HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Central Division > Dallas Stars
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Ongoing Powerplay Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-17-2013, 12:16 AM
  #151
FrailSwan
A-B-We Stole Your C
 
FrailSwan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Dallas
Country: United States
Posts: 3,362
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigG44 View Post
Desperate is a stretch. He has a more offensive option in Eakin who was winning plenty of faceoffs in the games I watched this year.

The argument isn't that Dallas needs to be concerned about winning the faceoff. The issue is that Gulutzan is once again hesitant to use a rookie with offensive upside instead of a veteran who clearly has no business to be on the PP.

Being gun shy in the NHL doesn't cut it. He needs to learn to develop players and trust them or he's not going to be around long. It's very clear what direction GMJN and Gaglardi want to see this team go. They haven't been talking up these young players for nothing. They want to be a team built from within. That' means sucking it up and dealing with the occasional blunders of a young player.
Against mainly AHL quality so that would make the point moot...

FrailSwan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 12:21 AM
  #152
BigG44
Registered User
 
BigG44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 22,091
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by FrailSwan View Post
Against mainly AHL quality so that would make the point moot...
That's truly absurd. You realize that right?

BigG44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 12:26 AM
  #153
LatvianTwist
Global Moderator
 
LatvianTwist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Houston
Country: Tibet
Posts: 18,535
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by FrailSwan View Post
Against mainly AHL quality so that would make the point moot...
Faceoffs aren't really a skill where you'll find a big difference in any league... It's more the rules that matter than anything.

LatvianTwist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 12:27 AM
  #154
FrailSwan
A-B-We Stole Your C
 
FrailSwan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Dallas
Country: United States
Posts: 3,362
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigG44 View Post
That's truly absurd. You realize that right?
So because he wins faceoffs in the AHL he's automatically going to have success in the NHL? I don't see any absurdity in that whatsoever. Not saying it won't happen. But let's see how he does, first, before jumping to that conclusion. That's all.

Edit: Better offensive option, yes. Not denying that. Better faceoff option..that's the only thing I question at this point.


Last edited by FrailSwan: 01-17-2013 at 12:42 AM.
FrailSwan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 12:44 AM
  #155
BigG44
Registered User
 
BigG44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 22,091
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by FrailSwan View Post
So because he wins faceoffs in the AHL he's automatically going to have success in the NHL? I don't see any absurdity in that whatsoever. Not saying it won't happen. But let's see how he does, first, before jumping to that conclusion. That's all.
No one was jumping to a conclusion. A players performance in the AHL is the exact information GMJN or Gaglardi or any one in hockey for that matter would use to project a player.

You're not going to bring Luke Gazdic up if you need someone to score goals. You bring up Matt Fraser.

The thing that was absurd to me is that anyone would question using AHL performance to project NHL roles. Essentially what you're saying is that we shouldn't put someone in a position they've succeeded in at lower levels. There's just a total disconnect there for me.

BigG44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 12:48 AM
  #156
BigG44
Registered User
 
BigG44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 22,091
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by FrailSwan View Post
Edit: Better offensive option, yes. Not denying that. Better faceoff option..that's the only thing I question at this point.
With this added note ... that has nothing to do with my point. I never insinuated his faceoff ability was better.

The point I made is that essentially removing yourself from the PP by throwing a useless offensive piece on the ice is poor coaching. It's now 4 on 4 and a faceoff specialist.

BigG44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 12:48 AM
  #157
Cin
Eurosnob.
 
Cin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Country: Thailand
Posts: 7,905
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by FrailSwan View Post
So because he wins faceoffs in the AHL he's automatically going to have success in the NHL? I don't see any absurdity in that whatsoever. Not saying it won't happen. But let's see how he does, first, before jumping to that conclusion. That's all.

Edit: Better offensive option, yes. Not denying that. Better faceoff option..that's the only thing I question at this point.
I see the point that you're trying to make, but there is absolutely no situation on any team in this league where Fiddler is a PP option. It also shows just how ****ing horrible our puck retention in the offensive zone is. If our only hope is just by winning the faceoffs when we've got an extra man out, then there's much more than a faceoff problem. Which it appears there is.

If the power play isn't over 20% this season, Gully is gone.

Cin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 12:50 AM
  #158
BigG44
Registered User
 
BigG44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 22,091
vCash: 500
.. and honestly just one more knock on Fiddler.

We're talking about a "faceoff specialist" that was just 50.9% last year. Not very special.

BigG44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 12:51 AM
  #159
MetalGodAOD
Moderator
Star Rangers
 
MetalGodAOD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: New York City
Country: United States
Posts: 13,251
vCash: 500
Its pretty obvious Fiddler is just a placeholder.

MetalGodAOD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 12:54 AM
  #160
LatvianTwist
Global Moderator
 
LatvianTwist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Houston
Country: Tibet
Posts: 18,535
vCash: 500
A good sign, IMO, if that's all he is.

LatvianTwist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 12:57 AM
  #161
BigG44
Registered User
 
BigG44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 22,091
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MetalGodAOD View Post
Its pretty obvious Fiddler is just a placeholder.
Placeholder or not, my issue is there are useful options on the roster, and this isn't one of them. If Benn is signed tomorrow, you're probably looking at him still missing Saturday's game which means there's serious consideration for Fiddler playing on the PP in games that matter. That's silly. I want nothing more than for it to work out because I do want the Stars to start strong. We have over 500 games of NHL experience to point to though as legitimate concern Fiddler brings no value to the main goal of the PP ... scoring.

BigG44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 12:59 AM
  #162
MetalGodAOD
Moderator
Star Rangers
 
MetalGodAOD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: New York City
Country: United States
Posts: 13,251
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigG44 View Post
Desperate is a stretch. He has a more offensive option in Eakin who was winning plenty of faceoffs in the games I watched this year.

The argument isn't that Dallas needs to be concerned about winning the faceoff. The issue is that Gulutzan is once again hesitant to use a rookie with offensive upside instead of a veteran who clearly has no business to be on the PP.

Being gun shy in the NHL doesn't cut it. He needs to learn to develop players and trust them or he's not going to be around long. It's very clear what direction GMJN and Gaglardi want to see this team go. They haven't been talking up these young players for nothing. They want to be a team built from within. That' means sucking it up and dealing with the occasional blunders of a young player
.
I'd agree with this completely. Gulutzan's reliance on his veterans is the most frustrating part about his coaching. The fact he basically gives guys like Morrow and Fiddler a free pass because "the kids who've been skating will of course look better" is bogus. If the kids look better, they deserve the spot.

MetalGodAOD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 01:00 AM
  #163
LatvianTwist
Global Moderator
 
LatvianTwist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Houston
Country: Tibet
Posts: 18,535
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigG44 View Post
Placeholder or not, my issue is there are useful options on the roster, and this isn't one of them. If Benn is signed tomorrow, you're probably looking at him still missing Saturday's game which means there's serious consideration for Fiddler playing on the PP in games that matter. That's silly. I want nothing more than for it to work out because I do want the Stars to start strong. We have over 500 games of NHL experience to point to though as legitimate concern Fiddler brings no value to the main goal of the PP ... scoring.
Why...?

LatvianTwist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 01:05 AM
  #164
BigG44
Registered User
 
BigG44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 22,091
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LatvianTwist View Post
Why...?
He hasn't played in over a month, and I doubt the team risks just throwing him into game action and full contact. More importantly, he's not even in Dallas. If the deal's signed tomorrow .. there's now a rush to book a flight and actually get to the city. The practice is late tomorrow which is helpful, but it's doubtful he'd make it in time. Now you're looking at one practice before a game.

I left it open for the possibility since obviously this season could be a bit unpredictable, but it just doesn't seem like a safe move ... and that's not a Dallas move. They're overly cautious at times which isn't necessarily a bad thing all the time.

My point is today seemed like a reasonable deadline to get him signed and in Saturday's game, and I believe several media members have mentioned this soft deadline referring to other RFAs as well.

BigG44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 01:13 AM
  #165
FrailSwan
A-B-We Stole Your C
 
FrailSwan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Dallas
Country: United States
Posts: 3,362
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cin View Post
I see the point that you're trying to make, but there is absolutely no situation on any team in this league where Fiddler is a PP option. It also shows just how ****ing horrible our puck retention in the offensive zone is. If our only hope is just by winning the faceoffs when we've got an extra man out, then there's much more than a faceoff problem. Which it appears there is.

If the power play isn't over 20% this season, Gully is gone.
Never, ever, ever. I really hope this doesn't actually happen.

And isn't Fraser doing the PP?

FrailSwan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 01:19 AM
  #166
FrailSwan
A-B-We Stole Your C
 
FrailSwan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Dallas
Country: United States
Posts: 3,362
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigG44 View Post
He hasn't played in over a month, and I doubt the team risks just throwing him into game action and full contact. More importantly, he's not even in Dallas. If the deal's signed tomorrow .. there's now a rush to book a flight and actually get to the city. The practice is late tomorrow which is helpful, but it's doubtful he'd make it in time. Now you're looking at one practice before a game.

I left it open for the possibility since obviously this season could be a bit unpredictable, but it just doesn't seem like a safe move ... and that's not a Dallas move. They're overly cautious at times which isn't necessarily a bad thing all the time.

My point is today seemed like a reasonable deadline to get him signed and in Saturday's game, and I believe several media members have mentioned this soft deadline referring to other RFAs as well.
Assuming he gets here in time and wants to play, he might not have played in a month but he's still been doing practices and drills with the Victoria Royals to stay in shape. It wouldn't be any more of a risk than the rest of the guys. The biggest factor going against him will be the getting back here portion.

FrailSwan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 01:23 AM
  #167
LatvianTwist
Global Moderator
 
LatvianTwist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Houston
Country: Tibet
Posts: 18,535
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigG44 View Post
He hasn't played in over a month, and I doubt the team risks just throwing him into game action and full contact. More importantly, he's not even in Dallas. If the deal's signed tomorrow .. there's now a rush to book a flight and actually get to the city. The practice is late tomorrow which is helpful, but it's doubtful he'd make it in time. Now you're looking at one practice before a game.

I left it open for the possibility since obviously this season could be a bit unpredictable, but it just doesn't seem like a safe move ... and that's not a Dallas move. They're overly cautious at times which isn't necessarily a bad thing all the time.

My point is today seemed like a reasonable deadline to get him signed and in Saturday's game, and I believe several media members have mentioned this soft deadline referring to other RFAs as well.
I really hope he plays (and signs first)

Going mostly to see Jagr, but Benn is my favorite player too. Oh well.

I don't know what to make of Gully anymore... I'm not going to read into these combos too much though, we'll see what we get on Saturday.

LatvianTwist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 06:46 AM
  #168
Modo
Global Moderator
Mo'Benn
 
Modo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Etobicoke
Country: Canada
Posts: 43,123
vCash: 50
Surely Wade Redden will cure what ails us!



(He's still likely a better option out there than Fiddler!)

__________________
If you're telekinetic and you know it, clap my hands!
Modo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 09:55 AM
  #169
Alistar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Country: Azores
Posts: 9,188
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cin View Post
I see the point that you're trying to make, but there is absolutely no situation on any team in this league where Fiddler is a PP option. It also shows just how ****ing horrible our puck retention in the offensive zone is. If our only hope is just by winning the faceoffs when we've got an extra man out, then there's much more than a faceoff problem. Which it appears there is.

If the power play isn't over 20% this season, Gully is gone.
uhhh there were like 3 teams last year that had power play percentages of over 20%. It's easier said then done. 18% is a probably a good goal to shoot for - that would be a massive improvement over last season.

Alistar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 09:59 AM
  #170
The Frugal Gourmet
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: New York, New York
Posts: 2,529
vCash: 500
Baby steps. Let's shoot for 14% for now.

Also, I'm going to suggest that Fiddler and Morrow are on the power play not because of Glen's love of veterans, but because these guys are actually better.


Last edited by The Frugal Gourmet: 01-17-2013 at 10:06 AM.
The Frugal Gourmet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 12:29 PM
  #171
Czech Your Math
Registered User
 
Czech Your Math's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: bohemia
Country: Czech_ Republic
Posts: 3,755
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alistar View Post
uhhh there were like 3 teams last year that had power play percentages of over 20%. It's easier said then done. 18% is a probably a good goal to shoot for - that would be a massive improvement over last season.
Exactly, came here to post that.

They were last in the league with 13.5 PP% last season, have some new top 6 forwards, Benn is unsigned, perhaps not the best point men on D.
League average (17-18%) seems a fair, but still ambitious goal.

Czech Your Math is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 02:30 PM
  #172
Cin
Eurosnob.
 
Cin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Country: Thailand
Posts: 7,905
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alistar View Post
uhhh there were like 3 teams last year that had power play percentages of over 20%. It's easier said then done. 18% is a probably a good goal to shoot for - that would be a massive improvement over last season.
With the team we have it's VERY doable.

Whitney, Jagr, Benn, Larsen, Goligoski, Eriksson, Morrow.

There's no reason 20% is too much to ask for.

Cin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 04:02 PM
  #173
The Frugal Gourmet
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: New York, New York
Posts: 2,529
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cin View Post
With the team we have it's VERY doable.

Whitney, Jagr, Benn, Larsen, Goligoski, Eriksson, Morrow.

There's no reason 20% is too much to ask for.
Not good enough from the point. Not tough enough in front of the net, although Morrow having a rebound season would really help.

I noticed you forgot Roy, though. He's quite talented. And Ryder.

The Frugal Gourmet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 04:03 PM
  #174
Cin
Eurosnob.
 
Cin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Country: Thailand
Posts: 7,905
vCash: 500
Considering they brought Goli in to help the transition game and the PP, he better show up.

Score 1 in every 5 PP's. Shouldn't be that hard, shoot for the moon or you won't get anywhere.

Cin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-17-2013, 04:08 PM
  #175
The Frugal Gourmet
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: New York, New York
Posts: 2,529
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cin View Post
Considering they brought Goli in to help the transition game and the PP, he better show up.

Score 1 in every 5 PP's. Shouldn't be that hard, shoot for the moon or you won't get anywhere.

That's a lot of presure on Goli and odds are he won't deliver. They took a chance that he might have a bigger upside someday (still might), but I would not bank on it or assume this is a suddenly a top 3 power play in the league.

The Frugal Gourmet is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:17 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2015 All Rights Reserved.