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Doug Wilson: Sharks in a "Rebuild"

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06-24-2014, 02:11 PM
  #301
letowskie
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Originally Posted by Coy View Post
Want no part of Vanek or Niskanen besides we never sign big FAs anyway
Well, from an outside perspective, getting Vanek or Niskanen (+ some decent assets for Marleau) seems like a good trade off. It makes the team more balanced in terms of complementary skills, and extends the window of contention longer.

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06-24-2014, 02:16 PM
  #302
SpinTheBlackCircle
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Originally Posted by MarleauApologist View Post
Pavelski for Yandle, Pavelski for Josi, Pavelski for Kadri and Gardiner, Pavelski for Marchand and Krug

But that's not the point. The point is that all Marleau deals make the team worse next year. There isn't a single one proposed that makes the team better. To say that he is undoubtedly the best player to trade in order to make the team better next year is ridiculous. Maybe it would be fair to say that Marleau would be the best player to trade to make the team better 3 years from now, but that's not what he suggested. He was just attacking my favorite player because I kept it real on his, plain and simple.
Pavelski isn't my favorite player. I am being "unbiased", like you claimed to be when you cannot be.

If Pavelski is dealt for a better player than he is, I would be the first to celebrate.

If Marleau was dealt for Crosby, you would say the Sharks got hosed,.

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Last edited by SpinTheBlackCircle: 06-24-2014 at 02:22 PM.
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06-24-2014, 02:33 PM
  #303
MarleauApologist
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Originally Posted by SpinTheBlackCircle View Post
Pavelski isn't my favorite player. I am being "unbiased", like you claimed to be when you cannot be.

If Pavelski is dealt for a better player than he is, I would be the first to celebrate.

If Marleau was dealt for Crosby, you would say the Sharks got hosed,.
No I wouldn't. I'm like 95% unobjective. I understand that trading Marleau and tanking is probably best for our future. I also understand that he (and Thornton, who isn't my favorite player) are extremely important and it would be stupid to trade them if we aren't going to tank.

There is no trade which involves tradingn Marleau and us becoming a better team right now. There may be one for making us better in the future. There most certainly is one for Pavelski on both accounts.

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06-24-2014, 02:41 PM
  #304
DarrylshutzSydor
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Originally Posted by MarleauApologist View Post
No I wouldn't. I'm like 95% unobjective. I understand that trading Marleau and tanking is probably best for our future. I also understand that he (and Thornton, who isn't my favorite player) are extremely important and it would be stupid to trade them if we aren't going to tank.

There is no trade which involves tradingn Marleau and us becoming a better team right now. There may be one for making us better in the future. There most certainly is one for Pavelski on both accounts.
Trading marleau and Pavelski and getting good return pieces and even keeping Thornton just may well improve the team AND as early as next year.....

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06-24-2014, 03:01 PM
  #305
Pinkfloyd
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarleauApologist View Post
Pavelski for Yandle, Pavelski for Josi, Pavelski for Kadri and Gardiner, Pavelski for Marchand and Krug

But that's not the point. The point is that all Marleau deals make the team worse next year. There isn't a single one proposed that makes the team better. To say that he is undoubtedly the best player to trade in order to make the team better next year is ridiculous. Maybe it would be fair to say that Marleau would be the best player to trade to make the team better 3 years from now, but that's not what he suggested. He was just attacking my favorite player because I kept it real on his, plain and simple.
All those Pavelski deals you just listed makes the team worse. Pretty much any realistic deal involving any of the Sharks quality forwards is going to make them worse.

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06-24-2014, 03:03 PM
  #306
Pinkfloyd
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Quote:
Originally Posted by letowskie View Post
Well, from an outside perspective, getting Vanek or Niskanen (+ some decent assets for Marleau) seems like a good trade off. It makes the team more balanced in terms of complementary skills, and extends the window of contention longer.
A reasonable conclusion to come to but it has a flaw. Sharks don't sign quality free agents.

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06-24-2014, 03:10 PM
  #307
Nolan11
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Originally Posted by MarleauApologist View Post
There is no trade which involves tradingn Marleau and us becoming a better team right now. There may be one for making us better in the future. There most certainly is one for Pavelski on both accounts.
If you want us to be better next year, which DW admits is not gonna happen, the return for any one of our stars has got to include at least two young roster players coming back. One to partially replace the top 6 production, another to improve upon Stuart in our top four. Here is one such scenario:

Marleau + Niemi (half cap) for Sutter + Despres + Fleury (and pick(s) to balance out)

CAPGEEK.COM ARMCHAIR GM ROSTER
CapGeek Armchair GM Roster
FORWARDS
Matt Nieto ($0.759m) / Logan Couture ($6.000m) / Tommy Wingels ($2.500m)
Tomas Hertl ($0.925m) / Joe Thornton ($6.750m) / Joe Pavelski ($6.000m)
Raffi Torres ($2.000m) / Brandon Sutter ($2.750m) / Freddie Hamilton ($0.627m)
James Sheppard ($1.250m) / Andrew Desjardins ($0.750m) / Mike Brown ($1.200m)
Tyler Kennedy ($2.350m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Marc-Edouard Vlasic ($4.250m) / Brent Burns ($5.760m)
Simon Despres ($2.500m) / Justin Braun ($1.250m)
Mirco Mueller ($0.894m) / Jason Demers ($3.000m)
Matt Irwin ($1.000m) /
GOALTENDERS
Alex Stalock ($1.600m)
Marc-Andre Fleury ($5.000m)
BUYOUTS
Martin Havlat ($0.000m)
Adam Burish ($0.000m)
RETAINED SALARIES (5.35% of upper limit)
Antti Niemi ($1.900mó50.00%)
Brad Stuart ($1.800mó50.00%)
BONUS OVERAGE
$0
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(estimations for 2014-15)
SALARY CAP: $69,100,000; CAP PAYROLL: $62,815,000; BONUSES: $1,267,500
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $6,285,000

Now it would be nice to trade Kennedy too and then use some of that cap space to sign a top 9 RW, but the point of this exercise is to show that trading Marleau would not be the end of the world.

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