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Hartnell & Timonen off to the Flyers

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Old
06-18-2007, 02:49 PM
  #26
Olaf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by burnlikestars View Post
I dont care what anyone says, we needed to resign Hartnell. Im sad about this one.
Yep, my favorite Pred. Sure he took some idiot penalties ...but he was the best mix of skill and grit we have ever had. Our PP was a lot better when he was healthy..
Nice fella too..
Good luck Harts......

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Old
06-18-2007, 02:51 PM
  #27
jstreet
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Originally Posted by nomorekids View Post
I agree, but even before the sale, HT said that he had heard the team wanted no part of resigning Hartnell.
well I would at least feel a little better knowing we were getting someone decent in return to fill those holes, but my confidence in our future has been shot.

I guess it was good work for Trader Dave to get a draft pick out of some UFA's.

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06-18-2007, 02:53 PM
  #28
Seth Lake
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Personally, I didn't honestly expect either to be resigned. Timonen was going to command major money for many years on the free agent market and Hartnell was going to be sought after by all 30 NHL teams and was going to have his price driven way up.

I would have liked to keep Hartnell, but obviously with the contract numbers that we see him signed for here (and we know if he hit the open market...he could have gotten more)...I'm not too upset about us losing him and using the $10+ million of cap room elsewhere.

Timonen wasn't really in the long-term plans of the team IMO. With the emergence of our young core (Weber, Hamhuis, Suter) and with our defensive prospects knocking on the door, I don't think that they wanted to commit to Kimmo long-term at the money he was asking for.

Overall we got our first-round pick and Matt Elison (that trade last week for future considerations...which were to probably negotiate with the pair of Predators and the first-rounder was because they have signed) for two guys that were going to be lost for nothing in 12 days.

I'm not honestly upset at all by this move, nor am I elated either...but I think it was a smart move by Poile to recoup something for these assets that were his for only so much longer. I'm still not back in Nashville, but this is going to have many people upset in the Music City I'm sure.

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06-18-2007, 02:56 PM
  #29
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I feel sorry for you guys...First the fear of your team leaving, and now this move...Whats happening to the whole organization...its not like you guys got the Flyer's pick too.

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Old
06-18-2007, 02:58 PM
  #30
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Not to get off topic, but who becomes Captain now that Timonen is gone?

Sullivan? Arnott? Tootoo

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Old
06-18-2007, 02:59 PM
  #31
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Looks like a crummy deal on paper to me. Rented Forsberg. Then sent off two more players to get the pick back. Of course, if they legitimately were not even going to sign either of them then the deal isn't AWFUL, but it seems pretty bad. The actions of a lameduck franchise.

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Old
06-18-2007, 02:59 PM
  #32
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And what is the best part about all of this? This doesn't count as Balsillie's move, since technically Leipold still owns the team. The NHL would have expected a good faith effort from Balsillie. So, he intentionally submits the sale document and relocation document at the same time to make sure the NHL holds off talks. Meanwhile, Leipold can still control the team, therefore gutting the team to "make it work" since he's still the owner. He has to assume he'll own the team. And Balsillie gets out of the good faith effort bit. He'll take control after all the good free agents have been signed. Just watch, every single move will be for building a team for Hamilton.

In the end, we're the ones getting screwed here. That and the guys like Arnott and Vokoun, who signed long term deals to stay with a contender and a city they like to live in.

This will of course bring the grim reality to Nashville even more, as people realize the dismantling.

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06-18-2007, 02:59 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nomorekids View Post
I agree, but even before the sale, HT said that he had heard the team wanted no part of resigning Hartnell.
certainly logically this makes sense. There is no way we were going to sign Kimmo for 6.3 for 6 yrs [overpayment in both dollars and years as far as I am concerned] and Hartnell for 4.2 for 6 yrs with what I have told you I heard before.

So, in my head, I say good job Poile....but when you feel at every turn there is a sh|t sandwich, things start looking like a turd.

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Old
06-18-2007, 03:02 PM
  #34
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Really unfortunate the way things are going down for you guys. Sucks that your team is going to be gutted, because of the sale. At least you guys got a pick.

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Old
06-18-2007, 03:03 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by McNasty View Post
Really unfortunate the way things are going down for you guys. Sucks that your team is going to be gutted, because of the sale. At least you guys got a pick.
Yeah, but it would've been better if it had been Philly's pick and not Nashville's original pick.

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06-18-2007, 03:05 PM
  #36
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In my opinion the GM is trying to make the franchise as bad as possible on purpose...Like did you guys even get anything in return other than your old first round pick (which isnt that great)

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06-18-2007, 03:21 PM
  #37
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How is this perceived by the casual fan base in Nashville?

Knowledgable fans understood Hartnell and Timonen were just about guarenteed to be gone July 1st. I'd be concerned about the more casual or non-fan perceptions though that this looks like a firesale.

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Old
06-18-2007, 03:37 PM
  #38
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Unfortunately, perception is reality and the perception in the broad hockey world will probably be a firesale. I personally think this was a good move by Poile. Chances seemed slim to none that either of them would have returned to the Predators had they hit the open market. It's not too often that teams get any compensation for loosing free agents. I think the true test of this franchise's commitment to winning, or lack of, will be what it does in the free agent market.

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Old
06-18-2007, 03:39 PM
  #39
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My perception is the casual fans are the ones most affected. They have seen a team run on the cheap before and when they sense it I predict they will be repelled, as they should be.
Between that and the bad PR moves the evil one has acted out (Copps deal, Hamilton ticket drive, submitting for relo) , damage control will be difficult if not impossible. I don't think the corporate drive can make up for the potential canceled individual season tickets this will generate.

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Old
06-18-2007, 03:41 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gds_wizard View Post
My perception is the casual fans are the ones most affected. They have seen a team run on the cheap before and when they sense it I predict they will be repelled, as they should be.
Between that and the bad PR moves the evil one has acted out (Copps deal, Hamilton ticket drive, submitting for relo) , damage control will be difficult if not impossible. I don't think the corporate drive can make up for the potential canceled individual season tickets this will generate.
The only hope is that the season ticket holder is typically more versed in what goes on in hockey, and sees this for what it is, rather than the urge to think "firesale."

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Old
06-18-2007, 04:16 PM
  #41
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The most disturbing thing is what is a real defenseman going to cost if the Flyers gave Kimmo 6.3 a year.

Holy crap of an overpayment. They'll be regretting that one.

Hartnell i'll miss. But 4.2 is still a bit high.

I'm only disappointed in so much as I liked Hartnell as a player probably more than his actualy contributions to the team.



I think it was a great move to get a 1st rounder back.

IMHO, I dont really want to see a big splash. Lets go get some grit for the 3rd and the 4th line and roll with that.

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06-18-2007, 04:53 PM
  #42
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you guys act like the world is coming to an end. who is to say that nashville doesn't go out now and sign briere, drury or smyth.

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06-18-2007, 04:55 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by shortfuze View Post
you guys act like the world is coming to an end. who is to say that nashville doesn't go out now and sign briere, drury or smyth.
no, WE aren't acting that way. most of us are happy to get something for two guys that none of us expected to be back. it's fans not familiar with that fact, coming on and singing the "Firesale!" song that are predicting the worlds end.

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06-18-2007, 04:55 PM
  #44
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In my opinion the GM is trying to make the franchise as bad as possible on purpose...Like did you guys even get anything in return other than your old first round pick (which isnt that great)
how can they get anything back. they were lucky to get what they got. philly could have waited a couple of weeks and signed them and gave up nothing. but nashville got lucky and got the pick back.

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Old
06-18-2007, 05:01 PM
  #45
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how can they get anything back. they were lucky to get what they got. philly could have waited a couple of weeks and signed them and gave up nothing. but nashville got lucky and got the pick back.
Philly paid for the fact that they got first shot at Hartnell and Timonen. If the trade wasn't made, every team would have an equal shot at them.

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Old
06-18-2007, 05:10 PM
  #46
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Several things:

1) Very interesting set of circumstances. This type of thing doesn't happen very often. The days of trading for soon to be free agents expired when the automatic compensation was ended.

2) The Flyers are becoming Nashville Jr.....only with a lot more money to play around with.

3) The Forsberg trade was definitely a mistake (a very very costly one at that), but it is a mistake that I will always be happy that we made. The chance to watch Forsberg, who has always been my favorite player, is a treat I will never forget.

4) We likely would not have resigned either. I still think we might have had a chance at Hartnell before the change in ownership news hit the fan.

5) 4.2 million a year for Hartnell is just way to high. I'm sure that he will come close to earning it, but he definitely does not deserve the raise at this point.

6) 6 years for Kimmo Timonen is just too many. Add in that he will be making 6.3 million a year. Yikes!

7) Both Hartnell and Kimmo should excel in the Eastern Conference which generally features less defensive minded/defensively strong teams than the Western Conference.

8) I hate Jim Balsille.

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Old
06-18-2007, 05:13 PM
  #47
darth5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nomorekids View Post
no, WE aren't acting that way. most of us are happy to get something for two guys that none of us expected to be back. it's fans not familiar with that fact, coming on and singing the "Firesale!" song that are predicting the worlds end.
I am glad we got something for nothing, don't get me wrong. They were so outta here anyway, I am not sure if CL would have kept them if this all hadn't come up at any rate. I was commenting on the Average Joe fan's likely perception of it. Don't ask me to pretend to be doofus happy as it all unravels before my eyes, having watched the team get slowly built into a quality product.

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Old
06-18-2007, 05:19 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by shortfuze View Post
you guys act like the world is coming to an end. who is to say that nashville doesn't go out now and sign briere, drury or smyth.
Poile

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Old
06-18-2007, 05:19 PM
  #49
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Post on NP.com from a News Channel 5 guy suggests that a link to a Poile interview will be posted later. He said that Poile told reporters that the team is going forth assuming Craig Leipold is the owner. Leipold wants to cut the roster in attempt to cut losses. Furthermore, talks are difficult due to ownership/relocation issues (no @#%??). Kariya unlikely to resign at this point to due gutting of the team.

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Old
06-18-2007, 05:20 PM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by triggrman View Post
Poile as commanded by Leipold, who is commanded by Balsillie.
Fixed.

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