HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk
Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

Toronto - Carolina

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
07-09-2013, 11:19 PM
  #76
Hockyluv21
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 341
vCash: 500
Here's how this will go, once again. Canes won't trade Pitkanen unless we're sellers by the deadline. No reason to trade him now unless we get help now. Conversely, the Leafs won't trade Franson, as he's a cheap, productive asset that they can use their loads of cap dollars to sign to a long-term extension. There, debate over.

Hockyluv21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-09-2013, 11:20 PM
  #77
Atomos2
The Center of Hockey
 
Atomos2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Guelph, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,572
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by firstemperor View Post
You have posters arguing that Franson, at his age, whom is a league leader in defenseman (easily top 10 and above) for hits, points isn't a top 4 d-man in this league, lol.

The same guy is spouting nonsense about QoC as proof he isn't one. Phaneuf has the highest QoC by far in the league and doesn't deserve his credit either. As if it's a fault against Franson for not being playing by his coach against the opposing team's top players- something that is relegated to Phaneuf.

Saying a player is sheltered (mind you, look at who won the Norris and his QoC), despite his production saying everything to the contrary, is a weak way to demean a player as not being a top-4 dman. I'd like to know how many non-top 4 d-men in this league, let alone at Franson's age, fizzles out in the top 10 of d-men at hits, goals, and points.

You want to say Leaf fans overrate their own players, go ahead, we have the largest fanbase by far in the league and that naturally comes with outlandish opinions. However, the rational ones can't even fathom the nonsense being spewed by fans of your fanbase.
Amen

Atomos2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-09-2013, 11:43 PM
  #78
boozeash
Registered User
 
boozeash's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Ottawa
Country: Canada
Posts: 649
vCash: 500
A big no from Toronto. I don't understand why so many Hurricanes fans are opposed to this trade. I'd take Franson and Kulemin over Ruutu and Pitkanen any day of the week.

boozeash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-09-2013, 11:49 PM
  #79
Hockyluv21
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 341
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by boozeash View Post
A big no from Toronto. I don't understand why so many Hurricanes fans are opposed to this trade. I'd take Franson and Kulemin over Ruutu and Pitkanen any day of the week.
It's a badly composed trade for either team, it doesn't take into account any of the real needs of both teams. Franson is great, but not at the cost of our most productive D-man when healthy. Now, if Franson's RFA demands are too high, and the Canes offer, say, Ryan Murphy for Cody Franson, THAT might be a trade that is beneficial to both teams, because the Canes need D help right now, not in the future, and there's no better compensation for a young, hard-to-sign RFA than an NHL-ready, 1st round caliber D prospect.

Hockyluv21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-09-2013, 11:55 PM
  #80
Roboturner913
Registered User
 
Roboturner913's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,732
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomos2 View Post
Damn...and you're approval meant everything to me.

I'm just gonna go in the corner and mourn for a bit.
While you're there, bring an English textbook and work on contractions vs. possessive forms.

Just sayin'.

Roboturner913 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-10-2013, 12:01 AM
  #81
Roboturner913
Registered User
 
Roboturner913's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,732
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by boozeash View Post
A big no from Toronto. I don't understand why so many Hurricanes fans are opposed to this trade. I'd take Franson and Kulemin over Ruutu and Pitkanen any day of the week.
If you want to say that Kulemin is a more valuable piece than Ruutu I got no problem with that. Given Ruutu's burdensome contract it is probably true.

It's the rest of the deal that's the problem. Because even the Canes fans who aren't in love with Pitkanen know that replacing Pitkanen with Franson is a downgrade in the one position where they really can't afford to take a hit.

Roboturner913 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-10-2013, 12:04 AM
  #82
Leafsforlife98
Registered User
 
Leafsforlife98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 527
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeromeo87 View Post
"LEAFS STILL LOOKING FOR TOP-FOUR DEFENSEMAN"
http://www.thefourthperiod.com/news/tor130706.html

To
Pitkanen, Ruutu

To
Franson, Kulimen
Wow, horrible in every sense of the word. Leafs give up 2 best players in the deal

Leafsforlife98 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-10-2013, 12:10 AM
  #83
Roboturner913
Registered User
 
Roboturner913's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,732
vCash: 500
LOL.

Man, if the evaluations of Average Leaf Fan of their own players actually turned out to be accurate, you guys would win the Cup every year.

But fine then, Cody "I took like 4 defensive zone shifts this year" Franson and Nikolai "I've scored 14 goals and I'm minus-3 in my last 118 games" are both golden gods.


Let's face it, both of your guys are question marks. Franson isn't any more of a guaranteed elite top-4 defenseman than say, Jiri Tlusty is a 40-goal scorer. Both may have performed at that pace in a shortened time frame last year, and we may both want to believe in each of our respective guys' abilities to continue that level of play, but at the end of the day they're still question marks.

Don't you think it's telling that even though half the threads on the Canes board this offseason end up in a discussion about buying out Ruutu's contract, still nobody on their side wants to take this trade?


Last edited by Roboturner913: 07-10-2013 at 12:29 AM.
Roboturner913 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-10-2013, 12:52 AM
  #84
boozeash
Registered User
 
boozeash's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Ottawa
Country: Canada
Posts: 649
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roboturner913 View Post
LOL.

Man, if the evaluations of Average Leaf Fan of their own players actually turned out to be accurate, you guys would win the Cup every year.

But fine then, Cody "I took like 4 defensive zone shifts this year" Franson and Nikolai "I've scored 14 goals and I'm minus-3 in my last 118 games" are both golden gods.


Let's face it, both of your guys are question marks. Franson isn't any more of a guaranteed elite top-4 defenseman than say, Jiri Tlusty is a 40-goal scorer. Both may have performed at that pace in a shortened time frame last year, and we may both want to believe in each of our respective guys' abilities to continue that level of play, but at the end of the day they're still question marks.

Don't you think it's telling that even though half the threads on the Canes board this offseason end up in a discussion about buying out Ruutu's contract, still nobody on their side wants to take this trade?
Well that's just it...... Ruutu is signed to a terrible contract which will see him get paid 4.75 million for the next 3 years until he's 33(he will likely get bought out long before he lives up to that contract) . Joni who's the same age and is unable to play a full season. Both are severely overpaid and under performing. Kulemin is a 2 way winger who's entering his prime. (former 30 goal scorer) Yes he has struggled offensively over the last two seasons but does everything else right and anyone who has seen him play know that he's a valuable player on a very reasonable contract. Franson is an RFA who will be looking for a raise from his 1.2 million dollars he made last season but if you use PK Subban as a precedent. He would know that he's not worth as much as PK signed for 2.85/year cap hit. So I'd take a young healthy Franson over Pitkinen any day for less than half the cost. If you want to buyout your players rather than trade them for cheap replacements than maybe you guys don't know the business of hockey too well.

boozeash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-10-2013, 12:56 AM
  #85
Roboturner913
Registered User
 
Roboturner913's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,732
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by boozeash View Post
Well that's just it...... Ruutu is signed to a terrible contract which will see him get paid 4.75 million for the next 3 years until he's 33(he will likely get bought out long before he lives up to that contract) . Joni who's the same age and is unable to play a full season. Both are severely overpaid and under performing.
A. Pitkanen is defintely not underperforming his contract; he is a top-pair defenseman, playing at a top-pair level, and is paid as such.

Quote:
Originally Posted by boozeash View Post
Kulemin is a 2 way winger who's entering his prime. (former 30 goal scorer) Yes he has struggled offensively over the last two seasons but does everything else right and anyone who has seen him play know that he's a valuable player on a very reasonable contract.
B. Kulemin may be a "former 30-goal scorer." However, he is also a "former 7-goal scorer." Twice. In each of the last two seasons. Patrick Dwyer has also" struggled offensively over the last two seasons and does everything else right and anyone who has seen him play know that he's a valuable player on a reasonable contract" and he makes 1/3 of what Kulemin does, but I don't see anybody singing his praises as worthy trade material.

Quote:
Originally Posted by boozeash View Post
So I'd take a young healthy Franson over Pitkinen any day for less than half the cost. If you want to buyout your players rather than trade them for cheap replacements than maybe you guys don't know the business of hockey too well.
C. If you took your approach with every player on the roster you'd end up with a team full of kinda good players and be in good salary cap shape, but probably end up with a pretty average (not to mention boring) team.

So maybe you are the one who "doesn't know the business of hockey too well."

(hey that was fun)


Last edited by Roboturner913: 07-10-2013 at 01:08 AM.
Roboturner913 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-10-2013, 01:03 AM
  #86
Atomos2
The Center of Hockey
 
Atomos2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Guelph, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,572
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roboturner913 View Post
While you're there, bring an English textbook and work on contractions vs. possessive forms.

Just sayin'.
Awwww, its cyute that u look fur that tipe of stuff. Yuu'll make a grate english teecher sumday.

Atomos2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-10-2013, 01:09 AM
  #87
Atomos2
The Center of Hockey
 
Atomos2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Guelph, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,572
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roboturner913 View Post
LOL.

Man, if the evaluations of Average Leaf Fan of their own players actually turned out to be accurate, you guys would win the Cup every year.

But fine then, Cody "I took like 4 defensive zone shifts this year" Franson and Nikolai "I've scored 14 goals and I'm minus-3 in my last 118 games" are both golden gods.


Let's face it, both of your guys are question marks. Franson isn't any more of a guaranteed elite top-4 defenseman than say, Jiri Tlusty is a 40-goal scorer. Both may have performed at that pace in a shortened time frame last year, and we may both want to believe in each of our respective guys' abilities to continue that level of play, but at the end of the day they're still question marks.

Don't you think it's telling that even though half the threads on the Canes board this offseason end up in a discussion about buying out Ruutu's contract, still nobody on their side wants to take this trade?
This is pretty funny. The exact stat that you mock one player with (Franson), you completely ignore from the other player (Kulemin). Player assessments with an agenda .

If you're gonna comment on one player for defensive zone starts, maybe you should keep it consistent for the other one as well.

Atomos2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-10-2013, 01:09 AM
  #88
A1LeafNation
Thanks Boston.
 
A1LeafNation's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,633
vCash: 566
Why is this thread still alive.

The Carolina offer is crap. Leafs say no.

/Thread

A1LeafNation is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-10-2013, 01:11 AM
  #89
Roboturner913
Registered User
 
Roboturner913's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,732
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomos2 View Post
This is pretty funny. The exact stat that you mock one player with (Franson), you completely ignore from the other player (Kulemin). Player assessments with an agenda .
/meaningless mock trade proposals on message boards are serious business, dammit!

Roboturner913 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-10-2013, 01:12 AM
  #90
Roboturner913
Registered User
 
Roboturner913's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,732
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomos2 View Post
Awwww, its cyute that u look fur that tipe of stuff. Yuu'll make a grate english teecher sumday.
I have been an English teacher. And a journalist.

Speaking as someone from that world, you will be taken a lot more seriously in any aspect of life when you learn to express yourself properly.

Just trying to help.

Roboturner913 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-10-2013, 01:14 AM
  #91
A1LeafNation
Thanks Boston.
 
A1LeafNation's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,633
vCash: 566
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roboturner913 View Post
I have been an English teacher. And a journalist.

Speaking as someone from that world, you will be taken a lot more seriously in any aspect of life when you learn to express yourself properly.

Just trying to help.
Helping one person on the internet at a time. Good for you champ.

A1LeafNation is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-10-2013, 01:22 AM
  #92
Roboturner913
Registered User
 
Roboturner913's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,732
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by A1LeafNation View Post
Why is this thread still alive.

The Carolina offer is crap. Leafs say no.

/Thread
Hey, it could be worse....


http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...t=faulk&page=2

Roboturner913 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-10-2013, 01:27 AM
  #93
boozeash
Registered User
 
boozeash's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Ottawa
Country: Canada
Posts: 649
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roboturner913 View Post
A. Pitkanen is defintely not underperforming his contract; he is a top-pair defenseman, playing at a top-pair level, and is paid as such.



B. Kulemin may be a "former 30-goal scorer." However, he is also a "former 7-goal scorer." Twice. In each of the last two seasons. Patrick Dwyer has also" struggled offensively over the last two seasons and does everything else right and anyone who has seen him play know that he's a valuable player on a reasonable contract" and he makes 1/3 of what Kulemin does, but I don't see anybody singing his praises as worthy trade material.



C. If you took your approach with every player on the roster you'd end up with a team full of kinda good players and be in good salary cap shape, but probably end up with a pretty average (not to mention boring) team.

So maybe you are the one who "doesn't know the business of hockey too well."

(hey that was fun)
Well you can only have so many players making 5 million/year......you need to have a few that get paid less and still perform. Save the big money for the superstars like Kessel.

boozeash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-10-2013, 02:57 PM
  #94
Cyris
Global Moderator
The one who knocks!
 
Cyris's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: 3rd Planet From Sun.
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,903
vCash: 1269
Quote:
Originally Posted by firstemperor View Post
You have posters arguing that Franson, at his age, whom is a league leader in defenseman (easily top 10 and above) for hits, points isn't a top 4 d-man in this league, lol.

The same guy is spouting nonsense about QoC as proof he isn't one. Phaneuf has the highest QoC by far in the league and doesn't deserve his credit either. As if it's a fault against Franson for not being playing by his coach against the opposing team's top players- something that is relegated to Phaneuf.

Saying a player is sheltered (mind you, look at who won the Norris and his QoC), despite his production saying everything to the contrary, is a weak way to demean a player as not being a top-4 dman. I'd like to know how many non-top 4 d-men in this league, let alone at Franson's age, fizzles out in the top 10 of d-men at hits, goals, and points.

You want to say Leaf fans overrate their own players, go ahead, we have the largest fanbase by far in the league and that naturally comes with outlandish opinions. However, the rational ones can't even fathom the nonsense being spewed by fans of your fanbase.
Only 1 other Dman in the entire league was top 10 in both points and hits. That same Dman was the only Dman top 10 in goals, points and hits.

Dion Phaneuf. But according to HF he sucks too.

Cyris is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:02 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.