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Old
11-01-2011, 11:29 AM
  #1
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Where is the progress?

In the 2009-2010 season the Isles finished 26Th in the league.
In the 2010-2011 season the Isles finished 27Th in the league.
Now this season they are at 28Th in the league. Just 3 points out of the basement.
These are not the results of a team that is progressing.

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11-01-2011, 11:46 AM
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Wedregast
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Originally Posted by Sammy2010 View Post
In the 2009-2010 season the Isles finished 26Th in the league.
In the 2010-2011 season the Isles finished 27Th in the league.
Now this season they are at 28Th in the league. Just 3 points out of the basement.
These are not the results of a team that is progressing.
Wow! the season ended really fast this year! Boston went from Stanley Cup champs to 29th place.

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11-01-2011, 11:51 AM
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And here is yet another of these threads....

Come on Moderators....can we just have one thread called the "Thread of Forboding Discontent and Malaise"

Or how about.... "Islander fans that hate the Islanders"

Its getting frustrating to see all of these threads choking the board when really — one will suffice.

I share in the frustration of the current record after 9 games — really. There are some difficulties and problems for the team, but Im not quitting the season after 9 games, nor a record of 3-4-2.

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11-01-2011, 12:10 PM
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We're under the assumption that there's supposed to be progress. That may not be the case. I wouldn't be shocked if the only goal of management is to keep costs to a bare minimum. It's tough to believe, through their actions, that they care if the team is competitive.

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11-01-2011, 12:13 PM
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KH1
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It's too early to write this season off.

But I don't know how management expected the team to progress, given that they completely failed to upgrade the roster over the offseason.

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11-01-2011, 12:14 PM
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We still have plenty of time to get a groove going, I'm not worried at all. Playing the Jets on Thursday should help, that will be a close game that we can win.

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11-01-2011, 12:21 PM
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People have to accept the fact that progress for this year was hinged on our youth coming of age. In reality, Bailey is terrible and Okposo hasn't contributed enough to make any sort of impact. Only JT is truly seeing a year-over-year improvment right now. Defense and goaltending have been surprisingly solid though and have actually stolen some points for us.

Granted its only been eight games, but if Bailey and Okposo don't become what we need them to, its another top five pick.

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11-01-2011, 12:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Wedregast View Post
Wow! the season ended really fast this year! Boston went from Stanley Cup champs to 29th place.
So you have no real answer. No surprise though.

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11-01-2011, 12:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richie Daggers Crime View Post
We're under the assumption that there's supposed to be progress. That may not be the case. I wouldn't be shocked if the only goal of management is to keep costs to a bare minimum. It's tough to believe, through their actions, that they care if the team is competitive.
Come on.....Thats a load of crap and you know it. The good money in this league is made in the playoffs. We Know it, Wang Knows it. There is no reason you can honestly convince me that that is not their goal. To keep beliveing otherwise is completly asinine and ridicules.

This is not towards anyone in particular but I am so sick and tired of this song and dance. If The Fans here just assume that its a big conspiracy theory...... quit or take a break because your foul weather fans are getting to be a bit much.

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11-01-2011, 12:35 PM
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Originally Posted by HyeDray View Post
And here is yet another of these threads....

Come on Moderators....can we just have one thread called the "Thread of Forboding Discontent and Malaise"

Or how about.... "Islander fans that hate the Islanders"

Its getting frustrating to see all of these threads choking the board when really — one will suffice.

I share in the frustration of the current record after 9 games — really. There are some difficulties and problems for the team, but Im not quitting the season after 9 games, nor a record of 3-4-2.
Please explain how pointing out their totals is hating the team.

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11-01-2011, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by KrisBeKreame View Post
Come on.....Thats a load of crap and you know it. The good money in this league is made in the playoffs. We Know it, Wang Knows it. There is no reason you can honestly convince me that that is not their goal. To keep beliveing otherwise is completly asinine and ridicules.

This is not towards anyone in particular but I am so sick and tired of this song and dance. If The Fans here just assume that its a big conspiracy theory...... quit or take a break because your foul weather fans are getting to be a bit much.
It is not a conspiracy. It does not seem that Wang has to put anymore money into the team than he has to. I have been a fan for over 30 years, and after 20 years of failure fans have the right to complain.

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11-01-2011, 12:51 PM
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Thank God these week long gaps between games don't last all season. It confuses too many people around here into thinking the season already ended!

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11-01-2011, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by xECK29x View Post
Thank God these week long gaps between games don't last all season. It confuses too many people around here into thinking the season already ended!
I never said the season is over. I am merely pointing out they have basically been stuck in the same position for a while now. They are also basically the same team as last year....

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11-01-2011, 01:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Sammy2010 View Post
Please explain how pointing out their totals is hating the team.
You and others are basing a 9 game sampling of the start of the season and a complete, and total lack of progress.

That is narrow, shortsighted and immature.

Sorry if that comes out as harsh.

9 games is not a reasonable scope of the season.

If that makes me an apologist sobeit.

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11-01-2011, 01:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KrisBeKreame View Post
Come on.....Thats a load of crap and you know it. The good money in this league is made in the playoffs. We Know it, Wang Knows it. There is no reason you can honestly convince me that that is not their goal. To keep beliveing otherwise is completly asinine and ridicules.
Good money is made in the playoffs, true. But, what's the difference in savings between having a minimum payroll (remember, he's not even paying to the cap floor when you consider the (unachievable) bonuses) and spending $12m more to ice a competitive team? Can you make that up just through playoff revenue? I doubt it. It don't think it's that ridiculous. Historically, owners looking to save money shave payroll down to a minimum. They don't spend in order to make playoff revenue.

It's has nothing to do with conspiracy. It's what owners have done in just about every sport ever since forever when they want to save money above all else.

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11-01-2011, 01:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Sammy2010 View Post
It is not a conspiracy. It does not seem that Wang has to put anymore money into the team than he has to. I have been a fan for over 30 years, and after 20 years of failure fans have the right to complain.
Sounds to me you are blaming 20 years of failure on Charles Wang and Garth Snow.

Tell me how the 1990s were either of those guys faults.

Could we at least agree that Milbury set the franchise back 10+ years with his moves?

Is it possible that when you start with zero it will take a number of seasons to move the chains forward?

Snow started this build in June 2008 by stockpiling draft picks.
Bailey may not be the best player of that draft, but Travis Hamonic looks pretty good. We then added Tavares in 2009. Nino is just getting here now from 2010, and Strome is still a year out.

The impact of the building from the draft is just starting to be felt — and players have yet to finish developing. JT is an exception. He is the #1 pick for a reason.

I guess my point is — progress should be counted from June 2008 — not 1995. That is not fair.

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11-01-2011, 01:09 PM
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Originally Posted by HyeDray View Post
Sounds to me you are blaming 20 years of failure on Charles Wang and Garth Snow.

Tell me how the 1990s were either of those guys faults.

Could we at least agree that Milbury set the franchise back 10+ years with his moves?

Is it possible that when you start with zero it will take a number of seasons to move the chains forward?

Snow started this build in June 2008 by stockpiling draft picks.
Bailey may not be the best player of that draft, but Travis Hamonic looks pretty good. We then added Tavares in 2009. Nino is just getting here now from 2010, and Strome is still a year out.

The impact of the building from the draft is just starting to be felt — and players have yet to finish developing. JT is an exception. He is the #1 pick for a reason.

I guess my point is — progress should be counted from June 2008 — not 1995. That is not fair.

Point out where I said anything about 1995. Once again where is the progress?

Don't count on Nino and Strome coming in and saving the day. They need to be surrounded with quality veteran support. Snow does not do that. He just throws them into the fire.

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11-01-2011, 01:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HyeDray View Post
Sounds to me you are blaming 20 years of failure on Charles Wang and Garth Snow.

Tell me how the 1990s were either of those guys faults.

Could we at least agree that Milbury set the franchise back 10+ years with his moves?

Is it possible that when you start with zero it will take a number of seasons to move the chains forward?

Snow started this build in June 2008 by stockpiling draft picks.
Bailey may not be the best player of that draft, but Travis Hamonic looks pretty good. We then added Tavares in 2009. Nino is just getting here now from 2010, and Strome is still a year out.

The impact of the building from the draft is just starting to be felt — and players have yet to finish developing. JT is an exception. He is the #1 pick for a reason.

I guess my point is — progress should be counted from June 2008 — not 1995. That is not fair.
Compare to Oilers, leafs, florida ...heck even sens.
I see some positives but it seems we are moving backwards and not forwards.

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11-01-2011, 02:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Sammy2010* View Post
It is not a conspiracy. It does not seem that Wang has to put anymore money into the team than he has to. I have been a fan for over 30 years, and after 20 years of failure fans have the right to complain.
Here's where you assigned blame to the wrong people.

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11-01-2011, 03:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Richie Daggers Crime View Post
Good money is made in the playoffs, true. But, what's the difference in savings between having a minimum payroll (remember, he's not even paying to the cap floor when you consider the (unachievable) bonuses) and spending $12m more to ice a competitive team? Can you make that up just through playoff revenue? I doubt it. It don't think it's that ridiculous. Historically, owners looking to save money shave payroll down to a minimum. They don't spend in order to make playoff revenue.

It's has nothing to do with conspiracy. It's what owners have done in just about every sport ever since forever when they want to save money above all else.
This.

But a good businessman (one whose partners aren't fearful in the showers) knows that playoffs means 10k fans turns to 15-16k reliably in time and that's 42 days where there are a few thousand more fans coming. That's, say, $50 avg per seat (arbitrary #) X 4,000 X 42 games (which is not plausible but possible) meaning $12M invested gets you playoff revenue of 16,234 X $50 (arbitrary #of roughly $800k PER GAME) PLUS extra season revenue of $9.6M.

Now add parking, concessions and increased advertising......

But it's more work. More expectations. Happier fanbase, though.

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11-01-2011, 03:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Sammy2010* View Post
Now this season they are at 28Th in the league. Just 3 points out of the basement.
On the other side of this there is 5 points.. FIVE POINTS.. separating them from being in the top ten in the league and 4 points out of a playoff spot. All that while only having played 9 games while some teams have played 11 and the Penguins have played 13..

Holy crap give it a break with the sky is falling on this season it is so god damn early people, if by December this team is in no better position and is drastically out of a playoff spot I'll be right there with you ripping them apart but to be so down on a team so early is flat out ridiculous.

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11-01-2011, 04:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Sammy2010* View Post
In the 2009-2010 season the Isles finished 26Th in the league.
In the 2010-2011 season the Isles finished 27Th in the league.
Now this season they are at 28Th in the league. Just 3 points out of the basement.
These are not the results of a team that is progressing.
Hey look, it's Mike Milbury with another thread. Or is it John Ferguson Jr? I can't tell.

We're 10 games in and there's been no progress. These 21 yr old players are taking way too long to develop. Time to act. Lets trade Tavares, Baily, Okposo and some picks for Lecavalier, Roloson and Malone. That should surely shake things up.

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11-01-2011, 06:53 PM
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If there is no progress made its not for a lack of trying, you guys have made several efforts to sign big name free agents to huge contracts and have a hard time convincing anyone to come to the island and it will be that way until you have a solid home.

You cant blame Wang you cant blame Snow, you cant even blame milbury anymore. Until you have a home there is only your draft picks and stuff off the scrap heap...

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11-01-2011, 07:27 PM
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If there is no progress made its not for a lack of trying, you guys have made several efforts to sign big name free agents to huge contracts and have a hard time convincing anyone to come to the island and it will be that way until you have a solid home.

You cant blame Wang you cant blame Snow, you cant even blame milbury anymore. Until you have a home there is only your draft picks and stuff off the scrap heap...
Sure you can blame management. The buck stops with them.
They have gone about signing the wrong players and coaches for the team.
They don't spend to cap limit (and given their financial situation I understand why).
They hamper the team with a damaging contracts like Dipietro.
They bottom fish cheap talent and scour waiver wires for talent which sometimes work (but they have not successfully secured expensive elite UFA talent). Grabner is a success and Nabby is adequate but he is not the solution we need in net.

Basically this management is trying to duct tape together a cheap team that plays reasonable and now things are falling apart.

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11-01-2011, 07:40 PM
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frankthefrowner
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Sure you can blame management. The buck stops with them.
They have gone about signing the wrong players and coaches for the team.
They don't spend to cap limit (and given their financial situation I understand why).
They hamper the team with a damaging contracts like Dipietro.
They bottom fish cheap talent and scour waiver wires for talent which sometimes work (but they have not successfully secured expensive elite UFA talent). Grabner is a success and Nabby is adequate but he is not the solution we need in net.

Basically this management is trying to duct tape together a cheap team that plays reasonable and now things are falling apart.
They bottom feed on cheap talent out of need. They cant get anyone worth a damn to sign. Every year they throw a big contract or 2 out there and get turned down. This year it was Ehrhoff and by all accounts they sent the brinks truck to his house and he said now.

The Islanders cant possibly spend up to the cap even if they wanted to... no one will sign. If it wasnt for DP's contract they might not be at the cap floor.

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