you believed Brodeur deserved it last year and won't even consider Turco this year. That said, while I think last year should have been Turco easily; I don't think he deserves the honor this year despite being great.
Very, very well said.. I also don't think he's the frontrunner by any means, but to say he isn't even a top 10 candidate is plain hilarious..

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Old
02-28-2004, 09:37 AM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Modano = God
I think he is.. especially with Brodeur (30-17-10, 2.01, .916%) and Vokoun (28-22-6, 2.57, .908%) slowing down quite rapidly.

Turco is the sole reason for our "turn around", he ranks 2nd in the league in wins while his team doesn't even rank in the top 10 in terms of victories. The team has given up as many as they've scored, so that says something about his offensive support. He has also played the most games out of any netminder, by far, being on pace for 78 games. Hell, I honestly think he can be considered as a Hart candidate if he keeps this up. Few players have led their team like Turco has so far..

His numbers aren't exactly of 2002/2003 calibre, but solid nonetheless (28-19-11, 2.03, .910%). Quite on par with Brodeurs when he won it last season (2.02, .914%).

He should be a top 5 candidate as of now, with Brodeur, Nabokov, Luongo and Theodore as the others. Then again, Raycroft, Aebischer and such aren't far behind. This ain't as clearcut as last year, thats for sure...
Here we go again M=G, agreeing on something.. With the bias that the NHL fan has against most southern team, Turco is MOST definitely a Vezina candidate.. Here are a few stats..These are with goalies that have played a minimum 30 games.

GAA
Roloson 1.96
Raycroft 1.97
Brodeur 2.02
Turco 2.03
Abs 2.03
Nabakov is 6th
Belfour 7th
Theodore 8th
Luongo 11th

Save
Luongo 935
Roloson 931
Raycroft 930
Abs 927
Nabs 926
Brodeur is 8th
Turco 11th

Wins
Brodeur
Turco
Vokoun
Abs
Cloutier
Luongo is 13th

Shut out
Brodeur
Nabs
Turco
Luogo
Weeks

Not sure why Turco is not included in these people list other than he was the starting goalie in the all star game.. Not sure what he has to do to get some respect...Well see what happens to a Luongo or a Raycroft after they have too fight with mgmt for that next paycheck amount...

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Old
02-28-2004, 09:38 AM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Modano = God
Most of these netminders are about on pace for 55 games. The same number Turco had last season, and no one is even close with the stats he had than. Yet he still didn't win it. Games played appears to be a pretty big factor according to the ones voting, more so than the actual stats. There's only one (!) goalie with a better save% as well as GAA. But he has played in nearly 20 games less in comparison with Turco.

Now tell me again with a straight face how Turco is not even a top 5 candidate, much less not even top 10.
Stars and Wings fans dont agree very often. But since no goalie REALLY stands out among the group, I agree. Broduer will probably win it, which is fine with me. But Luongo's record wont win it. Raycroft will win the Calder and could easily be a Vezina finalist, but I dont think the voters will give him both. So I think the #3 spot is wide open. It could go to any number of guys, and I think Turco is among that group.

So big deal, his Save % isnt extraordinary. But it isnt bad either, and he has easily carried the Stars almost all season long. He will also probably set a new record for games played, which I agree is a stat that voters take heavily into account. Which is why Kipprusoff is out, although I really like him.

I am not saying that Turco should win it...but I think some people need to start giving this guy more respect.

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02-28-2004, 09:40 AM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Modano = God
Very, very well said.. I also don't think he's the frontrunner by any means, but to say he isn't even a top 10 candidate is plain hilarious..
Absolutely...thats been my main sticking point in all of this. Some people dont even have him in their top 10. Which is absolutely rediculous.

But...oh well.

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02-28-2004, 09:45 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Higgy4
Stars and Wings fans dont agree very often. But since no goalie REALLY stands out among the group, I agree. Broduer will probably win it, which is fine with me. But Luongo's record wont win it. Raycroft will win the Calder and could easily be a Vezina finalist, but I dont think the voters will give him both. So I think the #3 spot is wide open. It could go to any number of guys, and I think Turco is among that group.

So big deal, his Save % isnt extraordinary. But it isnt bad either, and he has easily carried the Stars almost all season long. He will also probably set a new record for games played, which I agree is a stat that voters take heavily into account. Which is why Kipprusoff is out, although I really like him.

I am not saying that Turco should win it...but I think some people need to start giving this guy more respect.
Thanks Higgy.. And we know that this is from a man that has seen some of the best, Hasek and some of the worst, Osgood....lol at Osgood... LOL..

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Old
02-28-2004, 09:50 AM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Don_Cherry
Can't believe Raycroft is so highly rated. I like him, he's had a strong year but Vezina candidate? I've been far more impressed by Dipietro on an injury riddled Islanders team than Raycroft.

Luongo is my pick though, he's been the best goaltender in the league this year. Marty a close 2nd.
You, my friend, have not been watching the Bruins this year.

I'm a big Stars fan, and I still wouldn't say right now that Turco is a Vezina finalist. If he has a strong finish then maybe, but for now I'd say now. On a losing team, if Roberto Luongo can somehow get 30 wins, then he'd be my pick. Based on the numbers, Raycroft should be in the top five.

Right now, it's up in the air as far as Vezina finalists.

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02-28-2004, 09:57 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DallasStars2003
You, my friend, have not been watching the Bruins this year.

I'm a big Stars fan, and I still wouldn't say right now that Turco is a Vezina finalist. If he has a strong finish then maybe, but for now I'd say now. On a losing team, if Roberto Luongo can somehow get 30 wins, then he'd be my pick. Based on the numbers, Raycroft should be in the top five.

Right now, it's up in the air as far as Vezina finalists.

Raycroft yes.. Luongo no

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Old
02-28-2004, 11:03 AM
  #34
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Modano=God et al., all very good points. I especially agree about Turco last year with his save%. Playing on a broken foot is admirable I guess, but it shouldn't count towards a vezina. If he wins, I'll be the first to admit I was wrong (he had another strong game last night too I think?) but I'm holding my horses for now. As for his team being too streaky, I guess the same could be said for the Habs when Theo won.

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02-28-2004, 01:07 PM
  #35
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personally i don't think his play has dropped off from last season so much as the team in front of him. through january they were - ok defensively, somewhere between calgary and st. louis in goals-against, but terrible offensively - somewhere between carolina and calgary (the bad side of calgary - yikes!)

turco's upturn in stats lately is due in large part to the team picking up confidence and offense.

the sad fact of this league is that team success has a lot to do with a goalie's statistics, and as good as turco is his team can drag him down. witness luongo, he is amazing to watch in that shooting gallery of the panthers net but because he won't have 35-40 wins he probably won't be considered for vezina.

personally i think turco will be a candidate in the near future and statistics aside he is one of the better goalies this season, my top-ten for sure.

vezina? not a chance.

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02-28-2004, 02:02 PM
  #36
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I dont think so.

My top 20!
RK - PLAYER - TOTAL - TEAM
1 - ROBERTO LUONGO - 0,980 - FLO
2 - DAVID AEBISCHER - 0,960 - COL
3 - JOSE THEODORE - 0,953 - MON
4 - MARTIN BRODEUR - 0,952 - NJD
5 - ANDREW RAYCROFT - 0,951 - BOS
6 - EVGENI NABOKOV - 0,946 - SAN
7 - MARTY TURCO - 0,945 - DAL
8 - TOMAS VOKOUN - 0,942 - NAS
9 - DAN CLOUTIER - 0,940 - VAN
10 - MARC DENIS - 0,939 - CLB
11 - DWAYNE ROLOSON - 0,939 - MIN
12 - OLAF KOLZIG - 0,937 - WAS
13 - KEVIN WEEKES - 0,934 - CAR
14 - ED BELFOUR - 0,933 - TOR
15 - PASI NURMINEN - 0,929 - ATL
16 - CHRIS OSGOOD - 0,924 - STL
17 - RICK DIPIETRO - 0,923 - NYI
18 - SEAN BURKE - 0,921 - PHI
19 - NIKOLAI KHABIBULIN - 0,920 - TAM
20 - MARTIN BIRON - 0,920 - BUF

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02-28-2004, 02:13 PM
  #37
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He'll be up there, but his bad start to the season didn't help any. I doubt he'll be in serious contention, but he'll be looked at certainly. He's been the Stars MVP this season and a large reason why they're still holding a playoff spot right now.
Brodeur's the usual favourite. Luongo's crazyass number of shots faced and high save percentage garners attention. Theodore hasn't been as consistent as the former two, but has been solid nonetheless in a bounceback season. Aeibischer should be looked at, but due to his young age and it being his first season, I don't think he'll get it.

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Old
02-28-2004, 03:46 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wyvern
Broduer winning it last year goes to show that anyone can be a contender for it. If they can reach down to a player that was not even in the Top 10 in several key categories for a selection, they could do it for Turco.
I think you over-generalise. Last year shows they will reach down to the average levels statistically *if the goalie has been a longtime overlooked Vezina winner*. Brodeur surely should have won a Vezina before last year, but circumstances had conspired against him.

They won't reach down for just anybody. Will they reach down for Turco, based on last year? It's a possibility, I can see a nomination, especially if he finishes up the year well.

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02-28-2004, 07:18 PM
  #39
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The only reason people overlook Turco was the poor start to Dallas' year. Since the 20-game mark Turco has been one of the best in the league. I realize that carrying your team while injured with no real back-up doesn't count in vezina voting, but without Turco, the Stars wouldn't even be in playoff contention.

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02-28-2004, 08:13 PM
  #40
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personaly i think vezina voting is like oscar voting, so slanted i simply do not care aboot it.

in 01-02 roy kept his team alive and on top the division when they had probably the franchise's worst goal-scoring slump in like eight years. drury, hejduk, and tanguay were all stinking it up, and forsberg was in traction. only captain joe, it seemed, scored any goals during prolonged stretches of the season.

and by stinking it up i meant not scoring like usual, they weren't _that_ bad...

theodore was the sentimental pick. and he was in montreal.

turco has been outstanding. to dallas fans concerned aboot vezina voting, i say this: rest easy with the knowledge that turco is an excellent, young goalie who will only be cheaper if he doesn't win any hardware.

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Old
02-28-2004, 08:37 PM
  #41
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Yes, how could he not, he's currently 2nd in the NHL in wins.

1. Brodeur
2. Turco
3. Vokoun

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