WCQF: Detroit vs. Nashville

[ArGarBarGar]

Originally Posted by jaster

Is everyone finally up to speed on Rinne? Or do some of you still think he's not in the top echelon and that him and Howard are in the same tier? Or that you could stick any goalie on the Preds and they'd be as good? Good grief.

No because the Red Wings didn't put the pressure on Rinne that implied they deserved to win or even get close in the series.

They were one step behind each and every game. Rinne is a great goaltender, but it wasn't goaltending that decided the series.

[nik jr]

Originally Posted by Captain Bob

I'm not sure how much credit I want to lay at the feet (glove) of the goalie.
The Wings offensive fired so many low percentage shots at Rinne. I can remember a couple fantastic saves, and I really can't remember any horrid goals (he'd probably want White's or Emmerton's back). he definitely outplayed Howard.

But if our first line is cooking, I think we'd have won the series.

Originally Posted by Doc Holliday

No because the Red Wings didn't put the pressure on Rinne that implied they deserved to win or even get close in the series.

They were one step behind each and every game. Rinne is a great goaltender, but it wasn't goaltending that decided the series.

agree

DRW have long taken large numbers of low quality shots, but usually also have high quality shots.

this series was similar to '06. so many low percentage shots, not enough high quality shots. babcock was right that they were not getting to the inside enough.

Originally Posted by jaster

Wings outshot the Preds 160-116 in that series. Their team D allowed 37, 41, and 43 shots in three of the five games. They played a part, but were certainly not the lone reason the Preds won. Not even close. And while Howard allowed numerous softies, Rinne allowed.... maybe 1? He stood on his head for many key stretches. Do you not think he was the superior goaltender in that series?

rinne was much better than howard, imo.

Originally Posted by jaster

Just curious to see if people were still under-rating Rinne (or over-rating Howard?).

I do like Oatmeal Raisin though.

good choice

[obey86]

Originally Posted by jaster

Take off the rose-tinted glasses, obey. You are in denial. Howard is simply not on the level of Pekka Rinne. The only people who think so are Wings fans incapable of shelving their bias for two seconds.




Right, because I held up a 5-game sample size as proof that Pekka Rinne is the best goalie in NHL history My only point, before the series, was that Rinne was at least a tier above Howard. The series did nothing do disprove that. It only reinforced the point.




Difficult? Not especially. The Preds did a good job keeping the Wings out of the middle for a lot of the series, but across the 5 games the Wings still had a lot of legit scoring chances. Rinne came up for his team when they needed it. He frustrated the Wings. Howard did not do that to the Preds. Instead, he let in softies.

I'm not in denial. Rinne is a good goalie. He is very agile and large in the net. He gets in the way of a lot of shots and has a good glove. But this series he was not tested at all (and that is not deniable). He stopped mostly low quality shots from bad angles or far distances (is it like this for him all the time?). Unlike Howard this series, he didn't have to play behind a defense that turned the puck over numerous times in their own zone and he has a defense that is great at clearing away the numerous rebounds he gives up. Howard was the superior goalie the past two postseasons. Rinne was the superior goalie this postseason.

Howard wasn't good this series. Rinne was better this series. None of that changes my opinion on the two goalies. They are both good and neither has proven anything in the playoffs.

[jaster]

Originally Posted by obey86

I'm not in denial. Rinne is a good goalie. He is very agile and large in the net. He gets in the way of a lot of shots and has a good glove. But this series he was not tested at all (and that is not deniable). He stopped mostly low quality shots from bad angles or far distances (is it like this for him all the time?). Unlike Howard this series, he didn't have to play behind a defense that turned the puck over numerous times in their own zone and he has a defense that is great at clearing away the numerous rebounds he gives up. Howard was the superior goalie the past two postseasons. Rinne was the superior goalie this postseason.

Howard wasn't good this series. Rinne was better this series. None of that changes my opinion on the two goalies. They are both good and neither has proven anything in the playoffs.

Fair enough. However, at some point, people need to detach the goalies from their team's accomplishments a little bit, when comparing them, imo. Look at a guy like Lundqvist. Very few people deny how great he is, yet he's accomplished nothing in the playoffs either. How far ahead of Rinne is Lundqvist?

I think one thing that is more telling about a goalie than how far his team has gone in the playoffs is what his peers have to say about him. And in the player polls I've seen in the past few years, Rinne is routinely listed as a guy opponents do not want to face. Howard doesn't show up on these lists. And that fits with what I've watched, as someone who has played the game for 25 years. Rinne is clearly, obviously, the superior goalie. To me. By at least one "tier." That said, I like Howard, and I think he's a goalie you can win with. He won't steal anything, so you'll need a legit team in front of him, but he has the talent to get it done. Would be nice if he cut down on the softies though.

[jaster]

Originally Posted by nik jr

babcock was right that they were not getting to the inside enough.

I'm in Chicago, so I didn't get the FSD feeds, instead I watched with Strader announcing (which was very enjoyable). But I read somewhere that Mickey was talking about how the Predators were keeping the Wings to the outside and then the next day Babcock said something to the effect of, 'I watched the game on film, and then I watched it again. And again. And again. And with all due respect to Mick, I didn't see what he was talking about.' Lose paraphrase there, but that was the gist. Did Babcock later rescind and admit that the Wings weren't getting to the inside enough?

To me, the Preds were clearly trying to keep the Wings to the outside, and were usually effective. But not completely. The Wings had plenty of great scoring opportunities throughout the 5 games, and Rinne stoned them more than once. I think some of the Rinne discreditors are taking the easy way out when they claim he wasn't challenged at all. He could have been challenged more, absolutely, but he was certainly challenged, and he was up for it. He shut the Wings down. He wasn't the only reason the Preds won, but he was a huge part.

[obey86]

Originally Posted by jaster

Is everyone finally up to speed on Rinne? Or do some of you still think he's not in the top echelon and that him and Howard are in the same tier? Or that you could stick any goalie on the Preds and they'd be as good? Good grief.

Amazing how different Rinne looks when the other team actually gets high quality chances. I'm so surprised