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Attendances after ~10 games [wrong ESPN figures / correct figures in OP]

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Old
10-31-2011, 04:52 PM
  #51
XO
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wow, had no idea Tampa Bay had that much so thats sweet. No doubt that Columbus would be that high if they only had a good team.

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10-31-2011, 04:53 PM
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SJSharks2010 View Post
Long Island, Ney York City and New Jersey are not all the same location.....

Phoenix being last in % capacity sold is the reason people can and will say Pheonix isn't a hockey town.
The Isles, Rangers, and Devils all play in the same market.

One thing about Phoenix is that at one point, they were averaging in the 14,000's. Not great, but certainly not remotely the worst ever.

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10-31-2011, 04:53 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Declassified View Post
Standing room isn't the answer. Edmonton Also offers standing room and their numbers are locked at 100.
That just means it's not the answer in Edmonton, because it is the answer for Pittsburgh. There are 18,387 seats at Consol Energy Center, and that's what is counted (just like there were 16,940 seats at the Igloo, but attendance was almost always 17,132 at the end). How many SRO slots there are I don't know, since the arena already added 300 seats in the off-season, but it seems to be around 200 SRO tickets, which aren't part of the 'seated capacity'. I'd venture to say that's the gold standard for most teams.

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10-31-2011, 04:54 PM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Korean Devil 23 View Post
The Isles, Rangers, and Devils all play in the same market.

One thing about Phoenix is that at one point, they were averaging in the 14,000's. Not great, but certainly not remotely the worst ever.
Not the same location. Something as simple as the arena's distance from the majority of the population makes a big difference. Same market, yes, same location, no.

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10-31-2011, 04:54 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doctor No View Post
Assuming that you're correct, that just means that it's not the answer in Edmonton. Different arenas count things differently.
Yes, and that's the answer to the question.


Empirical evidence (attendance numbers in the case) gathered in not uniform ways will make for averages that make no sense.

P.s I am correct, I've been in Standing room only "seats" for an Oiler game once.

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10-31-2011, 04:55 PM
  #56
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Do all arenas count attendance the same way? "Attendance" might have an objective meaning, but it's still subjectively counted. Am I wrong?

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10-31-2011, 04:57 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Declassified View Post
P.s I am correct, I've been in Standing room only "seats" for an Oiler game once.
I didn't mean to imply that you weren't. On the other hand, I didn't care enough about it to check.

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10-31-2011, 04:57 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by SJSharks2010 View Post
Not the same location. Something as simple as the arena's distance from the majority of the population makes a big difference. Same market, yes, same location, no.
Yea I wasn't disagreeing with you. And to add to your point, the Devils have to compete with the Flyers because much of Southern NJ is nothing but Philadelphia fans. In fact, the Philly influence outweighs the Long Island influence in NJ by a lot.

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10-31-2011, 04:58 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Korean Devil 23 View Post
Do all arenas count attendance the same way? "Attendance" might have an objective meaning, but it's still subjectively counted. Am I wrong?
I may be wrong, but I think all NHL teams go by tickets sold. MLB tends to be the same way (the Marlins had an announced attendance of something around 15,000 a couple years ago for one of their infamous 'there's 300 people there' games), while the NFL tends to be more on butts in the seats (hence why Green Bay and Pittsburgh, two places that have waiting lists going back ~40 years for tickets, are under 100%).

I don't think it's standardized, by any stretch, but once teams started switching to tickets sold and not just attendance in the building most teams started to follow suit. I know when I was younger the announced attendance at Penguins games was based by how many people were in the building. I don't have the foggiest of ideas as to when that changed, though. The Penguins also never counted comped tickets amongst those sold...there were a few occasions I was at games in 2002-03 and 03-04 where the number of people in the building definitely was higher than the announced attendance. For the record, in those two seasons I was usually there on comped tickets (my sister worked for the team...normally I wouldn't be able to get comped tickets, but if attendance wasn't expected to top 16k I would just be given random seats).


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10-31-2011, 04:58 PM
  #60
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I head a lot of crap from islander fans all summer long about how great their team is and how they are going to challenge for the division this year. Seems a lot of them didn't put their money where their mouth is and decided to still not show up for games.
Pittsburgh fan, Leaf fan, or Ranger fan?

The arena is a ****ing dump. I could go to nearly every game if I wanted, I haven't been since Opening Night -- which reminded me how much I hate our building.

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10-31-2011, 05:01 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by LetsGoIslanders View Post
Pittsburgh fan, Leaf fan, or Ranger fan?

The arena is a ****ing dump. I could go to nearly every game if I wanted, I haven't been since Opening Night -- which reminded me how much I hate our building.
Hey, Penguins fans know just how much the quality of a building can hurt attendance...that's not an argument we're too likely to bring up.

I was at a Penguins game at the Igloo where two fires started and the power went out...oh, what a building.

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10-31-2011, 05:14 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by smokinstampede View Post
That seems like a bit of a loose statement. Sure that happens, maybe in every market but I don't think it's some kind of a regional thing where people shell out money and use their purchase/product as if it were the thing to do. It most def doesn't happen in mass numbers.

The NHL is very protective of the Detroit Red Wings as a brand, read into that as you will.
From what i heard (and this is all hearsay) its rich people from the suburbs who buy season tickets and they dont like traveling to Detroit cause its literally falling apart is is just a dirty terrible crime ridden city. No offense to anyone cause im just saying what people say, ive never been there and it might be a perfectly nice place.

With that said i have heard lots of bad things about Detroit as a city so im inclined to believe it more then the NHL is lying about attendance to make the Wings look good. In fact wouldnt that be some sort of shareholder fraud and a serious crime? Doesnt seem likely they would if thats the case.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Declassified View Post
Yes, and that's the answer to the question.


Empirical evidence (attendance numbers in the case) gathered in not uniform ways will make for averages that make no sense.

P.s I am correct, I've been in Standing room only "seats" for an Oiler game once.
The logical answer here is the Oilers count standing room tickets as part of their capacity while other cities count the seats. It makes sense seeing as if you look at the attendance for the over 100% teams they are selling more tickets then have seats.

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10-31-2011, 05:15 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smokinstampede View Post
That seems like a bit of a loose statement. Sure that happens, maybe in every market but I don't think it's some kind of a regional thing where people shell out money and use their purchase/product as if it were the thing to do. It most def doesn't happen in mass numbers.

The NHL is very protective of the Detroit Red Wings as a brand, read into that as you will.
What the man above me said. The stands are full except the ice level seats. I'm from Detriot (live in Chicago now), and it's not pretty. But, it does have some nice areas outside the main city.


Last edited by Dynheart: 10-31-2011 at 05:59 PM.
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10-31-2011, 05:16 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Korean Devil 23 View Post
Do all arenas count attendance the same way? "Attendance" might have an objective meaning, but it's still subjectively counted. Am I wrong?
no, they don't use the same criteria in each city. there will always be fewer seats than tickets available. this is why concert, sporting, etc events can suddenly 'release' a few hundred/thousand more tickets even though the event is supposedly "sold out".

this works in the big-markets because they can always claim a sellout with standing room/special event seating/box suites/etc (box suites, for example, can count towards "20" attendance, depending on your city, even though there may only be 2 people in there).

it's all a part of the marketing. if you can "sell out" every game, it means demand is high. and if demand is high, you can defend higher ticket prices.

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10-31-2011, 05:19 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by PhXcoyotes View Post
Warning
Phoenix Rant
(Bad spelling also included in post)

Again, this proves that people can't say "Phoenix isn't a hockey town". Like I've said before if a buisness fails, you blaim the management and not the customers. Look at the three teams in the New York City area. NYR, NYI and NJ. NYR has 100$ attendance, because it is a well run team. NYI and NJ are not as well run, and have less attendance. If anyone wants to tell me that any of those three city's aren't "Hockey towns" you must be crazy.
The NYR aren't managed that well, but yes, a great hockey town.

NJ and NYI still get 2,000+ more fans than Phoenix, and are both struggling financially (apparently) and are struggling teams, both were hockey hot beds when they were competitive.

Phoenix has been competitive for a couple years, are managed pretty well, but they are not a hockey city in the slight.

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10-31-2011, 05:21 PM
  #66
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The ESPN attendance has been confirmed to be corrupt for this year, try NHL.com.

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10-31-2011, 05:23 PM
  #67
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Are those Buffalo numbers real? I'm shocked by that after the money they spent and the fact that they have a good team. I thought they were selling out every game!

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10-31-2011, 05:23 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by TheJay View Post
How does a team get over 100%? Do they hide in the rafters swinging from ropes to get to their seats?

I'm shocked at Dallas though.

And LOL at Winnipeg at being sold out every game and being ranked 23rd.
15000 seats paying good money is still more revenue than 18000 paying cheap American prices.

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10-31-2011, 05:24 PM
  #69
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My god people are posting questions that were answered 3 pages ago. We've also had this thread about 4 times now both in General and the Buisness forum, where all these questions have already been answered/addressed.


Last edited by Doctor No: 10-31-2011 at 05:28 PM. Reason: Flaming
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10-31-2011, 05:25 PM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawkaholic View Post
The NYR aren't managed that well, but yes, a great hockey town.

NJ and NYI still get 2,000+ more fans than Phoenix, and are both struggling financially (apparently) and are struggling teams, both were hockey hot beds when they were competitive.

Phoenix has been competitive for a couple years, are managed pretty well, but they are not a hockey city in the slight.
Phoenix also doesn't have an owner, look no further than Dallas to see how ownership issues affects attendance. They averaged 17,215 last year.

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Old
10-31-2011, 05:27 PM
  #71
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Originally Posted by NugentHopkinsfan View Post
Are those Buffalo numbers real?
No - they aren't.

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Old
10-31-2011, 05:29 PM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
Stars is a little bit misleading

They had a few games go head to head with Rangers games did they not?
Yes, which is why you can't get much useful out of attendance after 10 games. Too many variables in such a small sample of games.

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10-31-2011, 05:31 PM
  #73
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CBJ average is about 12,700~ not sure where ESPN gets their numbers

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Old
10-31-2011, 05:32 PM
  #74
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I'm really happy for Tampa bay. I watched a game down there a couple years ago and it was abour 2/3 full. Kind of disappointing because they have a sweet team.

But the fans were really enthusiastic. I talked to some residents after the game and they really loved their team and it's starting to show.

Makes me happy to see them filling up their stadium! Great fans.

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10-31-2011, 05:34 PM
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Korean Devil 23 View Post
What's irritating is that there aren't more sites that track attendance.
The Edmonton Journal posts attendance reported after every game in the sports sections for all the previous nights games.

If someone wants I could post them in a thread every once in a while.

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