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Revisiting the Halak trade

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Old
10-31-2011, 03:37 PM
  #101
Serenade
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Originally Posted by Zeroknowledge View Post
I guess that defense only shows up to play when Elliott is in nets and thanks for Eller again.

...
Sarcasm aside, is that exactly what happened when Halak stole the show from Price? Defense not playing in front of him, bad bounces etc...I don't get why people need to put down the other guy to make a trade more special.

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10-31-2011, 03:42 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Serenade View Post
Sarcasm aside, is that exactly what happened when Halak stole the show from Price? Defense not playing in front of him, bad bounces etc...I don't get why people need to put down the other guy to make a trade more special.
It was a common theme for people to say "the team plays better when Halak is in net" that season, now its the other way around.

Basically, its an unfounded theory and has no real evidence to back it up.

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10-31-2011, 03:44 PM
  #103
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win-win deal honestly. I watched Halak last night and he was very, very good. St. Louis has hung him out to dry this season. However, they have had some injury problems. In my opinion Payne has to go. St. Louis has a plethora of young talent which are not doing much right now. Are they missing a legitmate scorer? Yes. Do they have depth? Yes. Depth is what you need, plus Pietrangelo has been great. Halak is a good goalie.

Eller is a young man with plenty of potential. I must say, at times I simply say "wow". His skating is elite and he has great size. His passing and stickhandling are fantastic and he also had good vision. His main problem is that he does not have a very good shot. Once his shooting improves, he will be a very hard player to stop. Moreover, his defensive efficiency is astounding, aside from last game againast Boston. Eller is a gem and all will see that soon enough.

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10-31-2011, 03:46 PM
  #104
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Halak has been playing well, only, like Price when he seemingly sucked, his team sucked too.

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10-31-2011, 04:32 PM
  #105
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imo this whole trade works on how well Carey Price played last year and is now starting to pick it up this year. I've been one of the biggest price fans since he was drafted so obvi I was happy when Halak got traded but was even happier when I found out we got Lars Eller. last year he started off slow in his first full season but near the end showed tons of skill the potential is there. This year how ever i have found him to be more dominant with the puck **** travis moen has 4 goals and i think he assisted 2 of them and he blew a laser past rask last game. I think Eller will be a good 2nd line center and possibly take over for plek when pleks gets older. All in all the only reason why this trade works for Montreal is Carey Price has played sooooo well since Halak was traded which has given Lars Eller time to develop properly

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10-31-2011, 04:34 PM
  #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeroknowledge View Post
I remember how after we traded Halak, Pierre Mcguire made it very clear that Montreal got screwed and that Halak is the missing link which will lead the Blues into being solid contenders while Eller is what you see is what you get.

Well I haven't watched Halak so I can't judge him by the numbers, but those numbers are pretty brutal I don't know if the the Blues defense is that bad or is he just having a terrible year, like really really terrible.

As far as Eller goes, wow, yes he only has 3 points but that's with no power play time but you can tell by the way he plays that he is our next number one center, he is a stud playmaker and puck mover, protects the puck like the best power forwards out there he just needs to finish more.

But at this point I'm so glad the Habs got such a steal in Eller.
So you think Halak is brutal because of his numbers, then you go on to say Eller's numbers aren't good but he is a good player? If somebody took the same approach to judging Eller as you do for Halak, they could easily say Eller is terrible.

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Old
10-31-2011, 05:03 PM
  #107
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What are you going to argue that Halak isn't in a less favourable position in St. Louis? They have made the playoffs once in the last 6 years, and got swept in the first round. Their defense is not even comparable to Montreal's when Halak was there.

I am sure he will be "fine," but that is not what you want from a player you gave up your number 1 forward prospect for.
You said "montreal is simply a better team then st.louis". Nothing about being a better "system". The Blues have a pretty good defensive core, including a guy who is pretty much a shoe in for top 5 defenders in the league for the next 10 years.

Looking at the past 5-6 years isn't really a fair comparison, considering the Blues were in a total rebuild. Even then, the Habs have only gotten past the 1/4's twice, and once was against Philly(lost 4-1) and then with..Halak.

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10-31-2011, 05:26 PM
  #108
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Most people only took notice of Halak during that beastly playoff run. He had been very good since he had been called up to back up Huet in MTL. He had off nights, but I think mostly he played well. Maybe a habs fan can clarify?
By all accounts, Halak had a good career with Montreal. He went 7-2 to put Montreal in a playoff spot in his rookie season (and then Montreal subsequently ****ed it up and played the freshly healthy Huet in the final game and he gave up 5 goals and no playoff berth). His second season he was a good backup for Price, helping later in the season when Price starting playing worse. And in his final season he played very well, posting the better stats out of the two, and we all know what happened that year in the playoffs.

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Old
10-31-2011, 05:32 PM
  #109
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Halak stopped Edmonton from running the scoreboard up to like 9 or 10, so I'd say it's more poor team than a poor goalie. It still has worked out well for both sides imo

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10-31-2011, 05:48 PM
  #110
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Steal? What is your definition of steal?

Last time I checked, the Blues got an NHL starting goalie, while Montreal got a prospect who has 20 pts in 86 games.
Last I checked Pacioretty had 37pts in like 100+ games a while back.

Does that mean it wasn't a steal giving up Rivet future wash up and getting Gorges + Pick that landed Pacioretty?

Eller is going to be the next Pacioretty in our system who breaks out and is a beast. Worst case scenario at this point he's a very good 3rd line center. Best case scenario imo a #1b. Most likely scenario a #2 who has size, is good at holding onto the puck and is awesome.

This isn't Nazem Kadri here. Eller has played at bare minimum like a 3rd line center and is progressing big time. When he's on the ice this year he's often the best player. This isn't just habs fan fanboyism. The dude is the real deal. If you want to revisit down the line and call me out go for it but I highly doubt you'll be able to.

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Old
10-31-2011, 05:58 PM
  #111
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Halak is playing like a below average #1 goalie, but he's just 26 and has shown in the past that he can play like an above average #1.

Eller is playing like a good #3 C, but is just 22 and could certainly be a good #2 C in the future. I think it's a stretch to say he'll ever be a good #1 C, shows nice puck protection skills but I don't really see the offensive upside in terms of vision, speed, hands, etc. for him to become a good #1 C. I think he'll be more of an Alex Steen (though able to stay at C since he's not as god awful at faceoffs) than a Mikko Koivu.

If Halak and Eller both hit their stride I can see this panning out as a solid #1 goalie for a solid #2 C. Fine deal for both teams.

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Old
10-31-2011, 06:00 PM
  #112
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He looked good against the Oilers. Make good saves etc, but the team in front of him played really poorly.

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10-31-2011, 06:02 PM
  #113
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Halak is just streaky. He's a great goalie for a 1a 1b situation which is what's going on right now in STL. Our problems are our special teams.

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10-31-2011, 06:12 PM
  #114
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Also, where would Eller have fit in on St. Louis? They already have an excess of young centers in Backes, Berglund and Oshie (Backes and Oshie can play on the wing too, but I believe they're natural Cs), and even if he switched to the wing he'd be competing with guys like Chris Stewart, Alex Steen, D'Agostini, etc. That's not even counting vets like McDonald and Arnott (both natural Cs as well), or top notch prospects like Tarasenko or Scwartz. It would have been very tough for Eller to carve out any sort of long term spot for himself in the Blues' top 6 or even top 9, at C or on the wing.

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10-31-2011, 08:43 PM
  #115
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I'm going to leave Halak's STL play out of this since frankly i've maybe seen him play 2 games since the trade.

From a Montreal standpoint we "won" this trade the moment Gauthier decided to keep Price over Halak. Trading Price at that time would have been a crushing blow.

Now looking at what we got in return. Eller is both overrated and underrated on these boards. I dont ever see him becoming the stud some Habs fans say he will be (he will never be a 1st line center), but anybody that writes him off based on his career NHL stats to date is also out to lunch. I see Eller being a good two way NHLer, probably put up a number of 50 point seasons and should be an average 2nd line center or a very good 3rd. Schultz is kind of insignificant since his upside is likely never going to result in him being an impact player.

I would make this exact trade again tomorrow if i was the Habs. Was there better offers out there? Impossible to say...but i'm happy with how this one has worked out so far.

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10-31-2011, 08:52 PM
  #116
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I think the reason why Habs fan are happy with the deal is that Halak was traded just before he would become an RFA. These boards were full of posts about how :

- trade value for goalies was very low
(all that year goalies were not generating much in trade return)

- trade value for impending RFA's that would not be re-signed was low

That is why getting a great propsect like Eller made Hans fans happy :
because despite his playoff run he had not proven much yet in the NHL and his preceived value was low.

Nobody is saying Eller is is a stud yet.
But the fact that he is steadily progressing and showing signs of being a future stud is great news. Pretty good return in a trade that helped both teams.

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10-31-2011, 09:11 PM
  #117
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Eller is a beast.

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10-31-2011, 09:47 PM
  #118
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Eller is a stud

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10-31-2011, 09:48 PM
  #119
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Eller is a prince

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Old
10-31-2011, 09:50 PM
  #120
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Meanwhile, Eller has made zero saves. I think that means that the Blues won the trade, derrpppp

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10-31-2011, 09:56 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by buddahsmoka1 View Post
St. Louis simply is just not a good of a team as Montreal, and Halak is getting "exposed" because of it.

I knew this was going to happen. Halak needs a strong collapsing defense, and he needs his rebounds cleared. Halak's rebound control is not very good, he is a reactionary goalie who can't use size to his advantage. These type of goalies typically go on hot streaks, but don't maintain dominance season in and season out.

I am not going to go on about who "won this trade," but I was stoked when Halak was traded. Price is the better goalie, and will always be the better goalie from this point on. But it takes a bit to get a young fundamental phenom like Price to get comfortable in the league, but he has reached that threshold.

Eller is straight PIMP. The guy is looking to be a perfect specimen of a centerman that the Habs needed. He has tremendous protection of the puck, is a great stickhandler, and is a smart player. He is extremely impressive at gaining possession of the puck in the defensive zone and leading the breakout. The guy is starting to get stronger on his skates, and is a big boy out there. His shot is also improving, and he is getting a lot of offensive chances as the result of his quality play. He reminds me a lot of Staal, but more gifted offensively.

I loved this trade the moment I saw it, and I love it more now. I couldn't care less about Halak, hes a good goaltender and thanks for the impressive run, but Price is the guy for now and the future.


And did you also fit in there somewhere that he is better than Staal? I don't even know what Staal you mean. It is absolutely ludicrous in 3 ways.

Also, it's been beaten like a dead horse but how can you say you haven't watched Halak play and then compare his value to Eller's by saying his stats don't tell the story? Halak has been fine. Problem with STL is the Blues give up about 12 shots a game but all 12 of them are 2 on 1s or breakaways. I've never seen him have to make an easy save.

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10-31-2011, 09:59 PM
  #122
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Nothing funny about his statement.
There is quite a bit funny about it actually.

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10-31-2011, 10:08 PM
  #123
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I said it from the get-go that it was a genius move by Gauthier. Eller is an absolute stud and we have Price. It is similar to Washington who traded a great player (Varlamov) that they didn't need for a great asset.

Those looking only at the stats, be careful. Halak isn't as bad as his numbers show. And Eller is just on the verge of breaking out... he's outplayed Gomez and Desharnais so far this year, he is our #2 center now. No contest about it. He is also the only talentend center over 6'0 we've had since 1937.
Nothing wrong with a hyperbole... but Béliveau (and Pete Mahovlich) thank you.

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Old
10-31-2011, 10:16 PM
  #124
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Halak's been good, he's a solid starter.

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10-31-2011, 10:18 PM
  #125
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I cringe when I see people do the pimp-their-player-threads on the main board, I cringe harder when it involves my favorite team.

Eller has looked nice this season but is still a big work in progress, there is still a lot of time to revisit this trade, it's not even 2 years old yet.

Slow down maestros.
Very good post.

As of now, Halak is still the best player of that deal, but the Canadiens made a great deal.

As mentioned previously, kudos to Gauthier who had the stones to keep who he felt was the better goalie, especially after Halak's miraculous playoffs.

Without even mentioning the cap problems, Montréal has a better team with Price and Eller than with Price and Halak.

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