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Buffalo/Edmonton Proposal

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Old
08-28-2004, 12:58 AM
  #1
Larry Fisher
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Buffalo/Edmonton Proposal

As Oiler fans we are rather shook up over the loss of Nedved and we are in search of option B, whether through UFA or trade.

I have come to a conclusion that Buffalo and Florida are our two best trading partners. What we need is a #1 center (#2 center on 2/3 of the league's teams)and a puck moving d-man capable of QBing our powerplay.

The following proposals make the most sense to me as an Oilers fan:

To Buffalo

Brewer, Horcoff, Isbister and Philly's 3rd in '05

To Edmonton

Drury, Vanek and Tallinder

***If the Sabres are keen on keeping Vanek or Tallinder we could restructure this deal to look like:

To Buffalo

Brewer, Horcoff and Philly's 3rd

To Edmonton

Drury, Vanek/Tallinder and Noronen

The Florida proposal would shakedown as follows:

To Florida

Brewer, Horcoff, Isbister and Philly's 3rd in '05

To Edmonton

Jokinen and Krajcek

What are your opinions on these proposals? Are they close value-wise? Do they make sense for the Sabres/Panthers?

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08-28-2004, 01:10 AM
  #2
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I'll be nice and just say no.

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08-28-2004, 01:14 AM
  #3
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Does Kevin Lowe know how to hypnotise other GMs? 'Cause that's the only way those deals get done.

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Old
08-28-2004, 01:16 AM
  #4
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Originally Posted by DanielBriere48
I'll be nice and just say no.
That's very commendable of you.

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Old
08-28-2004, 01:51 AM
  #5
Larry Fisher
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Really...ouch I must overvalue the Oilers...

Thanks for the comments. This is the way I break down the deals.

Deal 1:

Brewer > Drury (by a reasonable margin)
Horcoff < Vanek (also by a wide-margin even though he remains unsigned and has yet to play an NHL game)
Isbister and Philly's 3rd in '05 = Tallinder

I thought it was fair all around and requiring little to no hypnosis.

Deal 2:

Brewer > Drury (by a reasonable margin)
Horcoff < Vanek/Tallinder (by a similar margin)
Philly's 3rd in '05 > Noronen (It is no secret that Buffalo needs to move one of their three goalies, thus the lowered value for Noronen, the odd man out IMO)

According to my calculations Edmonton would actually overpay slightly in this deal but both teams would walk away satisfied.

Deal 3:

Brewer = Jokinen (IMO their values are similar league wide)
Horcoff and Philly's 3rd in '05 = Krajcek (Krajcek is an underrated prospect IMO but that seems to be fair value for him)
Isbister = THROW IN/Salary Dump (I don't see much space in our system for Isbister but he seems like a Keenan type player and Martin might be able to light a fire under him moreso than MacT did in Edmonton)

Again from my perspective Edmonton gives up equal value if not a tad extra. These deals are quality for quality IMO and its a matter of teams dealing their strengths to address a weakness.

Buffalo and Florida could both use a d-man of Brewer's calibre (so could the 27 other NHL teams) and Edmonton needs a top flight center at an affordable rate along with a decent young puck moving d-man with potential to QB our powerplay.

You guys obviously don't agree with my observations. Provide what you guys would consider more reasonable proposals (featuring Oilers players/prospects/picks) for those packages and we will continue this discussion.

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08-28-2004, 01:57 AM
  #6
Russian_fanatic
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Horrible deal for Buffalo IMO I would NEVER trade Vanek if I have him as one of my prospect. I would only trade him if I knew he would be a Definite bust.

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08-28-2004, 02:13 AM
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Russian_fanatic
Horrible deal for Buffalo IMO I would NEVER trade Vanek if I have him as one of my prospect. I would only trade him if I knew he would be a Definite bust.
And if Buffalo knew he was a bust, then you can bet that other teams had gotten wind of it too. Scouts are cunning these days. I don't see Vanek being moved anytime soon.

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08-28-2004, 02:20 AM
  #8
Larry Fisher
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...

Take note of Proposal #2. It offers Drury, Noronen and Buffalo's choice of Vanek/Tallinder for Brewer, Horcoff and Philly's 3rd in '05.

You guys obviously see Vanek as close to untouchable so how does this deal work value-wise with Tallinder included instead? Does that proposal interest Buffalo? Is it something they would pursue?

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Old
08-28-2004, 02:24 AM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by salostyle
Take note of Proposal #2. It offers Drury, Noronen and Buffalo's choice of Vanek/Tallinder for Brewer, Horcoff and Philly's 3rd in '05.

You guys obviously see Vanek as close to untouchable so how does this deal work value-wise with Tallinder included instead? Does that proposal interest Buffalo? Is it something they would pursue?
Drury, Noronen, Tallinder

for

Brewer, Horcoff and Philly's 3rd in '05?

hmmm....

Drury<Brewer
Noronen>>>Horcoff
Tallinder<3rd in '05

Could work.

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Old
08-28-2004, 02:39 AM
  #10
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Drury or Satan, Biron, Tallinder


Brewer,



Ah forget it, there's no trade here.....


:lol :mad:

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Old
08-28-2004, 04:46 AM
  #11
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holy overrate vanek batman !

why trade brewer again? for more forwards, especially drury and his price tag (edmonton wise) ?

why trade brewer?

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08-28-2004, 04:53 AM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Russian_fanatic
Noronen>>>Horcoff
You vastly overrate Noronen...

As for Drury.. I somehow doubt he would want to play in Edmonton he's an American who wants to stay in America. They tried him out in Calgary and he didn't want to stay.

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Old
08-28-2004, 08:12 AM
  #13
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With the lose of Nedved--other GM's are licking their lips--knowing full well how bad the oilers played prior to the Nedved trade---the only reason the Oilers had a chance of making the playoffs was do to adding Nedved talents to the team---

my money is on teams lining up to try dump dead weight on Lowe

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08-28-2004, 08:34 AM
  #14
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no need for Noronen right now, until Conks or Juice (Markkanen) can't prove they be can a suitable no. 1 goalie or at the very least be spilt time then Noronen has no real value to Edmonton

and i don't think Drury would be the right answer anyway, but don't get me wrong, he's a wonderful player, i just don't think he's right choice for the oilers right now

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Old
08-28-2004, 09:23 AM
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jumptheshark
With the lose of Nedved--other GM's are licking their lips--knowing full well how bad the oilers played prior to the Nedved trade---the only reason the Oilers had a chance of making the playoffs was do to adding Nedved talents to the team---

my money is on teams lining up to try dump dead weight on Lowe
Ahh that makes perfect sense. That 15 game stretch where the Oilers play their best hockey each and every year wouldn't have happened without that Mighty Nedved. You conveniently failed to mention that Bergeron, Brewer, Horcoff, Smyth were all playing some of their best hockey of the season during that stretch. Those big two points that the Oilers missed the playoffs by last year surely can't be obtained by dumping the worst starting goalie in the league, and replacing him with two younger guys who had better stats.

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08-28-2004, 09:26 AM
  #16
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I wouldn't give up Brewer in any trade for Drury as the centerpiece. Drury isn't a bad player, but he's doesn't make up for the impact Brewers absence would have on the Oilers.

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08-28-2004, 12:27 PM
  #17
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Originally Posted by HemskyFreak83
and i don't think Drury would be the right answer anyway, but don't get me wrong, he's a wonderful player, i just don't think he's right choice for the oilers right now
Wild speculation that just isn't true.

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Old
08-28-2004, 12:28 PM
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oiltalk
Drury isn't a bad player, but he's doesn't make up for the impact Brewers absence would have on the Oilers.
Agreed, the Oilers would be giving up Brewer -- their top blueliner -- for a dynamic, flashy... 2nd line center.

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Old
08-28-2004, 12:37 PM
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by salostyle
To Buffalo

Brewer, Horcoff, Isbister and Philly's 3rd in '05

To Edmonton

Drury, Vanek and Tallinder
No way the Sabres do that. That package will barely get you Vanek alone.

Quote:
Originally Posted by salostyle
To Florida

Brewer, Horcoff, Isbister and Philly's 3rd in '05

To Edmonton

Jokinen and Krajcek
More realistic but the Panthers still wouldn't bite IMO. Isbister has no trade value at all. Horcoff barely has any trade value. Brewer is a solid start but you need to give to get.

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Old
08-28-2004, 12:48 PM
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Garfield
Horcoff barely has any trade value.
Really? He'd be your 4th highest point producer while playing exceptional defense. He's young (25) and has plenty of room left to improve his offensive production even more. If a player like Horcoff "barely has any trade value", I wonder what that means to the 8 forwards on the Flames whom would be behind him in terms of scoring, and IMO defensive abilites as well.

That 2nd deal is very fair IMO. Maybe make the pick a 2nd..

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Old
08-28-2004, 12:51 PM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ott = Snott
Really? He'd be your 4th highest point producer while playing exceptional defense. He's young (25) and has plenty of room left to improve his offensive production even more. If a player like Horcoff "barely has any trade value", I wonder what that means to the 8 forwards on the Flames whom would be behind him in terms of scoring, and IMO defensive abilites as well.

That 2nd deal is very fair IMO. Maybe make the pick a 2nd..


Lose one argument, follow me to another thread to try your luck again ??

The Oilers obviously play a different system than the Flames. Horcoff would NOT be the 4th highest scorer if he played for the Flames. That is laughable. Considering he would be the Flames 4th line C.

Secondly, Horcoff will only be a 3rd line C at best IMO. As far as I am concerned, that isn't much value especially in a deal involving the Sabres best prospect or the Panthers best player.

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Old
08-28-2004, 12:57 PM
  #22
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Originally Posted by Ott = Snott
8 forwards on the Flames whom would be behind him in terms of scoring, and IMO defensive abilites as well.
Smoke another. You think Horcoff is better defensively than 8/12 Flames forwards. Not a chance.

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Old
08-28-2004, 12:59 PM
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Garfield


Lose one argument, follow me to another thread to try your luck again ??
Lose one arguement? Where exactly was I proven so wrong that made me lose an arguement with you, my dear homer. But nice to know this is all like a contest for you, I bet "winning" an arguement equals sex for you.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Garfield
The Oilers obviously play a different system than the Flames. Horcoff would NOT be the 4th highest scorer if he played for the Flames. That is laughable. Considering he would be the Flames 4th line C.
Irrelevant. He scored 40 points, which would've been 4th on the Flames. You can come up with excuses all you like, but it doesn't change the fact that he scored 40 and that that would have him 4th on the Calgary Flames. All you do is speculate..


Quote:
Originally Posted by Garfield
Secondly, Horcoff will only be a 3rd line C. As far as I am concerned, that isn't much value especially in a deal involving the Sabres best prospect.
I never replied on his first proposal. It was the 2nd deal where you described Horcoff barely having any trade value. Whether you feel he will only be a 3rd liner is up to you, but I'll gladly take a young two-way center on my team anyday, especially when he has the potential to score much more giving more icetime and better line-mates.

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Old
08-28-2004, 01:03 PM
  #24
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There's no way Edmonton makes that deal.

Brewer and Jokinen may be a wash, but I still give the edge in value to Brewer. And nothing against Krajcek, but there is no way he is worth Horcoff, Isbister, and a 3rd. Not even close.

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Old
08-28-2004, 01:07 PM
  #25
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Originally Posted by Ott = Snott
my dear homer.
Oh lord, here we go. Ott=Snott pretending he isn't a homer while everyone else he is talking with is.

Truly one of the funniest things on hfboards.com

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