The Business of HockeyDiscuss the financial and business aspects of the NHL. Franchise sales, valuations, TV contracts, ratings, expansion, relocation, the CBA and work stoppage discussion goes here.
NHL wants to cut salary costs, longer term CBA; NHLPA does not (CBA negotiations)
Players wouldn't take much of a hit as revenues would rise overtime and unless my math is wrong they'd end up with the same money they are making now probably by the 3rd-4th year.
The players definitely took issue to a 7% drop right away, but a temporary drop like the players offered is out of the question.
Players wouldn't take much of a hit as revenues would rise overtime and unless my math is wrong they'd end up with the same money they are making now probably by the 3rd-4th year.
The players definitely took issue to a 7% drop right away, but a temporary drop like the players offered is out of the question.
I expected the NHLPA to offer that lesser rollback of rates as a counteroffer to the NHL's latest offer instead of resubmitting the same offer with a few changes
I expected the NHLPA to offer that lesser rollback of rates as a counteroffer to the NHL's latest offer instead of resubmitting the same offer with a few changes
agreed, I dont like how the NHLPA essentially ignored the NHL's offer instead of just focusing on the subject the NHL wanted to focus on first.
It was 54% when the lockout ended. The players offered the players the incentive of increasing their share IF revenues grew (and in a range fomr 54% up to 57% after $2.7 billion was surpassed). Well, revenues grew.
It's not the players fault that the owners were too dumb to figure out that their system was inflationary and that aggregate revenues used as the basis for a cap range was ill-conceived. They rammed this down the players throats.
I agree the owners played hardball last time to get the linkage system in place - but they had to negotiate significantly to get that done, and part of the 54-57% was that negotiation. I guess my point is that the owners didn't "get everything they wanted" when the current CBA was agreed to. They definetely got their way with the general framework (aka - linkage), but the devil is in the details and there was a lot of negotiations around those points.
I think that lambasting the owners for not being able to predict the future 6 years in advance is pretty silly by taking advantage of 20/20 hindsight. Predicting a volative business model like the NHL over that period of time is incredibly difficult, especially when inputs like the strength of the canadian dollar, and ATL vs WINN are so impactful on the calculation.
I'm not saying the owners did a good job - just that you're making it sound like they're stupid for not being able to project a very signficant renenue growth, and be able to identify which markets would see that growth.
That's the real issue IMO. For the owners to get this right, they would have had to be able to accurately forecast what the small market revenue growth would be. If a greater percentage of the revenue growth occured at the small markets, the NHL would probably would be OK right now.
Last edited by Beukeboom Fan: 09-04-2012 at 04:00 PM.
agreed, I dont like how the NHLPA essentially ignored the NHL's offer instead of just focusing on the subject the NHL wanted to focus on first.
I agree with this and why did it take them so long? Its obvious both sides need to bend here but, the principle of the matter is many teams are losing money so something has to change.
I expected the NHLPA to offer that lesser rollback of rates as a counteroffer to the NHL's latest offer instead of resubmitting the same offer with a few changes
That is pretty much my beef with the PA right now: they are refusing to negotiate.
Obviously the players have their own issues they want addressed, but unfortunately for them the owners are the ones who set the agenda since they're the ones with the money. By refusing to address something the NHL wants to change, the PA is effectively stalling.
It's most likely a good tactic but it sure is lame.
That is pretty much my beef with the PA right now: they are refusing to negotiate.
Obviously the players have their own issues they want addressed, but unfortunately for them the owners are the ones who set the agenda since they're the ones with the money. By refusing to address something the NHL wants to change, the PA is effectively stalling.
It's most likely a good tactic but it sure is lame.
Disagree on it being a good tactic, if you define "good" that it increases the NHLPA's chances of a favorable settlement.
Let's say worst case - the players refuse to negotiate, and we lose another year of hockey. In probably 20 markets, the team would probably lose less money not operating than operating under the current agreement. Teams like TOR, MON, & NYR are obviously pissed, but they can take the long term view and are in position to benefit if the payroll % comes down, even if revenue sharing increases. On the other hand, the players are out approximately a collective $1.6B ($3.3B x 50%). That's lost money that is going away and never coming back.
I just don't see a positive end game for the players. What can Fehr tell the players that would make them think that this is winnable fight? Probably playing up the pride/ego aspect as professional atheletes are likely hyper-competitive and want to "win". That's why I felt like the original NHL offer was poorly thought out, because it made it seem like the NHL was trying to destroy the NHLPA, and not just the typical negotiation ploy of the lowball offer right from the bat. Experienced negotiators know the initial offer is crap, but the NHL players don't, and I think the NHL gave Fehr the ammo he needed to strengthen his position.
Christine Byers
@ChristineDByers
Former #stlblues player Chris Pronger "guarantees" NHL season won't start on time during annual St. Louis Police Foundation luncheon.
Disagree on it being a good tactic, if you define "good" that it increases the NHLPA's chances of a favorable settlement.
Let's say worst case - the players refuse to negotiate, and we lose another year of hockey. In probably 20 markets, the team would probably lose less money not operating than operating under the current agreement. Teams like TOR, MON, & NYR are obviously pissed, but they can take the long term view and are in position to benefit if the payroll % comes down, even if revenue sharing increases. On the other hand, the players are out approximately a collective $1.6B ($3.3B x 50%). That's lost money that is going away and never coming back.
I just don't see a positive end game for the players. What can Fehr tell the players that would make them think that this is winnable fight? Probably playing up the pride/ego aspect as professional atheletes are likely hyper-competitive and want to "win". That's why I felt like the original NHL offer was poorly thought out, because it made it seem like the NHL was trying to destroy the NHLPA, and not just the typical negotiation ploy of the lowball offer right from the bat. Experienced negotiators know the initial offer is crap, but the NHL players don't, and I think the NHL gave Fehr the ammo he needed to strengthen his position.
Individually the owners might believe they can afford to lose a season, but you have to think they are weary of doing so. The NHL has been getting a lot of goodwill around the US and this kind of stuff could really damage the brand: I'm on the side that overall, in anything other than very short team (a year or two), a lockout at this time would be disastrous for the growth of the league, which is, IMO, by far the most important thing for the League (but not the individual owners of course)
hope there is a roll back so ovechkin can back up his talk, just like if there is no more olympics for nhl players i hope he walks the walk with his take my puck and go home.
hope there is a roll back so ovechkin can back up his talk, just like if there is no more olympics for nhl players i hope he walks the walk with his take my puck and go home.
We already did the goon league thing. Personally I liked the 80s but when you lose euro you will lose the skill of the game.
)
