If he doesn't become better than Gagner he'll be a huge disappointment.
Yeah, I don't think people realize that Gagner is one of the biggest passengers in the league; he gets carried pretty hard by the other dudes in the Oilers' top 6.
If he doesn't become better than Gagner he'll be a huge disappointment.
The thing is, and I'll preface this by saying the Oilers are one of my most hated teams, that Sam Gagner was on pace for 65 points in the NHL at 23.
We still don't know what Gagner will be in his prime.
Henrik Zetterberg wasn't scoring at a 65 point pace at 23 (to be fair to Zetterberg he was also only a 2 year NHL vet at 23 as opposed to Gagner's 6 year NHL career).
I just think it's unfair to Gagner and Lindholm to condemn his point totals on an abyssmal team for 6 years, and to suggest if Lindholm doesn't beat that he'll be a dissapointment.
Zetterberg didn't hit the PPG mark until 25....we still don't know where Gagner ends up.
I think we all forget this is a 23 year old player, not 27.
Yeah, I don't think people realize that Gagner is one of the biggest passengers in the league; he gets carried pretty hard by the other dudes in the Oilers' top 6.
Which dudes? LOL!
You could argue all the other dudes are passengers on the bus being driven by Taylor Hall.
The thing is, and I'll preface this by saying the Oilers are one of my most hated teams, that Sam Gagner was on pace for 65 points in the NHL at 23.
We still don't know what Gagner will be in his prime.
Henrik Zetterberg wasn't scoring at a 65 point pace at 23 (to be fair to Zetterberg he was also only a 2 year NHL vet at 23 as opposed to Gagner's 6 year NHL career).
I just think it's unfair to Gagner and Lindholm to condemn his point totals on an abyssmal team for 6 years, and to suggest if Lindholm doesn't beat that he'll be a dissapointment.
Zetterberg didn't hit the PPG mark until 25....we still don't know where Gagner ends up.
I think we all forget this is a 23 year old player, not 27.
How do you know he is not in his prime right now?
I would consider topping out at 65 points a disappointment for Lindholm.
How do you know he is not in his prime right now?
I would consider topping out at 65 points a disappointment for Lindholm.
We don't.
He's still improving though.
That's why I take issue with making the claim. Do we know Gagner is done improving? I'd say no.
I like Lindholm, and I do feel he has more potential than Gagner, claiming a 23 year old kid is done improving just seems silly, when there is large evidence that 23 isn't a players prime.
That's why I take issue with making the claim. Do we know Gagner is done improving? I'd say no.
I like Lindholm, and I do feel he has more potential than Gagner, claiming a 23 year old kid is done improving just seems silly, when there is large evidence that 23 isn't a players prime.
Every player is unique. One player can hit his prime when he's 23, another can hit his when he's 35.
You could argue all the other dudes are passengers on the bus being driven by Taylor Hall.
Haha I would almost argue that (although Eberle, RNH, and Yak are all better than Gagner to varying degrees).
Quote:
Originally Posted by arsmaster
We don't.
He's still improving though.
That's why I take issue with making the claim. Do we know Gagner is done improving? I'd say no.
I like Lindholm, and I do feel he has more potential than Gagner, claiming a 23 year old kid is done improving just seems silly, when there is large evidence that 23 isn't a players prime.
I'd say Gagner is pretty much what he is at this point, at least points-wise. Yes, he's young, but he's also been in the NHL for five full seasons, and a sixth truncated season; experience definitely counts. Until this year he's always hovered around the 40-50 point mark, he's always been a pretty weak possession player, and he's generally relied on his linemates rather than vice versa.
I'd be surprised if Gagner surpasses 50 points on a regular basis, unless the Oilers decide to load him up with more PP time than all of the other (better) guys. He might end up improving defensively still, but again, he has been around for a very long time for a guy his age and he doesn't seem to have learned a ton.
The thing is, and I'll preface this by saying the Oilers are one of my most hated teams, that Sam Gagner was on pace for 65 points in the NHL at 23.
We still don't know what Gagner will be in his prime.
Henrik Zetterberg wasn't scoring at a 65 point pace at 23 (to be fair to Zetterberg he was also only a 2 year NHL vet at 23 as opposed to Gagner's 6 year NHL career).
I just think it's unfair to Gagner and Lindholm to condemn his point totals on an abyssmal team for 6 years, and to suggest if Lindholm doesn't beat that he'll be a dissapointment.
Zetterberg didn't hit the PPG mark until 25....we still don't know where Gagner ends up.
I think we all forget this is a 23 year old player, not 27.
This is why projections >> comparisons. With comparisons you'll only get misconceptions about a player. Comparing play styles is a little different.
Lindholm projects as a 60-80 point center who's capable of making his linemates better. He'll be a steady physical player, good in front of both nets, and play in all situations of a game. His span is somewhere between great 2nd line center and franchise center.
Every player is unique. One player can hit his prime when he's 23, another can hit his when he's 35.
Very true.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SmellOfVictory
Haha I would almost argue that (although Eberle, RNH, and Yak are all better than Gagner to varying degrees).
I'd say Gagner is pretty much what he is at this point, at least points-wise. Yes, he's young, but he's also been in the NHL for five full seasons, and a sixth truncated season; experience definitely counts. Until this year he's always hovered around the 40-50 point mark, he's always been a pretty weak possession player, and he's generally relied on his linemates rather than vice versa.
I'd be surprised if Gagner surpasses 50 points on a regular basis, unless the Oilers decide to load him up with more PP time than all of the other (better) guys. He might end up improving defensively still, but again, he has been around for a very long time for a guy his age and he doesn't seem to have learned a ton.
I think it's hard to gauge what any Oiler truly is at this point just because of the situation/environment they're developing in.
Quote:
Originally Posted by joe89
This is why projections >> comparisons. With comparisons you'll only get misconceptions about a player. Comparing play styles is a little different.
Lindholm projects as a 60-80 point center who's capable of making his linemates better. He'll be a steady physical player, good in front of both nets, and play in all situations of a game. His span is somewhere between great 2nd line center and franchise center.
Yeah, I agree with this, and I didn't mean to drag this Lindholm thread into a Sam Gagner projection-fest.
It's also why I mentioned Zetterberg...It's a pretty apt play style comparison to Lindholm I'd say, yet Z didn't score PPG in the NHL until he was 25.
