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So will Sutton be suspended for multiple games on his Landeskog hit tonight?

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10-29-2011, 12:24 PM
  #101
Pepper
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He didn't target the head, he simply hit him and Landeskog's head simply was the first point of impact.

In fact, it would have been physically impossible for Sutton to hit anything but the head given his height and the position of Landeskog.

0 games.

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10-29-2011, 12:32 PM
  #102
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This is one of those cases where the hit was to the head, but not the fault of the checking player. Landeskog veered to the left at the instant before the hit, which slowed his forward momentum. That meant that Sutton didn't land the hit on the shoulder, but rather the head.

Note Sutton's bracing for a shoulder-on-shoulder hit and his reaction when Landeskog changed directions. Thus a glancing blow rather than a full-on hit to the head.

As much as I want dangerous hits out of the game, it's tough to sell this as worthy of a suspension.

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10-29-2011, 12:41 PM
  #103
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Those who think it was a dirty/illegal hit, please tell me what choices Sutton had? Other than to avoid the hit altogether because that would have opened up the ice for Landeskog.

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10-29-2011, 12:47 PM
  #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pepper View Post
Those who think it was a dirty/illegal hit, please tell me what choices Sutton had? Other than to avoid the hit altogether because that would have opened up the ice for Landeskog.
Oh give me a break, he had a chance to go for a full clean body check, Landeskog didn't change position before the hit, even Oilers fans say he deserves to be suspended, so I really don't know how can you defend him.

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10-29-2011, 12:56 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by Ivan13 View Post
Oh give me a break, he had a chance to go for a full clean body check, Landeskog didn't change position before the hit, even Oilers fans say he deserves to be suspended, so I really don't know how can you defend him.
No really, tell me what Sutton should have done? Lower himself by 30cm in order not to hit Landeskogs head? It doesn't work that way. Sutton didn't target Landeskog's head because he had no other choice other than avoid the hit completely.

Targeting someone's head means you have the choice hit the opponent to shoulder or some other body part. When you don't have any other choice, it's not targeting.

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10-29-2011, 12:57 PM
  #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pepper View Post
Those who think it was a dirty/illegal hit, please tell me what choices Sutton had? Other than to avoid the hit altogether because that would have opened up the ice for Landeskog.
Sutton could have taken a different angle, Sutton essentially had to lean to his right side to make the hit. He could have gone straight into Landeskog instead of going to the side. Sutton could have changed his elevation, lowering his body and making contact below Landeskog's head, ex hip check.

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10-29-2011, 12:58 PM
  #107
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So youre all experts now huh?

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10-29-2011, 12:59 PM
  #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pepper View Post
No really, tell me what Sutton should have done? Lower himself by 30cm in order not to hit Landeskogs head? It doesn't work that way. Sutton didn't target Landeskog's head because he had no other choice other than avoid the hit completely.

Targeting someone's head means you have the choice hit the opponent to shoulder or some other body part. When you don't have any other choice, it's not targeting.
Not according to the video that the NHL and the Players Health and Safety committee released to all the player before the preseason. Targeting is now defined as intentional or reckless.

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10-29-2011, 01:02 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by awesomo View Post
So youre all experts now huh?

Probably one of the best hockey gimmicks in recent past. Just love it.


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10-29-2011, 01:03 PM
  #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pepper View Post
No really, tell me what Sutton should have done? Lower himself by 30cm in order not to hit Landeskogs head? It doesn't work that way. Sutton didn't target Landeskog's head because he had no other choice other than avoid the hit completely.

Targeting someone's head means you have the choice hit the opponent to shoulder or some other body part. When you don't have any other choice, it's not targeting.
Alternatively he could, you know, have hit Landeskog shoulder on shoulder. Which works really well when you are taller than the guy you are hitting.

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10-29-2011, 01:03 PM
  #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Head Crusher View Post
Sutton could have taken a different angle, Sutton essentially had to lean to his right side to make the hit. He could have gone straight into Landeskog instead of going to the side. Sutton could have changed his elevation, lowering his body and making contact below Landeskog's head, ex hip check.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Head Crusher View Post
Not according to the video that the NHL and the Players Health and Safety committee released to all the player before the preseason. Targeting is now defined as intentional or reckless.
Agree 100% with both of your posts.

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10-29-2011, 01:05 PM
  #112
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Sutton could easily have hit him in the shoulder/body, but hit him in the head instead. This wasn't a situation where Landeskog was sticking his head way out there, or where he moved at the last second. Had Sutton went for a full body hit to Landeskog's shoulder/side this would have been completely fine, instead he went for the glancing headshot, it doesn't get much more clear than that. IMO it seems like a clearly suspendable hit, he'll probably get 2 games or so, especially since he's been suspended in the past. Wouldn't be surprised by more than 2 games either.


Last edited by ponder: 10-29-2011 at 01:10 PM.
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10-29-2011, 01:09 PM
  #113
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Sutton just looked like he missed the hit he wanted to make to me. I think he'll get a short (2 game?) suspension, but it didnt seem malicious. If Sutton was targeting his head on that hit, and intended to hit him hard, that wouldve been career ending.

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10-29-2011, 01:11 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by viktors89 View Post
Elbow? Not even close.

Headshot? Yes.

Suspension? 3 games or so
So your an expert?

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10-29-2011, 01:11 PM
  #115
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Originally Posted by ponder View Post
Sutton could easily have hit him in the shoulder/body, but hit him in the head instead. This wasn't a situation where a guy is sticking his head way out there, had Sutton went for a full body hit to Landeskog's shoulder/side this would have been completely fine, instead he went for the glancing headshot. IMO it seems like a clearly suspendable hit, he'll probably get 2 games or so, especially since he's been suspended in the past.
Really? Is that what a defensman thinks when a forward is coming in on him? "Hey guys, instead of crushing this guy with a clean check, im going to go for a glancing hit to the head. You know, the kind where I either miss and looking foolish, or I kill him and get suspended indefinitely..."

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10-29-2011, 01:20 PM
  #116
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Thank Odin Lando is half viking, hopped right back up ready for battle.

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10-29-2011, 01:24 PM
  #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pepper View Post
He didn't target the head, he simply hit him and Landeskog's head simply was the first point of impact.

In fact, it would have been physically impossible for Sutton to hit anything but the head given his height and the position of Landeskog.

0 games.
Exactly... Sutton couldn't tuck his arm any closer to his body than what he did.

This is one of those tricky ones that contact to the head was made but its still a good hockey hit IMO. Whats Sutton supposed to do role out the red carpet?

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10-29-2011, 01:24 PM
  #118
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That has to be a suspension.

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10-29-2011, 01:24 PM
  #119
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Originally Posted by The Overseer View Post
This thread confirms that a lot of people don't understand the new rules about headshots.

This was a textbook example of what is no longer allowed.

Exactly.....the only debate here is how long is the suspension. If Wiz got 8 games, on a play where no one was hurt, this could easily be 5. Personally I would say 3 or 4.

You can argue about whether you like it or not, but the standard has been set....very clearly.

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10-29-2011, 01:30 PM
  #120
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Originally Posted by Freudian View Post
Alternatively he could, you know, have hit Landeskog shoulder on shoulder. Which works really well when you are taller than the guy you are hitting.
BS. Look at the video. Landeskog turned left just before the hit, had he not done that he would have been caught dead-on (full frontal hit). The moment he did that, the point of impact became his head.

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10-29-2011, 01:32 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by The Head Crusher View Post
Not according to the video that the NHL and the Players Health and Safety committee released to all the player before the preseason. Targeting is now defined as intentional or reckless.
Well, Malone didn't get anything because of the target's actions so I think you're wrong.

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10-29-2011, 01:44 PM
  #122
The Head Crusher
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pepper View Post
Well, Malone didn't get anything because of the target's actions so I think you're wrong.
I am going to redirect you to my previous post on the second page for the full break down of how they determine if it is a suspendable hit or not. The difference between Sutton's hit and Malone's hit is that Ladeskog didn't put himself into a vulnerable position immediately prior to or simultaneously with the hit, Campoli did by lunging for the puck while Malone was already committed to the hit.

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10-29-2011, 01:48 PM
  #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pepper View Post
BS. Look at the video. Landeskog turned left just before the hit, had he not done that he would have been caught dead-on (full frontal hit). The moment he did that, the point of impact became his head.
He may have changed where he was looking but the position of his head does not significantly change.

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10-29-2011, 01:50 PM
  #124
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Originally Posted by The Head Crusher View Post
I am going to redirect you to my previous post on the second page for the full break down of how they determine if it is a suspendable hit or not. The difference between Sutton's hit and Malone's hit is that Ladeskog didn't put himself into a vulnerable position immediately prior to or simultaneously with the hit, Campoli did by lunging for the puck while Malone was already committed to the hit.
Wrong. If Landeskog had not turned left just before the impact, it would have been a full-frontal collision. They way he turned made his head the first point of contact.

So Landeskog's actions just before the hit had an effect.

Note that I wouldn't be surprised to see Sutton disciplined, I just think that he didn't do anything wrong. IMHO it was a clean hit and if NHL starts taking out hits like this (in which the main culprit was the idiot who made the pass), we're going to see a lot less hitting.

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10-29-2011, 01:53 PM
  #125
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Originally Posted by The Head Crusher View Post
He may have changed where he was looking but the position of his head does not significantly change.
He changed his direction just before the hit, he didn't simply change the way he looked.

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