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The Pittsburgher Thread: Up With Montana

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Old
10-24-2011, 07:31 AM
  #26
SuburbanRhythm
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Originally Posted by sniugneP View Post
I think Miami or St Louis is getting Andrew Luck. I know St Louis have Bradford but I think they will try to trade him first if they get first pick. I don't see Indy will finish worst record when the season is done. I know Indy were disastrous last night but they have better players than Miami and St Louis.
While I think Luck will be better than Bradford, not sure the Rams would take Luck.

First, they need a trade partner to take Bradford. Keep in mind that Bradford was drafted under the old CBA, so his contract is one of those ridiculous 7 year $65M things. Moving him 3 years in would accelerate the signing bonus cap hit all to the 2012 season. Combine with what they'd shell out to Luck (less under the new system, but still a nice chunk of change).

Not certain the owners will be thrilled with the idea of letting the $30M they paid a few years earlier walk away, and pay another $15M on top of it this year.

Second, I'm curious to see what other teams would be willing to move for Luck. Carson Palmer just got a 1st and a 2nd (don't see the Raiders as a playoff team, that 2013 pick looks to be a 2nd).

To move up from say somewhere else in the top 10 to #1, you are getting a 2012 1st, 2012 2nd, 2013 1st, +. And conceiveably, that 2013 pick is still top 12-15, unless that team is only a QB away from being a contender.

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10-24-2011, 07:44 AM
  #27
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Yeah, it will be difficult to find a taker for Bradford. If Rams get first pick, Miami may be willing to take Bradford. The problem is I don't think Miami is willing to give up a second pick in first round. Rams have a lot of weaknesses in other positions, so I think they will draft a different player. But if Miami pick second and Indy pick third, I wouldn't be surprised if Indy trade up to first pick with Rams to get Luck.

Andrew Luck is a best prospect in 2012 draft without a question. There is a chance he won't be drafted as first pick.

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10-24-2011, 08:20 AM
  #28
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I wouldn't be surprised if Luck Eli Manning's his way out of Indy if they try to draft him. I know the Colts owner said he'd love to draft him and have him sit behind Peyton for 4 years like Rodgers/Favre, but Rodgers had no leverage as a late 1st rounder and I really don't see Luck being interested in the sitting for 4 years thing. He'd probably try to negotiate his way somewhere else. Indy will still get a king's ransom if they have that pick though.
San Diego got Phillip Rivers, Shawne Merriman, and Nate Kaeding for Eli Manning. All 3 were in the Pro Bowl at the same time too, I believe.

Colts should take Luck if they have the chance.

And maybe it's just me, but I don't care how good I am, if I got the opportunity to play behind the best QB EVER. I'd do it. I'm still getting paid 5 million a year, I'll still probably get some snaps, and that's a relationship I'll have that will help me for 20 years. It's like being in business, having a question that you need answered, and shooting Warren Buffet a text message for an answer.

It's hard to sacrifice present for the future, but Luck sitting behind someone would be an awesome situation for him. Not to mention how much it would save his body because where ever he goes, he's going to get clobbered.


People also forget, Aaron Rodgers was in the #1 overall discussion. He was that good then. Team's just didn't need QB's. I think those years sitting have helped make him one of the best in the league.


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10-24-2011, 08:26 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by sniugneP View Post
Yeah, it will be difficult to find a taker for Bradford. If Rams get first pick, Miami may be willing to take Bradford. The problem is I don't think Miami is willing to give up a second pick in first round. Rams have a lot of weaknesses in other positions, so I think they will draft a different player. But if Miami pick second and Indy pick third, I wouldn't be surprised if Indy trade up to first pick with Rams to get Luck.

Andrew Luck is a best prospect in 2012 draft without a question. There is a chance he won't be drafted as first pick.
If STL gets the #1 overall, I'd put that pick up for a King's ransom. They will get it too. Bradford is good enough to build around, though, it definitely not becomes a money question.

Bradford signed for what? 60 million? Luck will be locked up for somewhere in the 20's. Big, big cost savings.

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10-24-2011, 08:37 AM
  #30
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I don't hear any complaining about LaMarr Woodley's contract. What gives?

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10-24-2011, 08:40 AM
  #31
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It used to be that some teams didn't want to trade up to get a top 5 pick because the salary cost was too high. Now with new rookie wage scale, I think you see more and more teams trade picks on draft day.

It should be interesting if Rams get first overall pick. With Miami or Indy, it would be no brainer for them to pick Luck. I'm curious...who are top 5 prospects for 2012 draft? I haven't seen Kiper's or McShay's projections yet.

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10-24-2011, 08:43 AM
  #32
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San Diego got Phillip Rivers, Shawne Merriman, and Nate Kaeding for Eli Manning. All 3 were in the Pro Bowl at the same time too, I believe.

Colts should take Luck if they have the chance.

And maybe it's just me, but I don't care how good I am, if I got the opportunity to play behind the best QB EVER. I'd do it. I'm still getting paid 5 million a year, I'll still probably get some snaps, and that's a relationship I'll have that will help me for 20 years. It's like being in business, having a question that you need answered, and shooting Warren Buffet a text message for an answer.

It's hard to sacrifice present for the future, but Luck sitting behind someone would be an awesome situation for him. Not to mention how much it would save his body because where ever he goes, he's going to get clobbered.



People also forget, Aaron Rodgers was in the #1 overall discussion. He was that good then. Team's just didn't need QB's. I think those years sitting have helped make him one of the best in the league.
I don't see this as an issue for Luck. If he was concerned with playing time, $, etc, he would have come out last year when he still would have been the #1 pick.

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10-24-2011, 08:47 AM
  #33
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Andrew Luck, Matt Kalil, Landry Jones are the 3 guys that I think will stay towards the top all year.

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10-24-2011, 08:52 AM
  #34
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I just can't imagine playing time won't be an issue with Luck. It's fine and good to sit and learn behind a legend like Peyton Manning for a year, but 4 years or whatever the Colts owner is talking about? I just can't see the kid wanting to sit that long. Players want to play.

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10-24-2011, 08:55 AM
  #35
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I don't see this as an issue for Luck. If he was concerned with playing time, $, etc, he would have come out last year when he still would have been the #1 pick.
Absolutely. Didn't think about that. Well said.

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10-24-2011, 08:57 AM
  #36
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I just can't imagine playing time won't be an issue with Luck. It's fine and good to sit and learn behind a legend like Peyton Manning for a year, but 4 years or whatever the Colts owner is talking about? I just can't see the kid wanting to sit that long. Players want to play.
They do. And I completely understand that. I think Luck is a smart guy though. What does he lose sitting behind Peyton and learning? He collects a check, he soaks everything in, he let's that team get better, he preserves his body, and then he gets the keys handed to him in 3-4 years, and maybe sooner with Peyton's injury.

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10-24-2011, 09:07 AM
  #37
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They do. And I completely understand that. I think Luck is a smart guy though. What does he lose sitting behind Peyton and learning? He collects a check, he soaks everything in, he let's that team get better, he preserves his body, and then he gets the keys handed to him in 3-4 years, and maybe sooner with Peyton's injury.
I'd be very impressed if he sat and learned for a few years behind Peyton and didn't complain. I'll have to see it to believe it though. Some really nice guys become divas when you **** with their playing time.

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10-24-2011, 10:07 AM
  #38
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I'd be very impressed if he sat and learned for a few years behind Peyton and didn't complain. I'll have to see it to believe it though. Some really nice guys become divas when you **** with their playing time.
People who say Luck is a "smart guy" aren't doing justice to the situation. The dude is really, really smart, and he's playing a long game. He certainly knows that studying at the feet of Peyton Manning for a couple years will make him a better QB in the long run than going to a team like Miami, that has no offense and a crumbling defense, and getting knocked around starting from Day 1.

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10-24-2011, 10:13 AM
  #39
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I could understand a top rated rookie being a little meh on sitting behind a stopgap (like Stafford behind Culpepper). That's just dumb because that rookie knows he can do about the same job, or better.

When you're behind the best QB ever...little different situation. In that instance, you're getting a 500 level course on how to be a professional QB.

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10-24-2011, 10:24 AM
  #40
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Yeah, as long as Peyton is okay with it. We all know that Favre and Rodgers didn't get along from Day 1.

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10-24-2011, 10:29 AM
  #41
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Yeah, as long as Peyton is okay with it. We all know that Favre and Rodgers didn't get along from Day 1.
Peyton doesn't strike me as a guy who would get upset by something like that. I also think Peyton has seen his own mortality (not in the life or death sense, but in terms of his career) this season. Even if Peyton had a problem with it, Luck could be sold as an insurance policy incase Peyton's neck decides to do something goofy again.

Peyton also doesn't strike me as a guy like Farve who will try to hold on to the last strands of his career with a death grip. I could see Peyton hanging them up while he is still a great QB. I think once he falls off his pedestal as the best in the game...he will quit.

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10-24-2011, 10:34 AM
  #42
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Peyton doesn't strike me as a guy who would get upset by something like that. I also think Peyton has seen his own mortality (not in the life or death sense, but in terms of his career) this season. Even if Peyton had a problem with it, Luck could be sold as an insurance policy incase Peyton's neck decides to do something goofy again.

Peyton also doesn't strike me as a guy like Farve who will try to hold on to the last strands of his career with a death grip. I could see Peyton hanging them up while he is still a great QB. I think once he falls off his pedestal as the best in the game...he will quit.
Peyton doesn't need to stick around forever to get enormous aggregate numbers like Favre, because Manning is one of the most efficient QBs of all time, and is famous for it. Favre wasn't.

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10-24-2011, 10:37 AM
  #43
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Peyton doesn't need to stick around forever to get enormous aggregate numbers like Favre, because Manning is one of the most efficient QBs of all time, and is famous for it. Favre wasn't.
Right. And I think Manning has been pretty undisputedly the best QB in the league. Favre was never really at that level.

People will bring up Brady, but that team has won without Brady. The Colts are top 5 draft pick team without Manning.

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10-24-2011, 11:04 AM
  #44
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Yeah, you may be right. Peyton never had a good backup QB behind him in his whole career. Now if he gets hurt in Week 3 next year and Luck comes in and plays unbelievably like Newton, what would Indy do when Peyton gets back healthy? I don't envy Indy's position. I mean Peyton still have few years left in him.

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10-24-2011, 11:12 AM
  #45
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Yeah, you may be right. Peyton never had a good backup QB behind him in his whole career. Now if he gets hurt in Week 3 next year and Luck comes in and plays unbelievably like Newton, what would Indy do when Peyton gets back healthy? I don't envy Indy's position. I mean Peyton still have few years left in him.
I always believed you set clear lines. If Peyton gets hurt, Luck comes in and plays well, you play Luck with the assumption that regardless of what he does, it's Peyton's team. You just keep assuring Luck that when Peyton puts an end to his career, it's 100% Luck's team, and it will never be disputed.

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10-24-2011, 01:50 PM
  #46
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Well, I want Luck starts right away, not on sidelines for 2-3 years behind Manning. He's too good for that. I bet Luck saw Newton playing well in NFL on tv and thinking he can start in rookie season next year. Luck is better than Newton in every aspect except maybe running ability (not that Luck is slow). Luck is very intelligent so he can pick up in the playbook better than anyone. I hope Miami or any other team that needs a QB right away will get him. I don't want to see him in Indy. I understand the benefits learning from future Hall of Famer but Luck can do this himself. Sure, there will be some growing pains like Manning did in his rookie year but he gets better eventually.

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10-24-2011, 04:01 PM
  #47
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If the Colts get the first overall, would it really be the best thing for their team to take Luck? them missing Peyton isn't their ONLY reason for them being winless. See:the 62 points they just gave up yesterday.

IMO, if they get #1, they should trade it someone for more picks/players.

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10-24-2011, 04:05 PM
  #48
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No. If they get the 1st overall pick...they should take Kalil.

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10-24-2011, 04:07 PM
  #49
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In the NFL, the only defense is good offense. Get first downs and hold the ball. Actual defense is now a penalty.

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10-24-2011, 04:44 PM
  #50
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if the rams get the @1 pick. they could trade bradford to miami for the 2nd pick plus.

luck and blaylock or luck and Kalil.

2 cornerstones back to back

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