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Old
10-28-2011, 12:50 PM
  #76
joestevens29
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Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
IMO we need to give the all Swede line a chance before we move out Omark. If they gel then let's face it, one of Gagner or Hemsky is toast.
So because 3 guys that can't gel with anyone else end up gelling together we move someone else?

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10-28-2011, 12:51 PM
  #77
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Horcoff, -1, sweet PP time, on for every PK goal against. I remember quite well it being the man he was to be covering scoring in 2 of the cases.

I guess nobody's perfect and this is a game where you capitalize on the mistakes of others. And maybe if you consider all the icetime he's had, his mistakes have been relatively low compared to someone like Omark or Gagner or Peckham. But his passing is absolute crap and he ends up playing most of the time on ice defending because of his errors. Has been my beef with Horcoff for the last 2 years, don't expect it to be getting any better. Wish he was tradeable.
Horcoff's primary role has been to try and shut down the opposing team's best players, being -1 in that role is hardly a bad thing.

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10-28-2011, 12:52 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
So because 3 guys that can't gel with anyone else end up gelling together we move someone else?
And who are Gagner and Belanger gelling with? Or do we just keep playing lines together that have no chemistry so that we are a two line team?

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10-28-2011, 12:52 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by PrV View Post
Horcoff, -1, sweet PP time, on for every PK goal against. I remember quite well it being the man he was to be covering scoring in 2 of the cases.

I guess nobody's perfect and this is a game where you capitalize on the mistakes of others. And maybe if you consider all the icetime he's had, his mistakes have been relatively low compared to someone like Omark or Gagner or Peckham. But his passing is absolute crap and he ends up playing most of the time on ice defending because of his errors. Has been my beef with Horcoff for the last 2 years, don't expect it to be getting any better. Wish he was tradeable.
Big deal if he's on for every PK goal against. How many PK's was he on that didn't score?

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10-28-2011, 12:55 PM
  #80
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And who are Gagner and Belanger gelling with? Or do we just keep playing lines together that have no chemistry so that we are a two line team?
Come on BBO, Gagner just got back from injury. Who has Whitney gelled with, he looked just as brutal.

Belanger is playing a good two-way role in my books. He isn't getting 5mil a year, he's getting 1.8mil. I agree he needs to chip in from time to time, but the offense is a bonus with him.

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10-28-2011, 12:57 PM
  #81
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Against Colorado I dont mind Prv-Lander-Omark as the 4th line turn the third line into a more shutdown Petrell-Belanger-Gagner. Make their even strength icetime pretty similar with that 3rd line getting more PK time, maybe a bit of pp for the 4th.

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10-28-2011, 12:57 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
Big deal if he's on for every PK goal against. How many PK's was he on that didn't score?
Just thought I should add that since it was the man he was covering on one particular PK. Directly his fault. I'm not a big fan of +/- in general, it tells only a fraction of the story. But since we're getting into details.

Besides, it's not Horcoff who's shutting out our opposition, it's our entire team. Goalie, Defense, etc. I'm pretty sure Horcoff is a forward. Forwards are more effective when they're fore-checking and shooting. Not covering the point man, it's the defense's responsibility to cover the opposition scoring forwards. Don't give Horcoff too much credit now.

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10-28-2011, 01:00 PM
  #83
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Despite our defensive performance, it seemed to me we were outplayed for much of game, these rope-a-dope tactics will only get you so far in this league, and we cannot in all seriousness expect to win every game 2-1. We need to tinker with the bottom 9 and see if we can get some chemistry going to boost offensive production. That being said I still love the Oilers play so far this year, we just need to try continuously improving, there is nothing wrong with that.


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Old
10-28-2011, 01:01 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by PrV View Post
Just thought I should add that since it was the man he was covering on one particular PK. Directly his fault. I'm not a big fan of +/- in general, it tells only a fraction of the story. But since we're getting into details.

Besides, it's not Horcoff who's shutting out our opposition, it's our entire team. Goalie, Defense, etc. I'm pretty sure Horcoff is a forward. Forwards are more effective when they're fore-checking and shooting. Not covering the point man, it's the defense's responsibility to cover the opposition scoring forwards. Don't give Horcoff too much credit now.
I'm not worried about a regular on a PK making a mistake and resulting in a goal at this point. They've done a ton more good than bad.

Fine don't give Horcoff defensive credit, but he has 5 points in 9 games.

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10-28-2011, 01:03 PM
  #85
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These should be the lines for tonight:

Hall/RNH/Eberle (Nothing to be said)
Smyth/Horcoff/Gagner (Need more offense on this line)
Paajarvi/Lander/Omark (The one shift that PRV and Lander were together last night was the only time that I had noticed them offensively for the whole game)
Eager/Belanger/Jones (Good energy line)

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10-28-2011, 01:05 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
I'm not worried about a regular on a PK making a mistake and resulting in a goal at this point. They've done a ton more good than bad.

Fine don't give Horcoff defensive credit, but he has 5 points in 9 games.
I'll give him 3 points, since I don't think he has any business being on the PP.

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10-28-2011, 01:05 PM
  #87
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GO Oilers!

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Old
10-28-2011, 01:06 PM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PrV View Post
I'll give him 3 points, since I don't think he has any business being on the PP.
LOL

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10-28-2011, 01:07 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by PrV View Post
I'll give him 3 points, since I don't think he has any business being on the PP.
Lol. But when Omark is on there and gets no points all of a sudden a guy like Horcoff who is producing shouldn't be there?

Also who's been standing in front on the PP lately that resulted in some goals?

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10-28-2011, 01:08 PM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gags and Gilby View Post
These should be the lines for tonight:

Hall/RNH/Eberle (Nothing to be said)
Smyth/Horcoff/Gagner (Need more offense on this line)
Paajarvi/Lander/Omark (The one shift that PRV and Lander were together last night was the only time that I had noticed them offensively for the whole game)
Eager/Belanger/Jones (Good energy line)

The only problem I have is that Gagner was noticeably bad last night, and I would be hesitant to promote him. This sends the wrong message, and I feel like Petrell should be given a shot (though he hasn't played fantastically either) because he has played fantastically. It doesn't make sense to bench him for Omark

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10-28-2011, 01:08 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by Hope4theFuture View Post
LOL
Oh come on, like a 2nd assist on the powerplay with The Nuge and Eberle is anything to be proud of. A doorknob could have gotten that assist.

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10-28-2011, 01:10 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
Lol. But when Omark is on there and gets no points all of a sudden a guy like Horcoff who is producing shouldn't be there?

Also who's been standing in front on the PP lately that resulted in some goals?
I don't wanna talk about Horcoff anymore. I just hope his minutes are reduced because he's going to make more mistakes than usual tonight with his crusty old deteriorating body playing 2 games in 2 nights with a plane ride in between. Less minutes plz Renney, Horcoff forcing us into a backcheck is a sure way to lose tonight.

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10-28-2011, 01:16 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by PrV View Post
Just thought I should add that since it was the man he was covering on one particular PK. Directly his fault. I'm not a big fan of +/- in general, it tells only a fraction of the story. But since we're getting into details.

Besides, it's not Horcoff who's shutting out our opposition, it's our entire team. Goalie, Defense, etc. I'm pretty sure Horcoff is a forward. Forwards are more effective when they're fore-checking and shooting. Not covering the point man, it's the defense's responsibility to cover the opposition scoring forwards. Don't give Horcoff too much credit now.

holy toledo.

Horcoff has done the heavy lifting all year and fans still arnt happy.

Theres just no accounting for opinions.

On a side not, there may be an opportunity to make this line more capable of playing defence in the other teams zone if Hemsky can slot in for Jones.

Its interesting times in Edmonton for sure.

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10-28-2011, 01:16 PM
  #94
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Now that I think about it, I'd like to see these lines:
Hall-Nuge-Eberle
Smyth-Belanger-Gagner
Paajarvi-Horcoff-Omark
Eager-Lander-Jones

Belanger's more than capable of taking on the toughest opposition in Horc's place. Horc gets a bit of a rest by focusing more on offense with Paajarvi and Omark. Belanger hasn't really produced much with those guys, but has been a very good defensive centre so far-- so why not throw him out with Smytty, and then put Gagner on that line because he's been keeping his check very well defensively so far, and can also give that line a better offensive kick than Jonesy can. Also gives Jonesy a bit of a rest.

Put Omark in for Petrell-- he needs to get in, and Petrell's useful on the PK, but given that Colorado's a highly offensive team, Edmonton will probably need to focus more on offense than PK tonight-- plus, there are still 4 good options for the PK in the lineup with Petrell out. Hopefully the Swedish wingers alongside Horc can get some chemistry and play defensively responsible.

Eager-Lander-Jonesy-- a line that can still play 10+ minutes, be highly physical, and possibly even kick in a goal.

In short, on a back-to-back game, you give a lighter assignment to Horc and Jones, give Gagner a bit more responsibility now that he's got his legs under him, increase Belanger's role by a couple minutes, and throw Omark in to produce a bit more offense and give Petrell a rest.

But...y'know, I think Renney's gonna keep going with what's been working for the most part. If the game starts to get higher scoring though, I hope he switches it up.

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10-28-2011, 01:17 PM
  #95
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I'll give him 3 points, since I don't think he has any business being on the PP.
Good thing you arnt coaching.

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10-28-2011, 01:18 PM
  #96
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Again, I'll be very impressed if we get a point... especially since we just played yesterday(or just today for me.. it's 2am) I want MPS and Gagner to get more minutes.

MPS-Horcoff-Gagner should be our second line.

Smyth-Belanger-Jones would still be a good checking line in comparison. Horcoff is better offensively even when he's brutally useless. Get this through your head Renny: If MPS doesn't get the minutes he isn't going to produce. If you want him to play well you need to give him a reason to play with confidence. Screw you. You're poisoning Gagner and MPS.

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10-28-2011, 01:19 PM
  #97
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As expected Dubnyk will start.

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10-28-2011, 01:20 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
Lol. But when Omark is on there and gets no points all of a sudden a guy like Horcoff who is producing shouldn't be there?

Also who's been standing in front on the PP lately that resulted in some goals?
Horcoff standing in front of the net instead of Smyth, Jones or even Lander is the reason why our PP isnt near the top of the league.

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10-28-2011, 01:23 PM
  #99
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Originally Posted by AM View Post
holy toledo.

Horcoff has done the heavy lifting all year and fans still arnt happy.

Theres just no accounting for opinions.

On a side not, there may be an opportunity to make this line more capable of playing defence in the other teams zone if Hemsky can slot in for Jones.

Its interesting times in Edmonton for sure.
Horcoff has been great as a checking line player.. Most fans just dont want him on the first unit PP. Reduces his minutes and gives a more 'offensive' player a chance on the PP.

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10-28-2011, 01:27 PM
  #100
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Oh come on, like a 2nd assist on the powerplay with The Nuge and Eberle is anything to be proud of. A doorknob could have gotten that assist.
A point is a point. Horcoff has actually done ok for himself on the PP, winning some faceoffs, screening the goalie and also getting a couple of points.

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