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Spezza has "requested" a move (All Spezza Discussion Here) Part II

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Old
06-21-2014, 12:00 PM
  #1076
SpezDispenser
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Originally Posted by kimzey59 View Post
I'm not saying I wouldn't move a 1st for him; but quit acting like this is an isolated trade. The Bouwmeester and Miller trades have depleted our pool a bit and giving up yet another 1st is a pretty big piece to give up. I'd move the 1st for Spezza but the rest of the trade has to be for the right pieces. We can't just keep giving our top end prospects away.
I don't mean to sound callous...but that's your problem, not ours. This is a pretty substantial piece we're offering here.

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06-21-2014, 12:00 PM
  #1077
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If I could, I would do a trade for:

Rattie + Jaskin + 21st + STL 2nd

Sets us up for a good 2015 pick, we need the elite talent.

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06-21-2014, 12:02 PM
  #1078
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Originally Posted by SpezDispenser View Post
I'd never question our amateur scouts on a prospect, but I'd personally rather have Rattie or Jaskin. We'll see...

I don't believe that though, I think St.Louis is smarter than to haggle over 10 spots in a weak draft.
I bet that's our first serious offer, but there is plenty of time before the draft and the offer will definitely improve. It's how negotiations go.

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06-21-2014, 12:03 PM
  #1079
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Originally Posted by Hemmer Time View Post
If I could, I would do a trade for:

Rattie + Jaskin + 21st + STL 2nd

Sets us up for a good 2015 pick, we need the elite talent.
Please have some faith in our team man. We played a strong, sound game without Spezza in the lockout year and this team will be constructed to come at you in waves with heavy forechecking and a strong cycle game.

Don't get caught up in looking at individual points for players all the time, let MacLean get back to what he did in the years he was nominated, then won the Adams.

You add Berglund and then you either acquire another top 9 via trade, or you're active in free agency and this team is young and hungry enough to compete every single night.

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06-21-2014, 12:04 PM
  #1080
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Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
I bet that's our first serious offer, but there is plenty of time before the draft and the offer will definitely improve. It's how negotiations go.
Maybe, but you likely were told what we want - and you don't want to push Murray toward Anaheim IMO.

I bet it's a rebuttal to Murray asking for Schwartz - like...if you want to play that game, here's our offer.

But, I don't know much about Milli Vannilli to be honest.

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06-21-2014, 12:04 PM
  #1081
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemmer Time View Post
If I could, I would do a trade for:

Rattie + Jaskin + 21st + STL 2nd

Sets us up for a good 2015 pick, we need the elite talent.
I highly doubt we're giving up both Rattie and Jaskin. It's one or the other as part of a package with Berglund. You're better off with that anyway.


Last edited by Vladys Gumption: 06-21-2014 at 12:25 PM.
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Old
06-21-2014, 12:06 PM
  #1082
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemmer Time View Post
If I could, I would do a trade for:

Rattie + Jaskin + 21st + STL 2nd

Sets us up for a good 2015 pick, we need the elite talent.
That's a more attractive offer. Essentially taking a gamble that one of Rattie, Jaskin, the 1st, or the 2nd will turn out to be a decent NHL hockey player.

I'd much prefer this deal over the proposed Berglund+Rattie+1st deal. Still don't like it, but it's not terrible.

Berglund is a complete waste of space for the Senators, I don't see any value in adding him to our team whatsoever. We aren't going to be in the playoffs for the next few years (and if we do make it somehow, we'll get smoked), what's the point?

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06-21-2014, 12:09 PM
  #1083
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Originally Posted by Sureves View Post
That's a more attractive offer. Essentially taking a gamble that one of Rattie, Jaskin, the 1st, or the 2nd will turn out to be a decent NHL hockey player.

I'd much prefer this deal over the proposed Berglund+Rattie+1st deal. Still don't like it, but it's not terrible.

Berglund is a complete waste of space for the Senators, I don't see any value in adding him to our team whatsoever. We aren't going to be in the playoffs for the next few years (and if we do make it somehow, we'll get smoked), what's the point?
Barf.

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06-21-2014, 12:15 PM
  #1084
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Originally Posted by SpezDispenser View Post
Barf.
You really think the Sens have a chance at making the playoffs in the near future?

MacArthur-Turris-Ryan
Michalek-Zibanejad-Stone
Condra-Lazar-Greening
Hoffman-Smith-Neil

Methot-Karlsson
Ceci-Cowen
Gryba-Phillips

Anderson
Lehner

That's an atrocious hockey team. Just terribly terrible. Adding Berglund to that lineup gets us nowhere.

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06-21-2014, 12:16 PM
  #1085
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We aren't going to just gut our future like that.

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06-21-2014, 12:20 PM
  #1086
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Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
We aren't going to just gut our future like that.
What all you Blues fans really are saying in this thread is you want Spezza, but you want him without giving up anything that you consider valuable, right?

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06-21-2014, 12:21 PM
  #1087
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Originally Posted by Sureves View Post
You really think the Sens have a chance at making the playoffs in the near future?

MacArthur-Turris-Ryan
Michalek-Zibanejad-Stone
Condra-Lazar-Greening
Hoffman-Smith-Neil

Methot-Karlsson
Ceci-Cowen
Gryba-Phillips

Anderson
Lehner

That's an atrocious hockey team. Just terribly terrible. Adding Berglund to that lineup gets us nowhere.
So...you're thinking that we do absolutely and positively nothing on July 1st of this year other than re-signing Michalek? I'd say that's a recipe for disaster, I'd agree.

I think we're running with:

MacArthur - Turris - Ryan
UFA signing/acquisition - Zibanejad - Stone
UFA signing/acquisiton - UFA signing/acquisition - Lazar
Greening - Smith - Neil
Condra will be part of a trade IMO
Hoffman

That's 3 spots that need to be filled via trade or free agency - and it doesn't have Michalek coming back because the hour is getting late for that. The third line LW will likely be Berglund and I could see one of the other spots being Chris Stewart.

You need to wait until you see what Murray does on July 1st before declaring the team DOA before the puck even drops.

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06-21-2014, 12:22 PM
  #1088
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Originally Posted by SpezDispenser View Post
Maybe, but you likely were told what we want - and you don't want to push Murray toward Anaheim IMO.

I bet it's a rebuttal to Murray asking for Schwartz - like...if you want to play that game, here's our offer.

But, I don't know much about Milli Vannilli to be honest.
Anaheim is probably doing the exact same thing and NHL GMs aren't as spiteful as fans, offers aren't going to push a GM somewhere else, it will just make them wait for a better offer.

There's still nothing to indicate Schwartz. Just because your board has talked about it at great length, doesn't mean he was the one being talked about in that vague tweet.

Vannelli is a offensive defenseman that is a great skater, great offensive instincts, and a bit of a project defensively. I think he becomes a 2nd pairing offensive puck-mover that gets 40+ points that needs a defensive left-handed partner and maybe sheltered minutes.

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06-21-2014, 12:24 PM
  #1089
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Originally Posted by Sureves View Post
What all you Blues fans really are saying in this thread is you want Spezza, but you want him without giving up anything that you consider valuable, right?
No, that's not what we're saying at all. We just aren't going to overpay. Berglund+Rattie+1st is fair based on historical trades.

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06-21-2014, 12:27 PM
  #1090
Dolph Ziggler
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Originally Posted by Sureves View Post
What all you Blues fans really are saying in this thread is you want Spezza, but you want him without giving up anything that you consider valuable, right?
How is our top prospect, a first round pick, and Berglund things we don't consider valuable?

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06-21-2014, 12:29 PM
  #1091
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Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
Anaheim is probably doing the exact same thing and NHL GMs aren't as spiteful as fans, offers aren't going to push a GM somewhere else, it will just make them wait for a better offer.

There's still nothing to indicate Schwartz. Just because your board has talked about it at great length, doesn't mean he was the one being talked about in that vague tweet.

Vannelli is a offensive defenseman that is a great skater, great offensive instincts, and a bit of a project defensively. I think he becomes a 2nd pairing offensive puck-mover that gets 40+ points that needs a defensive left-handed partner and maybe sheltered minutes.
I doubt Anaheim's messing around. The two Murrays likely had long, long talks about things last summer and then again at the trade deadline. Now the shoe's on the other foot, it's Ottawa trading a big time player for futures and I think Anaheim will be there with their tail wagging.

It's such an interesting triangle IMO. I really don't think there's anyone else prepared to offer up what Anaheim and St.Louis can - and then, I don't think there's anyone who can beat Anaheim if they want to step up.

I'd love to be sitting there as assistant GM listening to all the conversations personally. The first thing I'd say is: get DSP, the 10th and Perreault (as a stop-gap) and fax it in immediately if they agree.

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06-21-2014, 12:30 PM
  #1092
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Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
No, that's not what we're saying at all. We just aren't going to overpay. Berglund+Rattie+1st is fair based on historical trades.
Where/How do you see Spezza slotting into the Blues lineup based on that return?

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06-21-2014, 12:35 PM
  #1093
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Originally Posted by shibster View Post
Where/How do you see Spezza slotting into the Blues lineup based on that return?
Steen-Backes-Oshie
Schwartz-Spezza-Tarasenko
Lindstrom-Sobotka-Jaskin
Paajarvi-Lapierre-Reaves

Porter

Ott could possibly take Paajarvi's spot if we bring him back.

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06-21-2014, 12:35 PM
  #1094
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Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
No, that's not what we're saying at all. We just aren't going to overpay. Berglund+Rattie+1st is fair based on historical trades.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolph Ziggler View Post
How is our top prospect, a first round pick, and Berglund things we don't consider valuable?
OK, so tell me though, what one player is equal in value on the Blues to:

Michalek+Prince+21st overall

I'm curious.

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06-21-2014, 12:36 PM
  #1095
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Originally Posted by Sureves View Post
OK, so tell me though, what one player is equal in value on the Blues to:

Michalek+Prince+21st overall

I'm curious.
A signed Michalek you mean? And Puempel instead of Prince?

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06-21-2014, 12:38 PM
  #1096
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OK, so tell me though, what one player is equal in value on the Blues to:

Michalek+Prince+21st overall

I'm curious.
Michalek is 29 going on 30 and is a UFA, he is not equal to Berglund.

Prince also isn't on the level of Rattie. Prince wasn't as good in juniors, wasn't as good in either of his AHL seasons compared to Rattie's rookie AHL year, and wasn't as highly ranked in the same draft year.

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06-21-2014, 12:40 PM
  #1097
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I think most agree that Kesler and Spezza are going to go for similar amounts. Backes is slightly better than Kesler, but lets just say he's the same. If Backes was on a similar contract to Kesler or Spezza, I would expect a similar return to what I think Spezza would go for. Not a chance in hell would he return a Schwartz.

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06-21-2014, 12:44 PM
  #1098
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
Steen-Backes-Oshie
Schwartz-Spezza-Tarasenko
Lindstrom-Sobotka-Jaskin
Paajarvi-Lapierre-Reaves

Porter

Ott could possibly take Paajarvi's spot if we bring him back.
What do you see Spezza's production being like in this lineup, and how do you think he'll be used? Primary powerplay option, leads the team in scoring? Do you see Schwartz and Tarasenko having noticeably elevated production?

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06-21-2014, 12:44 PM
  #1099
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Part III thread is up: http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh....php?t=1693649

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