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Old
07-17-2007, 09:38 AM
  #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr. View Post
Easy. Not trade for Lindros.
The risk trading for Lindros was big considering his health but Lindros still had all the tools and still put up nearly a 40 goal season in NY. The fact the team around LIndros in NY and the fact that the pressure was so big didnt help him.

Sather has done far,far worse than this trade.

Lindros was a great player and still had one very good year in NYC.

Cant be the worst thing he has done!!!

It has to be the Holik deal or Huge Specimen, he didnt exactly get alot for Alexi Kovalev during the team purge either!!!

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07-17-2007, 09:54 AM
  #27
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by the way Inferno, good thread. Really original!!!

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07-17-2007, 10:00 AM
  #28
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going by our current scenario, malik way too much for a sasquatch siteing when most who have seen sasquatch saw him for free.
Of course some dink had to bring this one up.

Yeah its his worst move

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07-17-2007, 10:05 AM
  #29
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For me its either bringing Messier back for the second go-round, or drafting Jessiman. Jessiman is a little too easy to second-guess since is a draft pick so I'm going to go with Messier.

Messier's presence ******** the rebuilding process by a few years, and it tarnished his legacy IMO.

I won't criticize any of the moves right before the lockout because they A) represented a desperately-needed change in organizational philosophy and B) showed the foresight of clearing cap space before there even was a cap.

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07-17-2007, 10:09 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
1) Mike York for Tom Poti

1a) Zidlicky for Dunham
1 isn't as big a deal to me as it once was because York has turned out to be a fringe player, even though Poti is/was a joke.

1a definitely stings though. We needed a goalie at the time but Dunham ended up sucking and Zidlicky is exactly the player we could use right now. Rather than undoing that trade, I'd undo low-balling Zidlicky so that he wasn't willing to come over.

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07-17-2007, 10:11 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by NYRJurgen88 View Post
The risk trading for Lindros was big considering his health but Lindros still had all the tools and still put up nearly a 40 goal season in NY. The fact the team around LIndros in NY and the fact that the pressure was so big didnt help him.

Sather has done far,far worse than this trade.

Lindros was a great player and still had one very good year in NYC.

Cant be the worst thing he has done!!!

It has to be the Holik deal or Huge Specimen, he didnt exactly get alot for Alexi Kovalev during the team purge either!!!
Agreed. Lindros carried this team for stretches. And it's not as if they would have rebuilt had Sather not made that trade.

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07-17-2007, 10:20 AM
  #32
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Originally Posted by JohnnyChoice View Post
1 isn't as big a deal to me as it once was because York has turned out to be a fringe player, even though Poti is/was a joke.

1a definitely stings though. We needed a goalie at the time but Dunham ended up sucking and Zidlicky is exactly the player we could use right now. Rather than undoing that trade, I'd undo low-balling Zidlicky so that he wasn't willing to come over.
I think the tough thing with this thread is looking at Sather's without the benefit of hindsight. York might have turned out to be a fringe player, but there is nothing to say he would have had he stayed with the Rangers.

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07-17-2007, 10:23 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr. View Post
Easy. Not trade for Lindros.
easily my least favorite move..hated lindros

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07-17-2007, 10:30 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
I think the tough thing with this thread is looking at Sather's without the benefit of hindsight. York might have turned out to be a fringe player, but there is nothing to say he would have had he stayed with the Rangers.
Thats true. Even if they were set on trading York, his value at the time was such that there were probably other options out there besides Tom Poti.

Thats why I picked the Messier return though, draft picks are too easy to look at in hindsight, but bringing Messier back was clearly living in the past. Compunded by the minutes he was playing while the team got smoked by younger, faster, hungrier competition was just painful to watch.

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Old
07-17-2007, 10:35 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by mike14 View Post
It's a tough one but I'll say hiring Trottier
hiring Ron Low

as far as trades, trading Johnsson

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Old
07-17-2007, 10:37 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by RCallahan43 View Post
hiring Ron Low

as far as trades, trading Johnsson
Ugh. Trottier and Ron Low were both god awful.

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Old
07-17-2007, 10:39 AM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYRJurgen88 View Post
The risk trading for Lindros was big considering his health but Lindros still had all the tools and still put up nearly a 40 goal season in NY. The fact the team around LIndros in NY and the fact that the pressure was so big didnt help him.

Sather has done far,far worse than this trade.

Lindros was a great player and still had one very good year in NYC.

Cant be the worst thing he has done!!!
I don't think the fact that Lindros had a few good stretches means that something positive came out of the trade. The bottom line is, Sather paid a hefty price and the result was not an improved team. That was the goal after all.

At the risk of departing from infensus' thread concept, imagine for a moment what else could have been done with the assets that were dealt for Lindros. At very least, he could have onto those assets and achieved the same pitiful results, although a blue line featuring Kim Johnnson couldn't have been nearly as sad as 6 pylons that mailed it in nightly in his absence.

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Old
07-17-2007, 10:41 AM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyChoice View Post
Thats true. Even if they were set on trading York, his value at the time was such that there were probably other options out there besides Tom Poti.

Thats why I picked the Messier return though, draft picks are too easy to look at in hindsight, but bringing Messier back was clearly living in the past. Compunded by the minutes he was playing while the team got smoked by younger, faster, hungrier competition was just painful to watch.
Sorry Johnny, I wasn't talking to you in particular. More in general.

And I agree that York's value (especially to the Rangers at that time) was worth more than Poti.

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Old
07-17-2007, 10:50 AM
  #39
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Originally Posted by MSG the place to be View Post
I think the entire deadline maneuvering before the lockout was a bust.
Guys we acquired who have played for us...

Rachunek
Balej
McAllister
Liffiton
Immonen
Kondratiev
Markannen
Betts


We gave up a boatload of talent in Leetch, nedved, barnaby, simon, kovalev, rucinsky, de vries.

.
You missed Marcel Hossa from MTL.
Leetch should be dealt. Him and Mess retirement are the two key moves that were very much necessary. The rest should have been kept, I agree, although Rachunek was good acquisition and we should not let him go esp. to Devils.

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Old
07-17-2007, 10:52 AM
  #40
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You missed Marcel Hossa from MTL.
Leetch should be dealt. Him and Mess retirement are the two key moves that were very much necessary. The rest should have been kept, I agree, although Rachunek was good acquisition and we should not let him go esp. to Devils.
Hossa didn't come during the purge. He was acquired in the preseason for Garth Murray.

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07-17-2007, 10:55 AM
  #41
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The worst move was actually his first. Choosing NOT to sign Schneider when Schneider wanted to stay a Ranger, and signing Malakhov instead to take his place.
The value (?) he got for Leetch is up there, too.

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Old
07-17-2007, 11:05 AM
  #42
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Surprised i haven't heard anything on the Kaspiritus Front.....

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Old
07-17-2007, 11:08 AM
  #43
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Surprised i haven't heard anything on the Kaspiritus Front.....
Why? All he did was spend money for Kasparaitus. He didn't trade away anything to get him.

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07-17-2007, 11:38 AM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr. View Post
I don't think the fact that Lindros had a few good stretches means that something positive came out of the trade. The bottom line is, Sather paid a hefty price and the result was not an improved team. That was the goal after all.

At the risk of departing from infensus' thread concept, imagine for a moment what else could have been done with the assets that were dealt for Lindros. At very least, he could have onto those assets and achieved the same pitiful results, although a blue line featuring Kim Johnnson couldn't have been nearly as sad as 6 pylons that mailed it in nightly in his absence.
Brendl sucks, Hlavac sucks and Johnsson was a 40 pt. defenseman for three years. Thats not such a hefty price for a legit first line center, which Lindros was until he got injured.

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07-17-2007, 11:47 AM
  #45
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Brendl sucks, Hlavac sucks and Johnsson was a 40 pt. defenseman for three years. Thats not such a hefty price for a legit first line center, which Lindros was until he got injured.
Again, that is all with the benefit of hindsight. Brendl was still a top prospect when the Lindros trade was made. Hlavac was coming off a career season.


I think they did overpay for a guy who was not terrible coveted because of injuries and the fact he wanted to get paid on his reputation, not on his production.

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07-17-2007, 11:52 AM
  #46
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Again, that is all with the benefit of hindsight. Brendl was still a top prospect when the Lindros trade was made. Hlavac was coming off a career season.


I think they did overpay for a guy who was not terrible coveted because of injuries and the fact he wanted to get paid on his reputation, not on his production.
Fair enough, but I doubt the first line center without the history of injury was out there for that package at the time. It's not as if Sather had the choice between Sakic, Modano and Lindros. Aside from getting picks and young players, which should have been the organizational MO, I don't see what else Sather could have got for those three that would have been better.

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07-17-2007, 11:54 AM
  #47
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Trading Cullen to Carolina. Sorry couldn't resist.

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Old
07-17-2007, 11:54 AM
  #48
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Fair enough, but I doubt the first line center without the history of injury was out there for that package at the time. It's not as if Sather had the choice between Sakic, Modano and Lindros. Aside from getting picks and young players, which should have been the organizational MO, I don't see what else Sather could have got for those three that would have been better.
I don't disagree that there were other options out there. But Sather didn't really HAVE to do anything.

And going back to that time, I think there would have been a decent market for those three guys.

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07-17-2007, 11:55 AM
  #49
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The Pavel Bure trade. Granted it didn't work outfor both sides, but I keep finding myself thinking, dang, if we had that 10th pick we could have had semin.

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07-17-2007, 12:03 PM
  #50
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Brendl sucks, Hlavac sucks and Johnsson was a 40 pt. defenseman for three years. Thats not such a hefty price for a legit first line center, which Lindros was until he got injured.
Now we have the benefit of hindsight. The value of those 3 players then is certainly a lot higher than it was a year later. Honestly, keeping Hlavac and Johnsson seemed, and still seems, like a better gamble for success than acquiring Eric.

Lindros WAS injured at the time of the trade and hadn't/hasn't performed up to "legit first line center" standards since the late 90's.

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