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Using the term "WE" when referring to our team

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Old
10-22-2011, 01:58 AM
  #51
Kimota
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Max Levine View Post
We identify ourselves to our community. The team represents our city just like our amateur athletes represent our country. On the other hand, it's "we" when we win; "they" when they lose.


Exactly

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10-22-2011, 04:36 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by 24stanleycups View Post
We are as much a part of the team as the players. Without us there is no team. We give them the money they need to play. If you say "we are on a ten game losing streak", than ofcoarse you deserve to say "WE WON THE CUP!!"
I understand the writer's point, he's clever. But I have no problem with using 'we', it's emotional. Though I usually use Habs. And I use nicknames because they're fun, and I don't have to type Paciaortetty. See, I blew it! Max or Patches is fine, and he probably does not mind either. He probably likes it.

However: I draw the line at interest in player's personal lives, and I would never ever bother a player in public, for any reason. It is not appropriate, and it's creepy if you're over 12 years old.

Lastly, the NHL is a club of teams that play hockey. It is a league, and it's origin was to play the game, not to have fans and sell merchandise. You need to have a sense of history. Great hockey players would still form teams and play even if no one at all watched them. Never forget this.

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Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
One of my pet peeves too. Agree with both the author and with Agnostic.

Particularly ticks me off to hear parents use the first person plural when referring to their kids' teams. Figure they ought to put a number on their own backs and get down to it themselves rather than trying to live through eight-year-olds.

Same holds true for folks using "we" and "us" when referring to favorite teams for which they do not play, work or in which they do not hold an equity stake.

Must also admit to being baffled as to why anyone beyond grade school age would want to wear a team sweater to a game. The guy with Aveuglette on the back of his Canadiens sweater gets marks for creativity though.

As to those that wear gear from teams not even playing in the game they're attending......
Hee hee. I can't stand this either, and I suspect you were at the Forum with me in 1975, watching the Habs destroy some sad team, while our dads wore suits, and not just in the reds.

It you're an adult, dress like one. I see 45 year old tourists in Beijing, Paris, wearing shorts, sneakers and baseball caps, and smile as they wonder why they don't get treated well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrAzYNiNe View Post
Do you buy tickets? Do you buy merchandise? Does your heart stop when they are in overtime and you see a masterful play about the be completed?

If you don't take pride in being a habs fan, fine. But don't think we (uh oh) should think we aren't a part of the organization. (no fans, you got no team)
Smack on you. Don't assume that because we don't say we, and that we don't wear team jerseys to the game, that we're not as loyal as you. I'd say it might be the other way around. Most of you are newbies. E-mail me when you've been a loyal Habs fan for 43 years. Yeah you love them as much as me, but not more.

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Originally Posted by Agnostic View Post
You've struck at the very heart of Identity Theory and why people use these terms.

Individuals associate themselves with groups who they believe to be in higher social standing (in the case of hockey players superior physically, wealthier, alphas with the opposite sex) . They do it out of needs for their own prestige and self esteem.

It follows that individuals will tighten that association ("we" won) when the team increases in standing, and are willing to cut that association ("they" lost) as it suits their needs to increase the appraisal of their personal value.

Great article to get people thinking.
I like your thinking, and my work requires the same level of thought, but damn dude I just love the HABS! I even use smileys about them! And exclamation marks!!! Don't add complication where none is required!


Last edited by Mike8: 10-22-2011 at 05:44 AM.
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Old
10-22-2011, 05:07 AM
  #53
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So what if I use "we" when talking about the Habs in order to boost my self esteem? Why is that a problem? I watch the habs because I enjoy watching them, especially watching them win. If that's partially because it gives me a self esteem boost or whatever other psychological theory you want to refer to, so what? I thought watching the Canadians was supposed to make me feel good?

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10-22-2011, 06:46 AM
  #54
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With the innordinate amount of $ spent on tickets, I think fans have a friggin right to associate their team with themselves if they so please, no matter how much it irritates some shmoe posing as a grammar Hitlerite.

His examples are weak (movies, books, dear lord - doublehanded facepalm accompanied by a huge sigh -, it's not because they are also in the 'entertainment' category that it means they are similar and effective as a comparison)

Again, all along his diatribe, he consistently forgets that the $ we put in is quite enough to be considered "participation or involvement". Again examples he has given are extremely weak and completely overlooks the fact that most teams that were lost (like the spos an Browns and whatever) was because they didn't have enough fans saying "we we we" la Agent Smith and ponying up the cash so the team survives.

Chris Jones needs to get a life.


And yes, I know this might sound ironic coming from a guy posting comments on a hockey board at 8am on a saturday morning, but hey, I just came home from the graveyard shift and wanted to see if there was a predictable "fire Martin" thread on the board. I wasn't surprised, to say the least.

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Old
10-22-2011, 07:18 AM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justsomeguy View Post
Neofury - Didn't mean to sound smug. Was trying for glib. Read your posts regularly and think we'd probably get on well in real life.

Tickets - Buy em occasionally. Usually up in the rafters thanks to the resale market

Merch - Rarely and when I do it tends to be from teams that no longer exist or minor-league outfits.

OT- Love it, regardless of the teams involved. Doesn't stop my heart but does on occasion cause a rapid intake of breath and/or involuntary muscle contractions.

Pride in being a fan - You got me there. Can't admit to being a fan of any team any longer although I'm definitely more familiar with the Habs than any other team thanks to geography and history.

As to what you think I feel about how you feel about being a part of the organization - Don't apologise for using the word "we" properly. You can hold any opinion you want about pretty much any subject. It's one of the glories of free speech. Unfortunately many folks confuse fact with fantasy and sometimes the most strongly-held opinions are not reality-based.

No fans, you got no team - Or in wider terms, No customers, you got no business. Absolutely right but no matter how many hot dogs you buy, Lafleur's or La Belle Province isn't going to consider you part of their organization unless you are a franchise holder or management employee.

Same holds for the Canadiens, Canadian Tire, Air Canada or any other business.

Do not interpret this as being anti-fan or anti-fandom. Some of my best friends are fans.
Entirely false. Most companies and corporations will say that their clients are part of the 'family'. It would be bad for business to say otherwise (they might think otherwise though, but will never say it out loud).

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10-22-2011, 07:33 AM
  #56
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One thing that got hugely overlooked in this thread is that the 'we' is not only a referal to the team, but to the community of fans. We are together cheering for our team. When we say 'we', it's not just the team, but the fans too. It's not just me and the team, and it's we and the team.

And that bit about self-esteem made me laugh. My self-esteem comes from my ability to adapt and learn and to get through adversity. Hockey is friggin trivial. If anyone is getting their self-esteem from a pro sports team, they probably do not have a strong will and like someone else said, it's a minority, not the majority, and it's a weak generalization, a catch all response that is missing a whole lot of insight into the personal reasons as to why each individual associate themselves with their favorite team in this manner. For me, it's my family, everyone said "we" when speaking of the Habs when I was growing up. Nurture, not nature. I only use we because of the emotional attachment (Habs were bigger than religion in my family) and I use it even when we lose

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Old
10-22-2011, 07:41 AM
  #57
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So he says teams don't need us to survive, and nothing really changes when they don't have us (Marlins)

There are a couple contradictions in that article, terrible comparisons, and generally a very bitter, angry, and tedious man behind the article.

It also doesn't surprise me that a person who, by his own admission, doesn't have a favorite sports team, gets his knickers in a knot with something as tedious as this.


Last edited by RoryDelap: 10-22-2011 at 07:53 AM.
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Old
10-22-2011, 08:56 AM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
Entirely false. Most companies and corporations will say that their clients are part of the 'family'. It would be bad for business to say otherwise (they might think otherwise though, but will never say it out loud).
So we're agreed here. What companies say and what they think/do are often about 180 degrees apart.

Hate to think a family member would charge me 10 bucks for a warm beer after hitting me up for a hundred on the way in, give me a hard time when I returned a wrench or would smile blankly, apologise and then do nothing to help find a suitcase last seen in their hands.

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Old
10-22-2011, 09:16 AM
  #59
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"we are a good team"
"they suck"

I tend to use the we when I'm proud of the team but after a loss, I tend to use they. not even on purpose.

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Old
10-22-2011, 10:27 AM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
Entirely false. Most companies and corporations will say that their clients are part of the 'family'. It would be bad for business to say otherwise (they might think otherwise though, but will never say it out loud).
Some companies have made the psychology of exclusivity very profitable and a central feature of their business model. Think Costco. You have to pay a membership fee to be part of a community that is given "exclusive access" to products that are widely available everywhere. Costco was born from Price Club, a brand that sold memberships initially to government workers, teachers, and certain professionals. Once that took off and the air of prestige was attached to the membership, Costco opened membership up to the masses who clamoured to be a part of the exclusive group. Costco is founded on psychology and nothing more innovative than that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
One thing that got hugely overlooked in this thread is that the 'we' is not only a referal to the team, but to the community of fans. We are together cheering for our team. When we say 'we', it's not just the team, but the fans too. It's not just me and the team, and it's we and the team.

And that bit about self-esteem made me laugh. My self-esteem comes from my ability to adapt and learn and to get through adversity. Hockey is friggin trivial. If anyone is getting their self-esteem from a pro sports team, they probably do not have a strong will and like someone else said, it's a minority, not the majority, and it's a weak generalization, a catch all response that is missing a whole lot of insight into the personal reasons as to why each individual associate themselves with their favorite team in this manner. For me, it's my family, everyone said "we" when speaking of the Habs when I was growing up. Nurture, not nature. I only use we because of the emotional attachment (Habs were bigger than religion in my family) and I use it even when we lose
The fact that your family purposely taught you this trait is proof that it's founded in nature and not in nurture. Obviously making associations with more powerful groups has historically had advantages that was rewarded by evolution.


Last edited by Agnostic: 10-22-2011 at 10:56 AM.
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Old
10-22-2011, 10:28 AM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Capitaine Gionta View Post
I love when people use "we" when the Habs win as in "We won". Then, when the Habs lose, they say "They lost".
As long as people are consistent, who cares. It's examples like you just put up, that are a little awkward. Nobody likes bandwagoners. After all, it's when the team is losing, they are really in need of support from their fans. That's a real sport fan to me, a real supporter, who'll never hack on individual players or boo the team. You can criticize as long as it's constructive. But a supporter will always support, regardless of the standings. They should say "we".

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10-22-2011, 11:00 AM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pavelbure44 View Post
So what if I use "we" when talking about the Habs in order to boost my self esteem? Why is that a problem? I watch the habs because I enjoy watching them, especially watching them win. If that's partially because it gives me a self esteem boost or whatever other psychological theory you want to refer to, so what? I thought watching the Canadians was supposed to make me feel good?
That's the key point and you are totally right ! I will keep using we because it feels good. I will wear a jersey at the game because it feels good. Who is entitled to tell me to use it or not ?

As a basic rule, people are free to do whatever they like to as long as it's not illegal, it does not hurt them (even there...to be discussed) and they don't grief/hurt/damage others.

I am highly annoyed by bandwagonners who use "we" after a victory and "they" after a loss (though I understand this is basic human functioning). Angered even - will I go and attack them ? No - just tolerate my anger, maybe unleash it harmlessly on a internet board and keep on using "we" in real life.

One of the big issue with this world is some people telling other people what they should do , without any other reason but "that's what I would do so it must be the right thing".

So what if you are left handed - you should try to write with the right hand - it is called "right" for a reason.

So what if you think you are gay - you should try a bit harder to be straight then you will become normal.

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10-22-2011, 12:39 PM
  #63
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I think its corny to use the terms "we" and "us" when referring to the teams you support, although I still catch myself doing that the odd time.

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10-22-2011, 03:08 PM
  #64
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If it makes you more comfortable, refer to the team as "They", but understand that the goal of every sports franchise is about establishing a "We" with their fanbase.

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10-22-2011, 03:38 PM
  #65
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For me it's a habit. I've said the words "We", "Our" or even "My" when talking about the Habs many times in the past. "My" seems to come out a lot more when the Habs win for some reason.

I also use those words a lot when I'm online, especially when I'm posting away from the Habs board. It's much easier to make a comment like "I hope we crush the Leafs tonight". Then to say "I hope the Montreal Canadiens (or Habs) beat the Leafs tonight." To me it also shows the person that I'm talking too, that I am a fan of the Habs. That is, if my username and avatar didn't give it away first.

As for wearing jerseys to the game. I don't see a problem with that regardless of your age. The whole point of going to the games is to be entertained and to have fun. If you're having fun wearing a jersey, who is anyone to judge? Especially me, since the majority of the time I'm around my house. I have some kind of Habs apparel on. For example, right now I'm wearing shorts with a Koivu t-shirt and a white Habs baseball cap.

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10-22-2011, 03:55 PM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Newhabfan View Post
That's the key point and you are totally right ! I will keep using we because it feels good. I will wear a jersey at the game because it feels good. Who is entitled to tell me to use it or not ?

As a basic rule, people are free to do whatever they like to as long as it's not illegal, it does not hurt them (even there...to be discussed) and they don't grief/hurt/damage others.

I am highly annoyed by bandwagonners who use "we" after a victory and "they" after a loss (though I understand this is basic human functioning). Angered even - will I go and attack them ? No - just tolerate my anger, maybe unleash it harmlessly on a internet board and keep on using "we" in real life.

One of the big issue with this world is some people telling other people what they should do , without any other reason but "that's what I would do so it must be the right thing".

So what if you are left handed - you should try to write with the right hand - it is called "right" for a reason.

So what if you think you are gay - you should try a bit harder to be straight then you will become normal.
That's called ego projection, and it happens way too much.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Habs10Habs View Post
For me it's a habit. I've said the words "We", "Our" or even "My" when talking about the Habs many times in the past. "My" seems to come out a lot more when the Habs win for some reason.

I also use those words a lot when I'm online, especially when I'm posting away from the Habs board. It's much easier to make a comment like "I hope we crush the Leafs tonight". Then to say "I hope the Montreal Canadiens (or Habs) beat the Leafs tonight." To me it also shows the person that I'm talking too, that I am a fan of the Habs. That is, if my username and avatar didn't give it away first.

As for wearing jerseys to the game. I don't see a problem with that regardless of your age. The whole point of going to the games is to be entertained and to have fun. If you're having fun wearing a jersey, who is anyone to judge? Especially me, since the majority of the time I'm around my house. I have some kind of Habs apparel on. For example, right now I'm wearing shorts with a Koivu t-shirt and a white Habs baseball cap.
Yeah, but you're shorter than Napoleon, so it's no surprise you'd say 'we' to boost your self-esteem through the Habs

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Old
10-22-2011, 03:59 PM
  #67
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first off, who the F is chris jones and why does anyone care about what he has to say?

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10-22-2011, 04:21 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
Yeah, but you're shorter than Napoleon, so it's no surprise you'd say 'we' to boost your self-esteem through the Habs
Haha, well I need all the "boost" to my self-esteem that I can get. I'm married, remember?

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10-22-2011, 05:53 PM
  #69
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Eureka! I've got the answer! Why - it's so obvious!

We, the fans, aren't joiners who've leeched onto the Montreal Canadiens. The Montreal Canadiens have, in fact, joined us.

Each player arrives here, slips on the jersey with the ancient "C" and becomes a link to a rich history stretching back to before they were born. As individuals, without the city and legacy, they're just a pickup team of this year's mercenaries. Players, coaches and brass have been coming and going in constant flux for a century -- but the Canadiens existed before they arrive and they'll exist after they leave. Each person who joins the Canadiens joins something bigger than a salary or personal accomplishments -- they've jumped onto the proudest bandwagon in hockey history. It's a history that's bigger than a single season or a single GM, and it's even bigger than a single owner.

And who's the flag bearer for that history? Who's the only thread connecting Gionta to Koivu to Roy to Lafleur to Beliveau to Richard? Who's the single witness to all 24 Stanley Cups? Who fills the Forum and Bell Centre and funds the team's existence? It ain't a player, coach or owner -- they're caretakers. It's us, the fans. "We" are the Canadiens more than any person. "We" were here before Gauthier and Molson, and "we" are STILL here decades after Pollack and Blake. "We" keep the flame lit, because without us there is no revenue, no loyalty. Without us, nobody's home.

We root for them, we pay for them, we remember their past, we honour their present. If the Montreal Canadiens aren't "Our" team, well, there's nobody else who can lay a better claim.


Last edited by Lshap: 10-22-2011 at 07:15 PM.
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